Targeting with Maverick

[Jet-Blast]

Hi gang. I'm new here. First post.

 

I've looked back through lots of pages, looking for the answer to this question and can't find it.

 

I'm relatively new to the A-10C sim. I've recently learned how to fire the Mavericks and drop bombs successfully.

 

I'm experiencing a problem with the Mavs that I don't know if it's something I'm doing, something my computer is doing or even if it's something that is supposed to be happening.

 

For practice, I've been flying the instant action missions, the first one in particular. I've successfully completed it several times, but it's often luck that does it. When using a Maverick to take out a target, I seem to have a limited time to acquire the target or it will dissappear.

 

It seems to happen like this. I turn towards a target and select a missile. I'll press the Mav button on the right MCDU and make it SOI. I'll slew it onto the target with long V and then attempt to get it on the particular target with the slew controls on my throttle. While I'm doing this, I'm of course looking at the target through the right MCDU. I only have a few seconds it seems to get the target locked up or the video from the MCDU seems to change to inverse video or something like that and I can't see the targets at all. It becomes very grainy and 2 dimentinal. OCCASIONALLY, I'll accidentally slew across one and lock it up, but I can't see it on the screen. If I can get it locked up within a few seconds, it will appear normal, but that time window is very small.

 

I don't think that the problem is with my computer screen because everything else appears normal, the only thing that's screwed up is the video from the MCDU.

 

Is this normal and if so, what can I do about it?

 

Thanks!

Edited February 7, 2013 by Jet-Blast
Link to the photos that I added later were inserted for clarity.

[AceKng1]

This doesn't sound normal. Could possibly post a video or screenshot of what is happening so we can see what you see? You could also post a track so we can see if something is out of the ordinary.

 

My first guess is that maybe you are accidentally changing the targeting view of the maverick to infrared or black hot. Another guess is that the contrast on your mfcd may need to be adjusted with the appropriate rocker switch.

[Jet-Blast]

I can possible post a screen shot in a little while. I'm leaving home in a min to get the kids from school.

 

I'm not sure what you mean by post a track though.

 

Thanks for the reply!

[Krudnits]

Are you using MAVs with or without the TGP?

[Jet-Blast]

Without.

 

I mean, I do have the targeting pod, but I'm only using MAV mode and using the seeker head in the missile.

[Jet-Blast]

@AceKng1 You may be onto something with the view changing from infra red to black hot etc, but I'm not even sure how to do that, so I don't THINK I'm doing it accidentally.

 

It seems to have something to do with time. At first, all will appear normal, like in the videos I've seen on youtube etc, but within a few seconds.....maybe 10 or so, the video changes and the targets are no longer visible.

[NullSpace]

Jet, that actually can't be an issue if you're using Mavricks alone. The TGP has both FLIR and CCD cameras, but mav seekers are EITHER FLIR or electro-optical. So it couldn't be that.

 

Note that china hat forward short (I think? I just remember what it's bound to on my x52) will change your seeker view from wide-angle to close, it could be that you're accidentally jumping into/out of narrow FOV and losing your target.

 

To clarify: that would be short "V"

[Jona33]

You can change the symbology but it sounds like a graphics issue.

[Jet-Blast]

I just got home and am going to go to the other computer and see if I can get a screen shot of it. I'm not sure how to post that yet, but I'll crost that bridge once I have the screen shot.

 

I do know how to change the FOV from wide to narrow. I'm using the China hat as a POV, so the FOV is short press of the V key. It's definitely not that.

 

I've wondered if it's some sort of graphics issue too, but I am using a brand new laptop that is optimized for gaming. When using the TGP, I never have this issue. Everything else on the screen looks normal when the MCDU starts looking strange, so I'm not sure what it is. I'll be back when I get a screen shot and figure out how to post it.

[Jet-Blast]

OK....I just went and flew a short mission. Below are 2 shots. Sorry, printscreen didn't seem to want to work. It kept photographing the desktop and not the game. Not sure why. Anyway, I took these 2 photos with my cell phone and it pretty clearly shows what's up.

 

The first pic was of a bridge that I was approaching to attack. I first needed to kill the AAA unit with a Maverick. In the first pic, I was a ways from the target and couldn't see the AAA unit yet, but the graphics were clear. A few seconds later, as I got a little closer, I saw the AAA unit and slewed over to it to lock it up. Before I could get it, the video image changed and all detail went away and I could no longer see the AAA unit or the bridge or any other details for that matter.

 

Any ideas?

 

PS: If there's a better way to upload the images, I'm all ears. I did them as an attachment. I tried inserting an image, but it wanted a URL.

[acino]

The current "picture" in the MAV display disappears when you move the nose of your aircraft around (turning etc.). So there are two things that are good to do, engage autopilot while slewing the maverick cursor and/or TMS down short to ground stabilize the cursor on the present spot before performing any maneuvers/corrections.

 

Also, make sure you set a SPI at your target so you can always return to it fast in case something screws up.

 

Edit: Absolutely make sure you set SPI with your TGP at the target units, otherwise it's super difficult to slew your maverick cursor/sensor to them since it's pointing at your steerpoint by default.

Edited February 7, 2013 by acino

[Jet-Blast]

I am using autopilot and flying straight and level when slewing, so that's not the issue.

 

That's a good idea with TMS down short to stabilize the cursor and I'll try that, but for now, I'm flying easy/ beginner missions and SPI is already set at the target. I have very little slewing to do. I fly towards the target, press long V to get the cursor close to the target and then slew onto it. I only have a few seconds at times to accomplish this or the video image on the MCDU changes and the targets are invisible.

[acino]

I am using autopilot and flying straight and level when slewing, so that's not the issue.

 

That's a good idea with TMS down short to stabilize the cursor and I'll try that, but for now, I'm flying easy/ beginner missions and SPI is already set at the target. I have very little slewing to do. I fly towards the target, press long V to get the cursor close to the target and then slew onto it. I only have a few seconds at times to accomplish this or the video image on the MCDU changes and the targets are invisible.

 

The certainly does not sound normal. Does the video image change abruptly or do you see it moving to a new location? Or do the units simply suddenly disappear?

[Jet-Blast]

It changes abruptly. I'll be slewing onto a target and BAM.....in the blink of an eye, the picture changes and it looks like picture #2. I can press long V to make sure that I'm still in the same area and I am.

[WildBillKelsoe]

OK....I just went and flew a short mission. Below are 2 shots. Sorry, printscreen didn't seem to want to work. It kept photographing the desktop and not the game. Not sure why. Anyway, I took these 2 photos with my cell phone and it pretty clearly shows what's up.

 

The first pic was of a bridge that I was approaching to attack. I first needed to kill the AAA unit with a Maverick. In the first pic, I was a ways from the target and couldn't see the AAA unit yet, but the graphics were clear. A few seconds later, as I got a little closer, I saw the AAA unit and slewed over to it to lock it up. Before I could get it, the video image changed and all detail went away and I could no longer see the AAA unit or the bridge or any other details for that matter.

 

Any ideas?

 

PS: If there's a better way to upload the images, I'm all ears. I did them as an attachment. I tried inserting an image, but it wanted a URL.

 

what happened was the plane swerved and the maverick seeker went out of field of view because it has limits to azimuth and elevation. what took you so long to lock up? 6 mikes is the firing range.

[Jet-Blast]

I was low and the AAA unit was behind some trees. I wasn't REALLY trying to shoot it in that pic. I was simply trying to doccument what has been happening when I AM trying to shoot something. Had I been higher or approaching from a different angle, I would have been able to lock on earlier. The results would have likely been the same though.

 

I've had it do exactly the same thing when I'm pointing directly at a target and the cursor is still displayed in the HUD, so I don't think that's the problem.

 

I've seen the message "Gimbal Limit" or something like that. I can't remember exactly. That seems to be the problem that you're describing.....or is it? Is that something different?

 

I also see the problem often when attacking 2 different targets in a group. I'll manage to lock one up and fire on it, but when I try to lock up the second one, they are all invisible.

[Jet-Blast]

Oh, and in the 2 pics, the airplane was straight and level, on autopilot headed directly at the target. It did not swerve.

[Yurgon]

Let's take it step by step. :)

 

Verbal remote debugging is really difficult, so it would be best if you could upload a track. To do that:

• Fly a mission that shows the problem. As soon as that is done, quit the mission. An Instant Action mission will be fine for this.
  
• (The shorter the mission, the better, so it would be great if you could get the problem to show as soon as possible)
  
• In the debriefing screen, select "Save track" and save the track file to some place on your harddrive that you will be able to relocate later (some place like "My documents") :)
  
• Start a new reply to this thread and use "Manage Attachments" (you probably know where that's located as you've already uploaded some pictures, but of course feel free to ask if anything is unclear) to upload the previously saved track file.
  
• Please also supply the following information in the post:
  
• What version of A-10C do you have installed?
  
• Do you fly in Game mode (in Options -> Gameplay, is "Game flight mode" checked)?
  
• What's your controller setup, do you have a HOTAS? If so, which one? Which profile is it running, if any?
  

 

With that, we should be able to "look over your shoulder" and see if something out of the ordinary happens and/or you do something wrong.

 

Off the top of my head, it looks like the targeting mode has been switched between your first and second screenshots. That's controlled by the "Boat switch", so it may be a good idea to double check that you don't accidentally push the Boat switch or the corresponding keyboard key.

 

In my installation, Boat switch forward and Boat switch aft is bound to RALT + Right and RALT + Left respectively. Could you be accidentally pushing these during your attack run? Could some of your HOTAS buttons activate the RALT modifier?

 

Might I also suggest that you fly the training mission "AGM-65 Maverick" (again, if you have done so before) and check whether the problem occurs within that mission?

[Jet-Blast]

I'm fairly certain that I'm not hitting the boat switch, but at this point, I won't rule anything out.

 

I have flown the training mission and the problem did not occur there. I've flown it probably 5 times with no problems at all.

 

I'll give it another go.

 

I think Wild Bill may have been onto something though. An issue that I'm having is with slewing. I'm using a CH throttle with the slew control set to the little thumbstick. I'm having some trouble making it really controlable. It takes me some time to get the cross hairs right on the target and maybe by then, I'm too close to the target and it may be out of limits in asmuth.

 

I may need to tweak the settings some more. I'm not sure if I need to set some sort of curve in the axes or anything like that. It's difficult to control it precisely.

 

I'll play with that tomorrow and will try to post a track if I can't get it working.

 

Thanks so much for the advice!

[NoJoe]

This really does sound and look like a technical issue with the graphics. What are your computer's specs, especially the videocard? Maybe it's possible that the card is running out of VRAM?

 

--NoJoe

[Evil.Bonsai]

It looks to me that you're doing something to command the tgp look elsewhere. The image looks fine, just not what you were looking at a moment earlier. In the 2nd image, I see a shallow view of green/grassy area with either a road or small stream.

 

PLEASE save the track file and upload it. That is the only way to see what you're doing.

[Stacker]

Just a quick point (I don't want to hijack this thread) - the image on the right shows just 3 horizontal bars which seem to correspond to the depression markers on the image on the left.

 

I quite often see images like that on the right (just 3 bars) when using the MAV. I've always assumed I'd accidentally put the MAV into some tracking mode but now I look at those pictures more closely I'm starting to think it's a graphics bug.

[Eddie]

Just a quick point (I don't want to hijack this thread) - the image on the right shows just 3 horizontal bars which seem to correspond to the depression markers on the image on the left.

 

I quite often see images like that on the right (just 3 bars) when using the MAV. I've always assumed I'd accidentally put the MAV into some tracking mode but now I look at those pictures more closely I'm starting to think it's a graphics bug.

 

It isn't a bug, it's working as it should. The loss of the tracking gates occurs when the mav attempts to "lock" on to an object but looses the track almost immediately due to insufficient size/contrast with the background. Just continue slewing the mac as normal and the tracking gates will come back.

[Stacker]

It isn't a bug, it's working as it should. The loss of the tracking gates occurs when the mav attempts to "lock" on to an object but looses the track almost immediately due to insufficient size/contrast with the background. Just continue slewing the mac as normal and the tracking gates will come back.

 

Ah, Ok. Got it. Thanks.:thumbup:

[Weltensegler]

yeah what Eddie said.

The second picture shows a huge difference in distance... you "snapped" off target.

You should still be able to either reset by china aft short or to realign on target by china forward long (if you made it SPI before).

in general try to alsways find ur targets with constantly switching slew and ground stabilization...basically never end slewing by stoping to slew but by pushing TMS down short ....slew right-tms down short ...slew up -tms down short.

If you leave the seeker just a half a second without ground stabilization (even if you just change direction sometimes) it looses tracking and the closer you get to the target the more sensitive that gets.

Edited February 8, 2013 by Weltensegler