talk me out of returning my TM Warthog HOTAS

[gear_monkey]

I'm into day 5 with the new setup. I was using CH products HOTAS before.

 

Here is what I love:

 

1) The control stick feel is incredible...I feel like I'm flying a real aircraft.

 

2) Metal construction is fantastic and the weight of the units impressive. Plus the way it all looks is awesome.

 

 

Here is what I don't like or am scared of:

 

1) My control stick base plate came installed backwards out of the box...c'mon, for 500 bucks you can't install the base plate so the logo faces the right way?

 

2) I have lost the use of rudders (CH Throttle mini-stick) and wheel-brakes on the HOTAS...reaching for the key board is an immursion killer for me and I REALLY miss the mini-stick and using pinky button on combat stick as wheel brakes.

--BTW before you say, "Go buy rudder pedals", I'm now over 650 bucks into this with a new monitor and the Warthog HOTAS...I've already broken the bank and will not buy additional equipment.

 

3) It seems there is a very high failure rate of the throttle unit at about the 1 to 3 month use mark. All the switches on the throttle base are cool but it seems they are a failure waiting to happen.

 

4) "Sticknation" or whatever the term is to describe having to lubricate the control stick...as in dissasemble the unit to put lube on it...really? I've had the CH stuff for almost 9 years and have never heard of such a thing...again...at 500 bucks should I have to do such a thing??

 

5) Probably my ignorance but there seems to be no way to assign more than one function to a button. Can anyone tell me how to do this without using the TARGET software? I would love to assign outside views and map views to the HOTAS.

 

6) Why is the paddle switch "no worky"? How do you activate it? I would love to make that my brakes.

 

Yes, I want to be talked out of taking this stuff back....I love the feel and look of Warthog HOTAS but right now I'm looking at sending it back and getting the CH Fighterstick to replace my almost 9 year old Combatstick.

 

Thanks all!

[Deigs]

Dude, it's a base plate... I never even look at the thing, but unscrew those 4 little screws at the bottom.

 

I've had my unit for awhile, I use it everyday and she's solid as a rock.

 

I use the paddle thingy for comms in Teamspeak. I did need to put some sewing machine oil so it wouldn't squeek. So now it's perfect.

 

Buy some pedals. Saitek Combat Pedals are nice, and cheap.

 

You can't just give back a cool as stick on the premise that it might stop working one day. If thats the case... Don't buy a car... or a computer... or a hot water system.

 

Stay the path, Luke.

[Gadroc]

1) My control stick base plate came installed backwards out of the box...c'mon, for 500 bucks you can't install the base plate so the logo faces the right way?

Annoying but the base plate is attached by 4 screws, and is designed to be taken off if you want to mount it in a pit. If this is truly on your list of complaints I think you're looking for excuses to say CH is better.

 

2) I have lost the use of rudders (CH Throttle mini-stick) and wheel-brakes on the HOTAS...reaching for the key board is an immursion killer for me and I REALLY miss the mini-stick and using pinky button on combat stick as wheel brakes.

--BTW before you say, "Go buy rudder pedals", I'm now over 650 bucks into this with a new monitor and the Warthog HOTAS...I've already broken the bank and will not buy additional equipment.

Sorry but.... go buy pedals. You knew there where no pedals on the unit when you bought it right?

 

3) It seems there is a very high failure rate of the throttle unit at about the 1 to 3 month use mark. All the switches on the throttle base are cool but it seems they are a failure waiting to happen.

While there where a folks who had bricked throttle I have not heard of switches going bad. I've had zero problems with mine. The internet sometimes becoming an "echo" chamber where you see vocal minorities. The only people who could tell you if there was a statistically high failure rate are Thrustmaster.

 

4) "Sticknation" or whatever the term is to describe having to lubricate the control stick...as in dissasemble the unit to put lube on it...really? I've had the CH stuff for almost 9 years and have never heard of such a thing...again...at 500 bucks should I have to do such a thing??

Do you notice this "sticknation" or are you just parroting what you've read on the stick. I feel nothing of the sort on mine neither do many of the owners of the stick.

 

5) Probably my ignorance but there seems to be no way to assign more than one function to a button. Can anyone tell me how to do this without using the TARGET software? I would love to assign outside views and map views to the HOTAS.

Well no joystick allows you to map multiple functions to the same button with out running their mapping software / drivers. TARGET is very very versatile but can have a steep learning curve. That being said DCS games have built in support for this. Open the controls section and click the modifiers button then click add... now press whatever button you want to be the shift button. Now you can use that as a modifier in other bindings.

 

6) Why is the paddle switch "no worky"? How do you activate it? I would love to make that my brakes.

The paddle works just fine, just the default bindings in DCS don't have anything mapped to it because the real A-10 doesn't have a paddle switch. Just open up the controls section of DCS and map it to whatever you want.... this would make a great "shift" button from above or wheel brakes.

 

Yes, I want to be talked out of taking this stuff back....I love the feel and look of Warthog HOTAS but right now I'm looking at sending it back and getting the CH Fighterstick to replace my almost 9 year old Combatstick.

To be quite honest your list above seems a contrived list of things you've tried hard to find reasons to send it back. The CH stick will require you to use the CH equivalent of Target or assign modifier keys just like the Warthog. The Warthog throttle has far more buttons and switches to map than the CH equivalent. There is no reason you have to use them as labeled feel free to create a mapping that does 2-4 times as much. Out of the box it gets mapped identical to the real HOTAS.

 

The only real issue is cost and rudder. You could get a different set up with pedals for the same cost... but you would give up the real feel you get with the HOTAS warthog. You're tho only one that can put value on your bank account.

[gear_monkey]

Dude, it's a base plate... I never even look at the thing, but unscrew those 4 little screws at the bottom.

 

I've had my unit for awhile, I use it everyday and she's solid as a rock.

 

I use the paddle thingy for comms in Teamspeak. I did need to put some sewing machine oil so it wouldn't squeek. So now it's perfect.

 

Buy some pedals. Saitek Combat Pedals are nice, and cheap.

 

You can't just give back a cool as stick on the premise that it might stop working one day. If thats the case... Don't buy a car... or a computer... or a hot water system.

 

Stay the path, Luke.

 

I hear ya on the base plate...it just smacked me as goofy.

 

All these reports of the throttle bricking and the control stick needing to be lubed are what really make me uneasy.

 

I guess I'm saying I'm suprised to read about all the problems on a system that costs as much as it does.

[gear_monkey]

To be quite honest your list above seems a contrived list of things you've tried hard to find reasons to send it back. The CH stick will require you to use the CH equivalent of Target or assign modifier keys just like the Warthog. The Warthog throttle has far more buttons and switches to map than the CH equivalent. There is no reason you have to use them as labeled feel free to create a mapping that does 2-4 times as much. Out of the box it gets mapped identical to the real HOTAS.

 

The only real issue is cost and rudder. You could get a different set up with pedals for the same cost... but you would give up the real feel you get with the HOTAS warthog. You're tho only one that can put value on your bank account.

 

Thanks for responding...I'll leave the bank account remark alone but the rest of your post is good intel.

[EtherealN]

Regarding the paddle switch - it should work fine to map the break. I just tested it out: just open the control settings in the options screen, find "Wheel Break On/Off", click the "Joystick - HOTAS Warthog" column, then "Add", then just click the paddle.

 

Regarding the use of multiple functions on the same button - you can do this with regular modifiers (shift etc) if you don't use Target. The thing is though that this is a replica stick so it has only a few "extras" (like the paddle, mic-switch depression/up and slew micromouse click). For that type of special things I really think TARGET is what you want to use, though.

[Gadroc]

Thanks for responding...I'll leave the bank account remark alone but the rest of your post is good intel.

 

FYI - the bank account statement wasn't ment derogatory or mean. The warthog is expensive by any means and it does require pedals for the fullest. You really pay for the feel and not everyone values it the same way.

[gear_monkey]

Regarding the paddle switch - it should work fine to map the break. I just tested it out: just open the control settings in the options screen, find "Wheel Break On/Off", click the "Joystick - HOTAS Warthog" column, then "Add", then just click the paddle.

 

Regarding the use of multiple functions on the same button - you can do this with regular modifiers (shift etc) if you don't use Target. The thing is though that this is a replica stick so it has only a few "extras" (like the paddle, mic-switch depression/up and slew micromouse click). For that type of special things I really think TARGET is what you want to use, though.

 

thanks!

 

I think your post is really what I was looking for.

 

Certainly don't want a CH vs Thrustmaster issue.

[gear_monkey]

FYI - the bank account statement wasn't ment derogatory or mean. The warthog is expensive by any means and it does require pedals for the fullest. You really pay for the feel and not everyone values it the same way.

 

copy that...no offense taken.

 

thanks for your thoughts.

[WynnTTr]

Your only legitimate gripe is the base plate not being screwed in correctly and lack of rudder control (which is not even the WH's fault - you knew that it didn't have rudder control when you bought it but then moan that you can't afford rudders, so who's fault is it really?) Ofc that doesn't stop you from mapping rudder functions to the WH.

 

Everything else is supposition.

 

In the end though we can't convince you to keep something you're not happy with - cos you'll always be looking for something to go wrong with it.

[Attackron46]

well just due to the fact that your warthog was assembled wrong is reason enough for me anyhow to demand an exchange

[Steel Jaw]

Dude, it's a base plate... I never even look at the thing, but unscrew those 4 little screws at the bottom.

 

His concern, and I agree, is this indicates lack of attention to detail, what else may have been done sloppily?

 

I am watching thiese threads since I am pondering the purchase in the Fall.

Edited June 9, 2011 by Mower

[Slothface]

If you're serious about the "real feel" then I can do nothing but recommend the TM WH HOTAS. (Other HOTAS units also available from all good HOTAS manufacturers! (Although none are A-10C replicas)) Since Ive had mine I've had absolutely no problems with it. I think what a poster said earlier with regards to minorities echoing hard through the net with their problems might have too much of an effect.

 

I've plugged, played, loved, and experienced no problems. Of course, who's to say I wont in future? The only thing that concerns me about your post is the base plate and as quoted previously the "lack of attention to detail". For a unit priced so highly, why can't they get a simple thing like that sorted at quality control? I really do appreciate its a small gripe easily fixed with 4 screws but c'mon... TM get your act together and think about the customer experience if you're gonna charge that much!!! While you're there... think about sacking the guy in quality control or give him a better break schedule so he can get his head in the game! :)

 

So far with my experience of the TM WH, all I can rate it as is a 5 out of 5 as I've got nothing to complain about.

[gear_monkey]

This was my very point....I felt like I bought a Lamborghini and after sitting down discovered they put the steering wheel in backwards.

 

Don't get me wrong....I'm not bashing here, the TM Warthog is awesome. The feel of the unit is top notch and the in game response is laser precise.

 

It just wasn't for me. I read way too much about multiple failures people experience around the 3-6 month use mark with throttles bricking, trim switches failing, lubrication failing in the control stick, etc.

 

Maybe when the price drops to the 300 dollar mark I'll re-purchase.

 

I instead upgraded my old CH Combatstick to the Fighterstick. I then did the rubber-band/condom upgrade and am really happy.

 

AGAIN, this is not a bash TM post. I simply bought the unit, tried it out, didn't really like what I saw for the price and took it back.

[metalnwood]

You are lucky, we don't have a try before you buy option over here. Once it's bought it's ours unless there is a specific fault and even then they can offer to replace before refunding.

 

It's not fair to compare a warthog to a Lamborghini, you are in for a lifetime of repairs with the Lamborghini ;)

 

I think there is a good chance that someone else had your stick and also returned it but had removed the base and put it back on wrong.

[Scarecrow]

I bought my Hogstick back in december and have not had any of the Firmware problems that were prevalent on release. Its a great stick for A10 and for FC2, but I still prefer the G940 for use in IL2 COD. One thing that really does worry me is the delamination of the collar ring here:- http://www.warthogworld.com/hangar/showthread.php?65-Delamination-of-Anti-friction-Buffer-Ring . I truley hope TM will make parts available for purchase if this is a big problem.

[Cali]

I bought a cougar 3 1/2 years ago and knew it had some problems. The main problem was the spring was made by He-man. I wanted to keep it but didn't have money to mod it at the time, so I sold it 2 weeks later. Then last year I bought the Cougar again and could never get it to work with windows 7. Also after 10 years some switches were still installed wrong, come on TM. I heard the Warthog is what the Cougar should have been. I, to have CH and have had them for several years with 0 problems. The only problem I have with CH is that they haven't made a new fighter jet throttle. I hate the CH throttle, but the darn thing works so good! I may buy the Warthog in the future, I'll wait and see what a buddy of mine says after he puts it through it's paces.

 

I haven't hard any failures after the last firmware up date, so I think that may be safe to say, that problem is fixed. I have recently heard about some buttons not working. Hopefully that is just a few isolated cases. I guess this doesn't matter anymore since you returned it.

[bumfire]

Also Cali on my stick atleast, if the lights on the throttle are set to anything inbetween off or full on, then the grey slider on the throttle suffers from spiking.

 

So I cant use the leds on the throttle unless they are fully on, or if I map the slider to something else that isnt something vital e.g lights.

 

I normally use the grey slider for zoom, but when the leds are at any setting other than off or full on, the spiking goes nuts, I have to turn the leds off or fully on if I want to use the slider as a zoom function.

 

Their is no spiking when the leds are off or fully on, so I can live with it.

 

I must point out that the spiking is only affecting the grey slider, nothing else is affected by spiking on the warthog when it comes to the led values.

[RogueRunner]

This reminds me of a suicidal person calling the suicide hotline for help, ie not really interested in doing so but needs some attention :P

[hassata]

Do it-you don't have the balls. J/K

 

This is the top-o-the line. You got it, enjoy it. Don't let the nagging fears hold you back.

[Cali]

Do it-you don't have the balls. J/K

 

This is the top-o-the line. You got it, enjoy it. Don't let the nagging fears hold you back.

 

Yep, top of the line, with some problems. The Cougar was the same way and 10 years later it still had the same problems. I never understood why TM did upgrade the sensors on the Cougar, but left the same crappy ones after all that time. I still like the Cougar and would like to have one still.

[Jinja]

2) I have lost the use of rudders (CH Throttle mini-stick) and wheel-brakes on the HOTAS...reaching for the key board is an immursion killer for me and I REALLY miss the mini-stick and using pinky button on combat stick as wheel brakes.

--BTW before you say, "Go buy rudder pedals", I'm now over 650 bucks into this with a new monitor and the Warthog HOTAS...I've already broken the bank and will not buy additional equipment.

 

Sounds like someone who's bought an Zonda but can't afford the tyres and runs it on 91-ron!

 

Warthog's pedigree. If you need a donkey, buy a donkey.

[159th_Viper]

 

Warthog's pedigree. If you need a donkey, buy a donkey.

 

:megalol:

 

Priceless! :thumbup:

[Steel Jaw]

As a 10 year owner of the flawed Cougar, and previously the F22 etc, TM has not earned my respect for quality of manufacturing. It is quite correct to be cautious about sinking $500 into this latest TM "experiment".

 

I will upgrade in the Fall and (hate to say) am looking seriously at the G940.

Edited June 15, 2011 by Mower

[Cali]

As a 10 year owner of the flawed Cougar, and previously the F22 etc, TM has not earned my respect for quality of manufacturing. It is quite correct to be cautious about sinking $500 into this latest TM "experiment".

 

I will upgrade in the Fall and (hate to say) am looking seriously at the G940.

 

Stop lying to yourself, you're gonna get the Warthog.