Campaign: Georgian Havoc

[igormk]

The fog looks so thick from above as to be surreal...

...Of course, I don't live in a very foggy climate, perhaps these conditions are normal for some regions in the world, and if that's the case then I retract the comment

 

Here is something like that in the mission, I think. Very familiar view for some regions in the world.

 

 

[igormk]

Georgian Havoc mission “2.3 Going In!”

Enemy forces suddenly appear along the road where my wingman was searching for targets seconds ago! Now when looking at this mission in tacview it is truly made this way! Hallo! Please can you try to make the missions a bit more like natural? IMO this is NOT the way to make missions! If you make missions for singleplayer try to keep some realism in missions regarding to where and when the enemy appears please. I’m done with Georgian Havoc I think

 

Totaly agree. Spawning vehicles out of nowhere only when the player's heli is near is absolute crap.

 

Oooohhhhh!!! You guys are making my “DCS life” very complicated!!! :D

 

But OK, you will get enemy vehicles that are visible from the beginning, but hidden in the vegetation, or behind building so you don’t’ see them again… At least I will try.

 

But then don’t come here weeping how you have 5 FPS… ;)

[igormk]

Yup, I didn't get far; F-15s got me after one minute or so. With full speed I guess I could have avoided them.

OK. I also recommend you to stay extremely low! I didn’t try this, but landing on safe location and wait for them to pass (but how will you know when is that) could also work.

 

 

A dilema, because if you spawn them before, even a blind man would see them and destroy them right away. Is it possible to spawn them all behind some buildings and make them move into position as the convoy approaches? I'm a bit concerned if FPS would drop when moving all those troops in position, but can you consider this suggestion?

 

 

This is exactly what I will try to do. It will definitely look better, but we will see how FPS will react to that.

 

Regarding to where would the best position be to escort the convoy, it is a good question. In normal environment, it is best for escort to be in front of the convoy and to scan the area and potential hot spots, but urban area is much more complicated. Convoy can be attacked from all directions, including from the behind, and it is very difficult to spot the enemy prior to his attack. Then it would be best for a pair of helicopters that the leader is a bit in front of the convoy, scouting the area, and wingmen behind him, on an appropriate distance so he can cover the leader in case of AAA or SAM launch. They can circle and switch the roles. But since AI wingman can’t do that, in urban areas I recommend to be some 1,5-2km behind the convoy, what would give you good view of the zone around your convoy, and give you enough time and distance to best employ mostly all of your weapons.

 

I will play the rest of the missions :P

OK. :)

[HiJack]

Oooohhhhh!!! You guys are making my “DCS life” very complicated!!! :D

 

But OK, you will get enemy vehicles that are visible from the beginning, but hidden in the vegetation, or behind building so you don’t’ see them again… At least I will try.

 

But then don’t come here weeping how you have 5 FPS… ;)

 

I'm so sorry :P I don't think you have to do this with all objects but hide some of them among the trees and make the rest spawn in a timly fashion, not all at once. Give us some time to try to discover the ones you hide emong vegetation and start killing them. Maybe a trigger on one of them to spawn the rest :detective:

[Sabre-TLA]

First, thank you igormk for making an immersive campaign. The voice acting was top notch imho and I like the differences in the missions.

I have to agree with the comments about mission 4. It took me about 8 attempts to successfully get airborne (I kept getting killed before or just after takeoff). I see you have updated the mission so I'll give the new one a try now.

 

Just wondering if anyone had illumination issues with mission 5. I flew to the IP saw the flares drop but never got enough illumination to see the targets with either the Shkval or NVGs. Could it be a graphics card problem? I have a new GTX 275 with 2gb ram. Everything else looks good but the illumination on the ground was missing. I could see the flares floating down but no light on the ground to spot the units. I do have some mods installed so I'll try it again with all mods removed. Just curious if others have had the same problem.

 

Update: Tried it again with all mods removed. I checked the graphics.cfg and don't see any obvious changes that would effect it. Funny but I get good ground illumination from flares in LOMAC. I'll try and get some screenshots.www

 

Update#2: Installed latest 196.21 drivers and set my landsunfactor back to .7 in graphics.cfg and that seems to have fixed it. Thanks slug88. Rep inbound.

 

Thanks.

Edited February 14, 2010 by Sabre-TLA
More info added.

[slug88]

Sabre, I didn't have that problem. Have you done any .cfg file tweaking in BS? A couple of the settings will affect ground and object illumination.

[Lucas_From_Hell]

I'm stuck in that mission you have to defend the northern attack.

 

I know it's not your fault, but those stupid Vikhrs are totally useless! Every single missile falls short from the target. I shoot and they fall just under the tanks, wasting too many precious missiles and making me RTB earlier to rearm.

 

Is there any tactic to make them more effective? It's highly frustrating to fire 4 Vikhrs to score one hit at a tank... :(

 

Still, I'm loving the campaign, really good job, but those Vikhrs don't help.

Edited February 14, 2010 by Lucas_From_Hell

[159th_Viper]

I'm stuck in that mission you have to defend the northern attack.

 

I know it's not your fault, but those stupid Vikhrs are totally useless! Every single missile falls short from the target. I shoot and they fall just under the tanks, wasting too many precious missiles and making me RTB earlier to rearm.

 

Is there any tactic to make them more effective? It's highly frustrating to fire 4 Vikhrs to score one hit at a tank... :(

 

Still, I'm loving the campaign, really good job, but those Vikhrs don't help.

 

Post a Track of that Mission - No way the Vikhrs should be behaving that way. Will take Control and attempt to replicate to see if the problem is other than Mission-Related.

[graywo1fg]

Try staying at a farther range in order to let the vikkr have time to straiten out more. the only time my vikkr ever misses is if i'm too close or i'm sidestepping to much and the vikkr can not find the laser since it is a "beam riding missile" and doenst just have a seeker on the nose, it has the seeker in the tail. the vikkr is much like a zip line :P

[Lucas_From_Hell]

Viper, I know it isn't mission-related.

 

I go, set it on auto-hover, wait until the Ka-50 is perfectly steady, uncage Shkval, aim on the tank, hold trim to line Vikhr with target (considering it's a moving column), hold the trigger and wait patiently.

 

I can try to get a track (last one isn't really good because I rushed and after seeing 2 Vikhrs miss I got pissed off and quit it immediatly), however :)

[159th_Viper]

Aye - would have to see a Track. Dependant on altitude, usually advisable to Lock the Turret. Range also an important factor. Movement of Convoy and Relative Speed/Angle of Engagement will also depend on where you stabilize the Target Marker, ie Lead the Target a wee fraction.

[igormk]

I'm stuck in that mission you have to defend the northern attack.

 

I know it's not your fault, but those stupid Vikhrs are totally useless! Every single missile falls short from the target. I shoot and they fall just under the tanks, wasting too many precious missiles and making me RTB earlier to rearm.

 

Is there any tactic to make them more effective? It's highly frustrating to fire 4 Vikhrs to score one hit at a tank... :(

 

Still, I'm loving the campaign, really good job, but those Vikhrs don't help.

 

Lucas, did you turn on the “Moving Ground Target Mode”?

 

 

From my experience Vikhrs shouldn’t be so ineffective.

[Lucas_From_Hell]

Yes, Igor.

 

Actually, I just completed it trying to record Viper's track (collector's edition of "How not to fly an attack helicopter - Vol. III - Fast-Forward, Trim and Altitute", limited edition). This time, Vikhr did quite well - with 2 or 3 falling short, still (plus one I screwed up because the tank hid behind a power-line and I lost lock).

 

Quite an eventful mission, with total disrespect with Voskhod instructions (so to say, I crossed the river once or twice, distracted with the targets), total disrespect to the manual (I wouldn't even call those two landings "landings", plus, while rushing to rearm, I landed directly on Kutaisi parking area, and almost ran over a mechanic while he was reloading the helicopter), overspeeding while at 3 meters high (2 meters sometimes) and under power-lines, misunderstoods with the wingman (so to say, he went for a hidden Strela instead of the convoy's Shilka when I told him to go for air defences - he got a hail of bullets from the latter, but kept on), overwhelming rocket aiming from the wingman (bonus: me trying to hit targets with short burst mode, then remembering I could switch - a single BMP got over 20 rockets after that) and a amazing performance from my joystick's deadzones when trying to hover.

 

Someone is probably wondering "Who gave this fighter cowboy the keys for the Ka-50?!", but it's too late now :music_whistling:

 

Before anyone asks: no, I didn't RTFM properly :D

 

And thanks to the Georgian Havoc team for this marvelous campaign :thumbup:

_LastMissionTrack.trk

[igormk]

Actually, I just completed it trying to record Viper's track (collector's edition of "How not to fly an attack helicopter - Vol. III - Fast-Forward, Trim and Altitute", limited edition). This time, Vikhr did quite well - with 2 or 3 falling short, still (plus one I screwed up because the tank hid behind a power-line and I lost lock).

 

Quite an eventful mission, with total disrespect with Voskhod instructions (so to say, I crossed the river once or twice, distracted with the targets), total disrespect to the manual (I wouldn't even call those two landings "landings", plus, while rushing to rearm, I landed directly on Kutaisi parking area, and almost ran over a mechanic while he was reloading the helicopter), overspeeding while at 3 meters high (2 meters sometimes) and under power-lines, misunderstoods with the wingman (so to say, he went for a hidden Strela instead of the convoy's Shilka when I told him to go for air defences - he got a hail of bullets from the latter, but kept on), overwhelming rocket aiming from the wingman (bonus: me trying to hit targets with short burst mode, then remembering I could switch - a single BMP got over 20 rockets after that) and a amazing performance from my joystick's deadzones when trying to hover.

 

Someone is probably wondering "Who gave this fighter cowboy the keys for the Ka-50?!", but it's too late now :music_whistling:

 

Before anyone asks: no, I didn't RTFM properly :D

 

:lol: :megalol: :lol: :megalol:

[slug88]

Well, I've just returned from about a seven week long forced hiatus from Black Shark, and I've just completed the second to last mission. I very much hope that this project is still alive, because as good as it is already, I believe it's potential is higher still!

 

So, here are my comments on the mission. As usual, stop reading unless you've played already, as spoilers follow!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

1. Overall I liked this mission. Not too complicated, not really difficult at all, but good atmosphere, good set up, and decent execution.

 

2. I don't know if this is realistic or not, but I think it would be nice if the flight leader called out speed, heading, and altitude for each leg of the journey, like in mission 1 of Deployment. This goes for every other mission where you're following someone else. Not a huge deal, however.

 

3. I think Voskhod's dialog is again overly explanatory, and takes away from the immersion of the mission. Especially the line that goes something like "It will be a huge impact on Georgian military structure if this target is destroyed," etc. Having read Ed Macy's Apache, the concept of this mission does seem very realistic, and in fact Ed Macy describes a scenario exactly like this, where he is tasked in the air to take out a high value target that's been identified by intelligence. But, as I recall of Ed Macy's account, his new orders were very short and to the point, and he was left very much in the dark as to the specific nature of the new target(s). In this mission, however, ground control does much more than that, even going into a needless statement about the importance of the target to the war effort. So, in short, my suggestion is that the Voskhod dialog should be shortened so that all you know is that you're being tasked to a new high value target that's taking priority over the current mission. In fact you could even add a little mystery by hinting at high-level intelligence ops, without ever confirming it (in Ed Macy's account, he speculated about CIA involvement in his mission, and it added a fun sense of spookiness to it all).

 

4. I really enjoyed the flight leader's (200) dialog, and was a bit sad that it stopped as soon as my element was retasked! I was hoping to get to hear him calling out targets and interacting with the other helicopters. It's hard to state how much this would raise immersion. I know it's a huge effort to record new dialog and add it, but I really like the idea behind this mission, and I think it deserves this special treatment :D.

 

Also, I ran into an issue with the sim during this mission, which you can read about here: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=51274

Edited March 26, 2010 by slug88

[igormk]

Hey slug88, long time no hear!!! :)

 

I was also away for couple of weeks, so sorry for the late reply. Thank you once again for your detailed comments on the campaign. The project “Georgian Havoc v1.1” is very much alive, of course. It is just that while waiting for feedback on last couple of missions, I decided to take a rest from mission editing, so I switched to another project. It is 1:500000 printable Tactical Chart, you can find it here:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=50869

 

and here another thing connected to it: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=51163

 

It turned out to maybe something bigger, so now my priorities are on this project.

 

After I finish it (and hopefully get more feedback on the last mission), I will get back and finish v1.1.

 

 

Regarding to your last spoilers:

 

1. Yes, if you know how to operate Ka-50 nav and targeting systems. :D

2. Usually when on combat mission, you want to keep frequencies clear as much as possible. You would also be in combat spread, and not in close formation, so announcing every move is not essential.

3. Hmmmm, good point, I will try to manage that!

4. Realistically, if you are tasked to another mission, you would probably get new working frequency. I know it is immersive to have a lot of comms in the background, and maybe it should be solved in another way. I will think about that.

Thank you once again for your patience spent on finding spoilers of this campaign! Looking forward to hear more from you!!! :thumbup:

 

Salute!

[slug88]

Yes, I saw the other posts concerning the map you're making. A big congratulations, not only is the map looking to be a masterpiece, but it's being printed and published by TFC as well! That's a pretty spectacular result, and one that was earned through much hard work I'm sure. (BTW, I plan to purchase it when it's available :D). I'm also glad that v1.1 of this campaign is still in your plans.

 

So I went for another flight in the Ka-50 tonight, attempting the final mission of v1.0, after spending the last few weeks with LOFC2. Unfortunately, I returned without much feedback, because I lost one of my engines due to vibration right as I got to the BP, after about 20 minutes of flying! I guess I must have sucked up too much dust on the way there. A little odd, since I flew at about 50m RAlt and 250+ kph the whole way, but sometimes luck isn't on your side I guess. It was still pretty exciting, however, since that's the first time I've ever encountered engine vibration, and it was fun trying to get the bird back to base. I managed to limp back to within 5km on the remaining engine, but unfortunately, in a moment where my attention was focused inside the cockpit, I struck some powerlines with the fuselage. Thankfully the rotors were still intact, and in fact I didn't see any visible damage from the strike, but I lost too much airspeed by flying through the lines and was forced to perform a soft landing in a dirt field. Didn't fire a single weapon nor see a single enemy, but an exhilarating experience nevertheless! I'll try again and hopefully return with some real feedback soon.

Edited April 13, 2010 by slug88

[slug88]

Alright, so I gave the epic last mission a couple more go's, and here are my comments:

 

1. This is the first mission I've played so far that has been unplayable due to low FPS at my normal settings. Now don't read too much into this, because my machine is quite old:

 

E6750 @ 3.2GhZ, 4gb ram, 8800GT 320mb, W7 64bit

 

And normally I play with everything except shadows on high, water normal. Sometimes I get down into the low 20's, mostly around busy airbases, but once the battle started in this mission I was crawling in the single digits. However, when I tried again with View Distance set to Medium, everything was very very smooth and playable again, so I was happy. So, this isn't really a complaint or a request to change anything, but just letting you know that my computer struggled on this mission :D.

 

2. The Battle Position provided, WP3, is rather suicidal. The one time I actually went there I got shot down by an Sa-8 from the airfield several km to the south if memory serves me right. Next time, I tried to hug the terrain better and use the hill to shield myself from the airbase, but I got hit by multiple manpads launched from Batumi. I finally found that a position 0.5km north of the indicated BP works rather well, on my last playthrough I recieved no incoming fire during my playthrough (except from the A-10's later on, but I'll get to that :D). So, I recommend moving WP3 half a click north, so that the player doesn't have to learn the hard way not to trust his orders :D.

 

3. In one playthrough I got yelled at for leaving the battle position, even though I was still in the cover of the mountain and overwatching Batumi. I think the radius for that trigger zone should be a bit bigger, maybe 1km?

 

4. I noticed that there's a missing voiceover, when Buran tells flight 197 to go home there's only text, no voice.

 

5. In my last, most succesful playthrough, all four Su-25t's were shot down on their first pass over the city; three to ZSU-23 emplacements (which I quickly revenged to the best of my ability), and one to a manpad. Though it's really cool to see the Su's sweep in low over the battle, it's not as cool to see the whole flight shot down five second later, especially given that these are the precious T variants that have good standoff capability. If they were Su-25A's, I wouldn't mind seeing them beat up after a low pass like that, but when I see the T's do it I just feel it's silly that they're flying so low and directly over the battlefield, and whichever commander planned that attack I expect would be immediately dismissed.

 

6. I think the Su-34's should go in first, maybe have their own activation word, that way I wouldn't have been shot down by that Gecko from the southern airfield in one of my earlier playthroughs :D! Also, in my last playthrough, one of them was killed by a manpad. Again, isn't there something really wrong with the mission plan if a Su-34 is downed by a manpad? With their standoff range they should by flying way higher, shouldn't they? And if they're flying low to look cool and impress the heli jocks, it's a bad idea because I haven't spotted them once in this mission, except for when they take off at Senaki :).

 

7. The ground battle was really cool, pretty exciting to see all that armor rolling down the streets and kicking ass. Good job there.

 

8. The A-10's were also very cool. On my most recent, most succesful playthrough, I had a very awesome moment. I spotted the Warthogs flying in from the south, but unlike most times where they fly over the city, this time they were headed directly towards me! Thinking I was already a dead man, I didn't even bother going defensive, and tried instead to take one down with me. So I got them in my Shkval, locked them up in AA mode, and opened with the cannon. Just as I did this, I saw their GAU-8's come to life , streaming smoke, and reached for the eject handle. I was spared, however, as the rounds passed by me and I heard an explosion to my left; they had destroyed my wingman! I felt sorry for the poor guy and started bugging out, not even waiting for the order from Buran because I knew some F-15's would be coming shortly. Anyway, after the mission I found that some of my 30mm rounds actually found their target and damaged one of the A-10's! Feels good to give them a little taste of their own medicine :D.

 

9. Three times now I've been shot down by an F-15 while trying to RTB. The first time was definately due to a poor choice on my part, since I flew directly over the sea, taking the straightest path back to Senaki. The second two times, however, I was using terrain masking to the very best of my ability and managed to make it quite far, but still was downed. Buran needs to scramble some MiG-29's or something!

 

10. I liked the intermittent static over the radio, I assume it's meant to represent US jamming? Gave me a feeling of helplessness and doom, maybe a small hint of what many RL pilots felt when going up against the US in modern conflicts.

 

So, that's about it. To summarize the changes I would recommend, move WP3 0.5km North, replace the 25T's with A's (or make the T's fly a little smarter), and do something about the F-15 chasing me down. I will try again and see if I can avoid the Eagle's, and if I find a way then I'll rescind the last one :).

 

For kicks, I've attached a track of my last attempt, the one in which I scored hits on one of the A-10's. It also shows my desperate but futile attempt to escape the F-15's. I've edited it to fast forward to the battle itself.

Edited April 15, 2010 by slug88

[slug88]

Ok, track was too big to attach, so I uploaded it here:

 

http://www.sendspace.com/file/r7hhvj

 

After just reviewing the track, I'd like to once again say good job with that radio jamming effect, that small touch really emphasizes that the Americans have showed up and you should be afraid :D.

[slug88]

Well, tried again, and again was brutally downed by an F-15. The peculiar thing is that there was a Su-25T still orbiting Batumi that the F-15's seemed to have ignored! I guess Ka-50's must be high priority targets after all the havoc they've wreaked on the Georgian up to this point :D.

[igormk]

… I returned without much feedback, because I lost one of my engines due to vibration right as I got to the BP, after about 20 minutes of flying!...

 

Yes, that is why DCS is so big. You can expect the unexpected, even when it shouldn’t be expected. :D

 

Alright, so I gave the epic last mission a couple more go's, and here are my comments:

 

 

1. I understand you because I should consider upgrading my PC too ;).

 

2.OK, I did encounter the same problem, but I adapted my position according to visual scanning and reports from my wingman that missiles are launched. I will change the position so it’s more easier for the users.

 

3.No problem on that one – it will be enlarged.

 

4.That is already fixed.

 

5. & 6. I will have to blame AI on those. It was not my intention to do it like that just to look impressive. Both Su-25Ts and Su-34s are acting very weird. It doesn’t matter where you put their IP, or altitude, they will come close and low risking their life (and loosing it). Results vary on each attempt, but maybe I should consider reducing the number of those ZU-23s and MANPADs. This way we will get few FPS too.

8.Cool! I will see your track file as soon as possible. Sounds exciting. Actually I’m not sure is it normal, but often I have more fun and excitement when watching other people’s tracks, than flying myself.

 

9. As you probably noticed, fighter escort was wiped out. Maybe you could even see su-27 falling down from the sky when US entered the battle, so it would take time to scramble another fighters. You will have to escape without help! ;)

 

I did it in my second attempt. My tactic was to go NOE direct to Ozurgeti airfield. I even saw couple of missiles hitting the ground around me, but I was probably too low, so they couldn’t hit me. When you get closer to the airfield, AD will start working those F-15s, so you are safe.

10. Yes, that was the idea, despite that I’m not sure it is realistic, since I’ve never experienced such thing IRL. I’m glad you liked the effect.

 

 

 

Well, tried again, and again was brutally downed by an F-15. The peculiar thing is that there was a Su-25T still orbiting Batumi that the F-15's seemed to have ignored! I guess Ka-50's must be high priority targets after all the havoc they've wreaked on the Georgian up to this point :D.

Huh! AI issue again. Or revenge over the Ka-50s as you said. :)

[dsobbe]

Is Georgian Havoc v1.1 (corrected version) available? If so, where?

Thanks

[bigdog4215]

Is Georgian Havoc v1.1 (corrected version) available? If so, where?

Thanks

is it for dcs if so i don t see it where you download patches and the georgian oil war missions.i don t see nothing about campaigns.

[pyro1588]

I'm on the fifth mission now and loving it!

 

Not to rag on the fourth mission anymore, but what triggers the friendly fighters? On my first couple of tries, I was shot down trying to flee the Hinds. Then on the third try, I get a decent lead, we suddenly have fighter support (~3min into the mission,) the Hinds are shot down, and life is good! Did the friendly support fail to be triggered the first couple of times?

 

Edit: If you want, I'll have some time this next week to clean up the English in the mission descriptions. Would you like me to?

 

Edit 2: Voice glitch report: When Sibir 1 is supposed to say, "We're expecting a lot of enemy activity," only the text appears.

 

Edit 3: Upon further inspection of the thread, I realize that I didn't download the fix for mission 4. Oops. Ignore above comments.

 

Edit 4: Further comment: Mission 6 is pissing me off to no end. I can take out the first ambush, although not without the convoy suffering fairly heavy losses. Out of 4 attempts, though, they've only radioed for the other convoy once. When I get to the second ambush, I run out of Vikhrs because my stupid AI wingman is too much of a blithering idiot to take anything out before dying. Arg!

Edited May 21, 2010 by pyro1588

[dsobbe]

IgorMK,

After flying Georgian Havoc V1.0 "Secret Mission" ATO.S4.1 twice (and being shot down) I no longer get the comms call from Voskhod after takeoff with the the last known position of the target ship when I replay that mission. Also, I no longer get the call from the carrier that I am in site and can land. All other comms calls seem to be OK. Looking forward to version 1.1.