Maneuvering On The Ground With Differential Braking

[Skyspin]

No taxing improvement after today's update. The Spitfire, the Mustang, the P-47, and even the Mosquito all taxi fine but cannot keep the Corsair under control, especially on an airfield with a crosswind component. On the carrier deck with 30 knots of relative wind there's no problem making small adjustments for a straight launch but on a land airfield it's almost impossible to maneuver like the above mentioned aircraft.

[GeoS72]

@Skyspin,

Confirmed. I just tested the diff braking effect. It's still broken. There was no mention of it in the change log. I wanted to see if the problem was secretly solved. That is a resounding "NO."

Can we get a few more Corsair flyers to chime in, please? We need to squeak more loudly to get some grease.

[Firebugs]

It seemed to be different to me.  If you go full rudder you can sometimes do quick pivot turns. 

 

However... I agree it does not behave like any of the other warbirds.  Locking up one side without rudder input still locks the whole thing up to a stop and it requires quite a bit of thrust (to the point of almost prop striking or tail bouncing) to get it to start turning. 

[OmasRachE]

After the update yesterday I wanted to sit in the Corsair after a quite some time again and it was impossible for me to taxi to the runway in that Mission where you have to transfer two corairs from Nellis. In no way this behavior can be acurate. First I thougt, I would be doing something terribly wrong but after checking this thread I´m glad to hear that I´m not the problem. 

But when I think twice it would be easier to avoid a mistake than dealing with a broken module. Quite dissapointing. Is it confirmed by M3 that it is a bug and they are working on it?

[JupiterJoe]

The aircraft is damaged (including the tail wheel) when you spawn in.  Ask the ground crew to repair and you'll see the '170 secs' pop up.  Once that's done, ask them to repair again and you'll find the aircraft is stuck in a continual damaged state, therefore you cannot taxi properly:

There has been no response from the Devs on my thread, so not sure they're aware.

-Rudel- has recently mentioned the Corsair has a unique damage model that is still in testing, so until this is completed I guess the Corsair remains broken: 

I think this is the number one issue with the Corsair right now.

Edited yesterday at 12:57 PM by JupiterJoe

[OmasRachE]

Seems kind of a critical bug. Would be nice to get a reaction from the devs to show they are aware of it.

[Doughguy]

Ok. What i found is that WIND plays a huge role, even like 3 m/s.

If you create a vanilla mission, no wind etc. you can swing her around easily.
Unlock the tailwheel, full left rudder(or right as you wish), step on left brake, apply full power (not to enter water).
She´ll start to yaw. After you gave a good jolt, immediatelly throttle back or youll get the nose over.
You can work out a sweet spot for it.

However, if you add wind to it, it turns impossible.
Once you hit 90 deg towards the wind she will act as a huge airbrake and you cannot continue to turn in the same direction.
You can in the other direction tho.

For carrier operations you need wind!

How is this supposed to work?

I can attach a track.

Edited yesterday at 04:32 PM by Doughguy

[Doughguy]

Works like a charm w/o wind and a static carrier. But once its moving and /or has wind over the deck, you cant get past 90deg.

corsair taxis no wind.trk corsair taxis speedy carrier and wind.trk corsair taxis speedy carrier no wind.trk

[LeCuvier]

I have tried the ground steering/differential braking again, and I'm totally happy.
Version: 2.9.19,13478 MT
Terrain: Caucasus on runway (not carrier)
Air base: Kutaisi
Controls bindings:
- Rudder pedals to axis "Rudder"
- Gear Brakes left and right to axes "Gear brake left" & "Gear brake right"
1. No wind
Observations:
1.1 Taxying, Steering without Gear Brakes (Tail Wheel" unlocked):
Without touching the brakes, I can steer her gently left and right, feels a bit like in the Mustang. I suspect that's the effect of the propeller air stream hitting the rudder.
1.2 Sharp turns:
I combine pedals with gentle differential braking. This works very nicely. I love it. Compared with other warbirds it's a piece of cake. So far, but...

2.1 Wind 5 m/s from 0 Deg (North): Quite manageable
2.2 Wind 10m/s from 0 Deg: Becoming unmanageable. She wants to turn into the wind
2.3 Wind 20 m/s from 0 DEG: Totally unmanageable. I think she wants to turn into the wind, like a big weather vane. Looks like the wind effect on the rudder is overdone.

Edit:
Takeoff and landing from Kutaisi was real fun with wind at 10 m/s from 0 DEG as the runway is roughly East-West. 
Takeoff seemed manageable going to high speed quickly. But the landing approach (from the East) was in crabbing mode and I was really surprised I didn't kill myself. However, taxying to parking position involved a right turn and that was impossible.
I have never tried aircraft carrier but that should be a bit easier as the boat will turn into the wind for takeoff and landing.

Edited yesterday at 05:53 PM by LeCuvier

[Doughguy]

I set 3 m/s wind on the ground and couldnt turn. youd had to move forward and the violently swing her.
You cant do that on a carrier.
Plus, youd burn out your engine pretty fast pushing the throttle that way forward.

[GTFreeFlyer]

Turning with wind should always be more difficult than without, but this won’t really work for us in DCS on the carrier because we don’t have ground crew running around to move our planes for us like they did back in the day.  It was a great idea to add this in for realism, and realism is something this entire community wants, but I think (myself included) I’m backpedaling on that idea now.  
 

Compromises will need to be made for sure.  Maybe some keybindings to translate the airplane left-right only when on the carrier could be a solution?  Not very realistic, but it would simulate ground crew helping us get in position for takeoff.  On the Super Carrier, we just have to get close enough to the catapult, and ground crew will shift the plane left or right as needed for proper lineup. So, something like WASD keys to move the plane around on deck might, or might not be a good idea.  Hopefully we’ll have a super Essex one day as well.  

In the screenshot from an old video below, I counted almost a dozen guys man-handling the plane.  We don’t have this… yet.  I want it, we all want it, and when it comes out I know I’ll be among the first to say my frame rate sucks with a dozen crew running around, and why did they have to add them, lol.  I haven’t seen videos of Corsairs taxiing around a deck like we do in DCS, but it’s something we have to do for now, and the realism of weathervaning isn’t mixing well with the sim-isms we encounter in our chairs at home.  
 

It’s all about compromises that need to be made, and part of the learning process and feedback cycle of early access modules, between the devs and us, the community.  It’s such a great plane, and I look forward to the future when things are even more ironed out.  Keep up the great work M3!
 

[GeoS72]

Gents,

Raising the tail does not require additional wind on deck. Increasing throttle above 30 PSI of manifold pressure raises the tail off the ground. This is covered in one of the Training Missions for the Corsair. When the tail comes off the ground, you can release 1 brake pedal and the plane will pivot on the held brake. It is VERY precarious because you can easily nose over.

I wish to reiterate: If you have to go full throttle, stand on 1 brake, and add rudder (rudder yields no result, btw) just to make a sharp turn in the Corsair, then something is flat-out wrong!

[-Rudel-]

6 hours ago, GTFreeFlyer said:

Turning with wind should always be more difficult than without, ...Compromises will need to be made for sure... ...It’s all about compromises that need to be made, and part of the learning process and feedback cycle of early access modules, between the devs and us, the community.

 

This....we can't please every user.  Not possible.

It doesn't help that we can't use ED's new suspension system too.

[Doughguy]

6 hours ago, GeoS72 said:

Gents,

Raising the tail does not require additional wind on deck. Increasing throttle above 30 PSI of manifold pressure raises the tail off the ground. This is covered in one of the Training Missions for the Corsair. When the tail comes off the ground, you can release 1 brake pedal and the plane will pivot on the held brake. It is VERY precarious because you can easily nose over.

I wish to reiterate: If you have to go full throttle, stand on 1 brake, and add rudder (rudder yields no result, btw) just to make a sharp turn in the Corsair, then something is flat-out wrong!

See my tracls above. Its differenr with and without wind.

Without doing as you say works. As with any other warbird.

With wind you cant really get past 90 degrees and can only turn into the wind. No matter which way you actually want to turn.

1 hour ago, -Rudel- said:

This....we can't please every user.  Not possible.

It doesn't help that we can't use ED's new suspension system too.

So we wont be able to turn once wind is involved?

[JupiterJoe]

In my opinion your points are moot, because the tail wheel is damaged from the moment you spawn in (ask the ground crew to do a repair as soon as you spawn in. The '170 secs' will pop up, which only happens if something's damaged.  When they're finished the aircraft will misalign with the ground and cause the tail wheel to break again). 

We cannot accurately judge its functionality in this state. 

Personally I think the tail wheel should castor freely when unlocked and when locked be limited to the 40 odd degree limit we're currently seeing for unlocked.

Edited 5 hours ago by JupiterJoe

[GeoS72]

12 hours ago, -Rudel- said:

This....we can't please every user.  Not possible.

It doesn't help that we can't use ED's new suspension system too.

@-Rudel-, have you independently confirmed this bug exists, besides reading this thread? Making sharp turns in the Corsair is not possible in its current state. Do you require more information or data? Are you suggesting that the users are SOL ("Still" Out of Luck) for differential braking?

[GeoS72]

@JupiterJoe, @Doughguy, & @-Rudel-

Here are my tests in an F4U and P-47 with diff braking. See relevant track & MIZ files.

These conditions are confirmed:
1. Damage to Corsair at initial spawn.
2. Corsair "slams" on deck after repair - potentially damaging tail wheel; no notice for sustained damage.
3. Poor turn radius with tail wheel unlocked (before and after repair).
4. Sharp turns in Corsair under 0 wind conditions by increasing engine to takeoff speed. Tail lifts off deck and diff braking is achieved.
5. Demonstrated the dangers of diff braking with high engine power & tail off deck in the Corsair.
6. Corsair track file with repair has accelerated time after initiating the repair cycle.
7. P-47 repair cycle NOT triggered at spawn point.
8. P-47 can perform sharp turns when engine near takeoff power. Tail lifts off deck & diff braking achieved with tail wheel locked.
9. External views yielded a visual difference between Corsair & P-47 tail wheel caster effects. Corsair shows limited, approx (+/-) 20 deg caster; P-47 tail wheel showed 90 deg caster.

Conclusion:
F4U-1D Corsair tail wheel model appears to be damaged at spawn and/or aircraft has too much weight on the tail wheel to prevent full caster.

@JupiterJoe, I never put a lot of thought behind the repair cycle for aircraft. Thanks for sharing that pearl of wisdom!

2025-08-16 F4U Turn Rate-No Wind.trk 2025-08-16 F4U Turn Rate-No Wind-Repair.trk 2025-08-16 P47 Turn Rate-No Wind-Repair.trk Corsair-Turn Test-No Wind.miz

[GeoS72]

Addendum:

What is the best course of action?

The hacks that some presented are user workarounds to a problem. That easily has negative consequences when attempting to taxi a Corsair ashore or afloat. Taxiing under high engine RPM to lift the tail wheel is NOT recommended. It can spell disaster when completing a single-player campaign, multi-player mission, or other evolution.

[Doughguy]

34 minutes ago, GeoS72 said:

Addendum:

What is the best course of action?

The hacks that some presented are user workarounds to a problem. That easily has negative consequences when attempting to taxi a Corsair ashore or afloat. Taxiing under high engine RPM to lift the tail wheel is NOT recommended. It can spell disaster when completing a single-player campaign, multi-player mission, or other evolution.

Well it works for me on spawn. No problems. You have to give it a good jolt and reduce throttle again. Then you can keep doing donuts.
Slamming it full throttle isnt really necessary.
Just step on the brakes and make sure tailwheel is unlocked.
The moment you move forward with both tires it wont work anymore.

 

It doesnt work with winds involved.

Edited 3 hours ago by Doughguy

[Skyspin]

Plain and simple it doesn't work right. Certainly wasn't this way in "real life".. Basically there's always going to be some crosswind if not straight down a runway then blowing some cross ways from the parking spot on an airfield. If it was this bad in real life then the plane would not have been test flown from the start until it could taxi like any other plane.

[AG-51_Razor]

Although this problem is made worse by a wind over the deck or cross wind, that is totally moot as the problem still exists with no wind at all, sitting on a ramp at Nellis AFB on the NTTR map. The plane should be able to turn (with the tail wheel unlocked obviously) about the axis of the inside main landing gear with little more than the power required to taxi. It doesn't. In fact, it merely comes to a stop. This behavior is not realistic, not correct and very annoying. I really hope that M3 is able to fix this issue and I doubt very seriously that it has anything whatsoever to do with ED's new suspension system. The P-51 and the Jug have been able to do this since the first day they appeared in the game - years before "the new suspension" was adopted. The only progress towards solving this problem that I have seen is @Rudel posting on this thread acknowledging that it even exists. At least that is a start.

[GeoS72]

Gents,

Thanks to @-Rudel- for posting this link to their priority list of items to address. This is a cross-link from @Saxman's thread about Gun Convergence adjustments.

Gun Convergence Adjustments-Dev Priority List Post