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Guns cause FPS drop


Ratfink
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I notice a drop in FPS <25 when firing the guns. My guess it's the smoke effect causing my rig some issues. Is there a way to adjust the smoke effect? I don't see anything in options.

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it should be one of their first priorities to correct the clownish gun smoke and tracers.. I'm staving off DCS products till I see the old BS1.0 team back. :(

AWAITING ED NEW DAMAGE MODEL IMPLEMENTATION FOR WW2 BIRDS

 

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it should be one of their first priorities to correct the clownish gun smoke and tracers..

 

Now that I've seen them from a few different angles, I'm going to have to reluctantly agree; the tracers look less realistic now than they did in 1.2.0, from any angle other than directly behind. Real tracers, seen from the side, look like bright lines and not teardrop shapes. Also, the cannon explosion effect doesn't belong on the .50 cals, of course. These problems are mostly cosmetic, but they're pretty big issues, for aesthetics & immersion.

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Now that I've seen them from a few different angles, I'm going to have to reluctantly agree; the tracers look less realistic now than they did in 1.2.0, from any angle other than directly behind. Real tracers, seen from the side, look like bright lines and not teardrop shapes. Also, the cannon explosion effect doesn't belong on the .50 cals, of course. These problems are mostly cosmetic, but they're pretty big issues, for aesthetics & immersion.

 

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Now that I've seen them from a few different angles, I'm going to have to reluctantly agree; the tracers look less realistic now than they did in 1.2.0, from any angle other than directly behind. Real tracers, seen from the side, look like bright lines and not teardrop shapes. Also, the cannon explosion effect doesn't belong on the .50 cals, of course. These problems are mostly cosmetic, but they're pretty big issues, for aesthetics & immersion.

 

reluctantly? goddamit man!! this thing reeks!!! ARGGGHHH!!!! ME NEEDS THE ALD SMOOK BAK!!!!!!!!!!!! NOUWWW!!!

AWAITING ED NEW DAMAGE MODEL IMPLEMENTATION FOR WW2 BIRDS

 

Fat T is above, thin T is below. Long T is faster, Short T is slower. Open triangle is AWACS, closed triangle is your own sensors. Double dash is friendly, Single dash is enemy. Circle is friendly. Strobe is jammer. Strobe to dash is under 35 km. HDD is 7 times range key. Radar to 160 km, IRST to 10 km. Stay low, but never slow.

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Well, reluctantly because the team is clearly working very hard to get things right, and almost always succeeding. These tracers are an exception. I have a fair bit of confidence that they'll rectify the problem sooner or later.

 

You mean the aesthetics or the FPS drop? :smilewink:

 

I guess I'm not alone with the latter...

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I have flown the P-51 maybe 3 or 4 times since 1.2.1

 

I usually end the flight a few seconds after firing the guns (even quicker if it's at a ground target...30mm explosions...wtf?)

 

Is it possible that someone install 1.2.0 and simply copy the old tracers into 1.2.1?

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Now that I've seen them from a few different angles, I'm going to have to reluctantly agree; the tracers look less realistic now than they did in 1.2.0, from any angle other than directly behind. Real tracers, seen from the side, look like bright lines and not teardrop shapes. Also, the cannon explosion effect doesn't belong on the .50 cals, of course. These problems are mostly cosmetic, but they're pretty big issues, for aesthetics & immersion.

 

What makes you so sure that they are less realistic now? Have you fired live tracer rounds before? You have to keep in mind in filming, cameras have shutter times, and when you have a bullet traveling from 2800-3000fps, tracers are going to always appear to be bright lasers instead of a bright point followed by a slightly less bright path.

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http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=95947

 

Echo doesn't need me to speak for him but we've been here before...! Echo said in above thread...

 

Put me in the "close but not quite" camp. Real tracers do indeed look like small floating blobs from directly behind (i.e. to the shooter), as I can confirm by my own experience. However, there's something that isn't quite right about these. Now, gun-cam videos shouldn't be used as examples of what they should look like, for numerous reasons, but, all the same, I've seen real tracers in person from multiple angles, and something's a bit off still.

 

No dis-respect intended at all Al Capwn, but these 50cal effects are over exaggerated at the moment by too great a factor.

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Can anyone comment on the FPS drop I'm getting when firing guns? I now notice on the instant action dogfight it goes down to about 20 fps from about 40+

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http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=95947

 

Echo doesn't need me to speak for him but we've been here before...! Echo said in above thread...

 

 

 

No dis-respect intended at all Al Capwn, but these 50cal effects are over exaggerated at the moment by too great a factor.

 

None taken at all, I was not intending to sound like I'm an expert (I'm by no means no expert nor have I fired live tracer rounds, I was going off information given to me by relatives with first hand combat experience) and I really was asking what makes him think they're currently unrealistic. I never saw that other thread that clarified he actually has witnessed tracers in person, but it answers my questions.

 

Thank you for the info!

 

Edit: Although I have to add regarding Echo's comment, .50 API ammunition should flash very brightly upon impact and I believe by the time the P-51D was flying their ammo belt load outs were mostly API. However I completely agree that the current hit effect that appears to be a large explosion that looks like small bombs going off should be changed.

 

Edit Edit: And Ratfink I have to agree with you that firing the guns causes an FPS drop, although I am running on max settings. I have not yet tested if it is related to high MSAA setting.

 

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Edited by Al Capwn
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Can anyone comment on the FPS drop I'm getting when firing guns?

 

Ratfink - I am experiencing the exact same problem. Fps drops by about 20 when firing the p-51d guns, especially near the ground..

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Ratfink - I am experiencing the exact same problem. Fps drops by about 20 when firing the p-51d guns, especially near the ground..

 

Thanks Amisnaru, nice to know I'm not alone with that. Hope that ED will get it sorted

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I have noticed some performance hit when firing guns near ground and while there are more powerful rigs out there I do not think I should be seeing the hit Im seeing. I5 @ 4.5 ghz, 8gb ram, 580 gtx. Also running SSD and the load time for the AI dogfight in P51 sure takes long.

 

Not to keen on the fire animation for damaged plane either. Looks very much like it was just thrown in there to having something.

 

Having said that.. the AI dogfight is a challenge and speed management is critical. I have defeated him twice, once I went directly into an inverted flat spin and died shortly after him :)


Edited by socal500
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Have you fired live tracer rounds before?

 

Yes, I have. I've also seen tracers argued to death in flight sim forums for the last ten or fifteen years. Most of the people who have opinions--often strong ones--about what the tracers should look like have never even seen one (let alone fired any) in real life. : /

 

tracers are going to always appear to be bright lasers

 

In real life, a tracer will not resemble a laser to the human eye. A laser, upon being turned on, instantly extends fully from the source to the destination. Well, technically, the stream moves at the speed of light, but this will be exactly the same as "instantly" to the human eye. Tracer trails, on the other hand, are relatively short (appearing several yards long) and can be seen to travel, except for when the shooting range is very short. (Also, the beams of lasers--excepting, perhaps, extremely high-powered ones--are transparent.) The only thing I can think of that could cause tracers to resemble lasers at all is if you over-exposed the film, having the shutter open for too long, or some similar camera technique. Then the modified tracer image could be reasonably described as looking "kind of like a bright laser."

 

And, of course, neither real laser beams nor real tracers, viewed from the side, resemble Star Wars blasters, which are, unfortunately, what flight-sim tracers usually look like. IL-2, Rise of Flight, and now our latest build of DCS all make 'em look like Star Wars "pew-pew bolts," which isn't right at all. Real tracers look like thin bright lines from the side, and like small, bright round blobs from the shooter's perspective. They do not look like "teardrops," nor large balls with a thinner trail. Tracers do not resemble comets.

 

Commenting on one of EDs projects without some evidence to back up your claims? I'll start:
Plenty more where that came from.

 

Gun-cam footage must not be used to try to get an idea of what tracers look like to the naked eye. For one thing, WWII gun cameras were generally placed too close to the guns; this caused excessive shaking of the camera, resulting in a squiggly-line effect which tracers do not have when seen by the naked eye--neither from the cockpit of an airplane, nor from the sight of a rifle, nor when viewed from the side by a party other than the shooter.

 

Another reason against confusing footage and live is film exposure. Depending on the camera, the tracer trail may or may not have the same thickness and/or length as the real thing, when seen from an angle other than directly behind (or directly in front). The good news is, some videos of real tracers do accurately depict them, due to the settings on the camera during recording. But others do not.

 

Although I have to add regarding Echo's comment, .50 API ammunition should flash very brightly upon impact and I believe by the time the P-51D was flying their ammo belt load outs were mostly API. However I completely agree that the current hit effect that appears to be a large explosion that looks like small bombs going off should be changed.

 

Right. See the conversation in the first sixteen posts of the following thread: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=94782


Edited by Echo38
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No. In real life, a tracer will never resemble a laser to the human eye. The only way tracers could resemble lasers at all is if you over-exposed film, or some similar camera technique.

Not agree. Can you see every blade of the propeller clearly with your eyes when the RPM goes up to 3000? The tracers doubled the speed of that.

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Not agree. Can you see every blade of the propeller clearly with your eyes when the RPM goes up to 3000? The tracers doubled the speed of that.

 

If you mean that you can't see real tracers moving with the naked eye, then I'm afraid that's incorrect. I have seen real tracers moving, both from directly behind and from the side, in bright daylight and at night. If the bullet hits something close to the shooter, e.g only a few yards away, then you won't see it, but if you're shooting at something a few hundred yards away, you can see the tracer moving. (Tracers don't travel as quickly as their solid counterparts, by the way.)

 

I did catch a slight inaccuracy in my earlier statement: if you are firing nothing but tracers, [edit]at a continuous high rate of fire[/edit], then it might look sort of like a bright laser, and you might have a difficulty time separating them visually. But, normally, tracers are not fired in a constant stream like this, but one tracer for every so many non-tracer rounds. And here, my statement stands. Under normal circumstances, to the naked human eye, one can easily see tracers moving, in which case they do not remotely resemble lasers.

 

Since the semantic hair-splitting appears to have begun, and I want to avoid that sort of thing, I'm going to try to refrain from adding to this conversation. There's enough good information posted now that those who wish to know what real tracers look like, without having the opportunity to fire them or see them in person, should be able to at least filter out the bad info.


Edited by Echo38
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I know why you can see the tracer like a moving dot, not a short bright line. Your view piont is tracking the tracer. Your head and eyeballs may turn and reduce the relative angular velocity of the tracer unconsciously.

 

The sim have a static camera, like fixed eyeballs, and the high speed moving light object will show a dash in the view. Further more, if a better looking effect is needed, the dynamic fuzzy should be the one, when the view is turning.

 

(And the different parts of cells on your retina may have different reaction time. You will find the different lenth of the dash when it is in different part of your view.)


Edited by billeinstein

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In real life, a tracer will not resemble a laser to the human eye. A laser, upon being turned on, instantly extends fully from the source to the destination. Well, technically, the stream moves at the speed of light, but this will be exactly the same as "instantly" to the human eye. Tracer trails, on the other hand, are relatively short (appearing several yards long) and can be seen to travel, except for when the shooting range is very short. (Also, the beams of lasers--excepting, perhaps, extremely high-powered ones--are transparent.) The only thing I can think of that could cause tracers to resemble lasers at all is if you over-exposed the film, having the shutter open for too long, or some similar camera technique. Then the modified tracer image could be reasonably described as looking "kind of like a bright laser."

 

And, of course, neither real laser beams nor real tracers, viewed from the side, resemble Star Wars blasters, which are, unfortunately, what flight-sim tracers usually look like. IL-2, Rise of Flight, and now our latest build of DCS all make 'em look like Star Wars "pew-pew bolts," which isn't right at all. Real tracers look like thin bright lines from the side, and like small, bright round blobs from the shooter's perspective. They do not look like "teardrops," nor large balls with a thinner trail. Tracers do not resemble comets.

 

 

Thanks for replying Echo, although I have to say that you misunderstood what I was trying to say, I agree with your standpoint, I was saying on cameras tracers generally appear like lasers, not in person with the human eye.


Edited by Al Capwn
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