Chivas

The current HOTAS systems like X55 etc are more than capable for WW2 sims, specially the mode button that can more than triple the amount of buttons, but not so sure about modern aircraft sims. VAC systems can fill in many of the blanks.

I have no idea how it all will work, or what consumer version the new tech will be enabled, if at all, but it appears that the HMD optics are mapping the hands. If they can map the hands they can map anything like a pit, or keyboard. External optics cameras will map the body, hands, and facial expressions. As a side note, rumour has it that the new Gear VR smartphones will have depth sensors. Yes, we are the winners, as it appears that VR has almost unlimited monies being thrown at the tech required to make it happen. Not to mention that Oculus latest statements suggest they are still planning to sell their tech near cost to make VR as affordable as possible. Although that isn't good news for any of their competition, and could stunt some of the competition. If the competition doesn't price match, they have no choice but to develop better tech to compete, which won't be easy since Oculus has a huge highly talented VR work force, and have bought quite a number of companies that are VR relevant. BUT it only takes one man to come up with the right idea.:)

Exactly why Oculus is creating new tech, and buying companies that are creating new tech. This will continue until VR/AR is the size of sunglasses, and beyond.

I never read the short statement or watched the video in the Oculus blog until now, about their purchase of Pebbles-interfaces. I think Vive's laser system is great, but wonder if this tech may be why Luckey and company might be more interested in optical tracking over laser. Combining inside/out, outside/in, optical tracking. This tech could eventually work very well for people with pits, as the Pebbles tech also tracks depth, so the system would know exactly where your hands are within the cockpit environment. No glove or Touch input required. Should also eventually work for those that need to see their keyboard, hotas systems. https://www.oculus.com/en-us/blog/pebbles-interfaces-joins-oculus/

Oculus has been doing standup demos with dual tracking long before anyone even knew Valve was bringing a headset to the market. Oculus stopped "advertising" but didn't stop working on a better solution, especially for the commercial market, but they also understood it would only be a small part of the consumer VR headset market, with safety issues, ease of setup issues, and there were few if any software's in development for that kind of movement. That said I'm sure Vive will have atleast one decent movement sim/game bundled with their headset. Its very difficult to say which solution will be better until they hit the consumer market. In my long experience many reviewers are lacking in overall knowledge of the subject, or have an agenda, which can be very misleading. The VR developers are talking about having VR stations at places like BestBuy, so it should be possible to make a much better decision on which hardware will be better for our particular needs.

I usually like to upgrade my system before any new software/peripheral is released, but this time there are too many unknowns, about the VR hardware, best gpu's/drivers, and DCS World 1.5/2 VR optimizations to make a valid decision on the best possible system.

I partially agree, but few if any reviewers stated they were reviewing the respective initial release packages, they were comparing prototype systems, suggesting that Oculus was only developing a seated experience. That's definitely misleading. Release package specs, and actual release dates are still an unknown. In most cases you can almost guarantee hardware/software delays.

I no longer have DCS installed on my system, and have been waiting for DCS World 1.5/2 before reinstalling. Will I need a basic copy of DCS installed before installing 1.5 beta, or will installing the 1.5 beta install everything?

Yes, BUT as I've said many time before, it was a very poor, and misleading comparison. They were comparing two Vive tracking units against one Rift camera, and preferred it because it allowed more freedom of movement, and immersion, completely ignoring, or were unaware of the fact that two Rift cameras could do the same movement with low latencies. Another factor to be aware of is the Vive laser system is much more expensive to produce than the Oculus Constellation system. I agree about the respective inputs, and think a good Hotas systems should be more immersive for flight sims. UNLESS as I've suggested before that the Touch/Wand units could have some sort of docking quick connect/disconnect system so they could be used as a stick/throttle, and a clickable cockpit solution. That could be very immersive, but not so sure the tracking would be precise enough for decent stick response.

I have a full Hotas and VAC system and seldom have to use my keyboard or look at my Hotas to use it. If someday VR is as immersive as I think it can be, then that will be an obstacle that most people will have no problem adjusting too. That said, I mentioned in a forum post a few months ago about having docking stations for the Touch units so that they could be used as a Stick and Throttle, with an easy quick connect/disconnect system where you could also use the Touch inputs for selecting and moving switches etc. I have no idea if the Touch inputs will be precise enough to use as a stick and throttle. If they are.... have no doubt that some people will make their own docking stations.

There are currently a lot of arguments, pros and cons, over which solution is better, Vive's Lighthouse Lasers or Oculus's Constellation Cameras. I'm not sure how well either will work with a virtual cockpit, or a home built cockpit. I suppose they can link the Wands, or Touch units movement to the mouse. if that's the case then IMHO the current Touch dexterity could be more immersive for throwing switches and turning dials than the Wand dexterity.

DCS received a Vive prototype a month or so ago. They've just started looking at the "possibility" of adding Vive support. So far indications are good. That said I doubt very much if that support could be implemented by the time the Vive is shipped, especially if the Vive does actually make the end of year release date. Hopefully DCS will be able to state which VR unit they were able to implement best, if Vive support is available by the time the Rift ships. Reviewers have stated they've seen no difference in latencies etc between the Rift and Vive tracking systems. One may be better than the other, but if people see no difference, then its mute. Luckey stated they preferred the camera option because it was easier to track body movement, and facial expression. I like what Vive is doing, and don't care which one is the better product. I've never been a fanboy of one product over another, like Nvidea/Amd gpus, and just buy the one that better suits my needs. I may sound like a Oculus fan boy, but I'm just countering the arguments made by those that can't say how good Vive is without making untrue statements about the Rift. Like... Vive is a full movement VR system, while the Rift is just a sitting experience.

Oculus has had standing demos for quite sometime, they just had people standing on 4 x4 mat. When you felt the edge of the mat you weren't supposed to go any farther. Oculus has stated you can move much farther, but weren't pushing it for safety reasons. So no Oculus isn't exclusively a sitting system, as other people and reviewers have suggested. That said I see no reason to have to walk around my cockpit. ;) As far as price, I'm guessing if Oculus still plans to sell their hardware at cost and in the two to three hundred range then. Oculus headset, one tracking unit, and an game pad input thrown in by Microsoft to get their foot in the VR door, will probably be in the three hundred dollar range. Vive has stated their hardware won't be cheap, so I'm guessing their Vive Headset, 2 tracking units, and two wands will come in around five hundred dollar range. I don't see the Oculus package of a Rift Headset, two tracking units, and two Touch inputs being higher than five hundred dollars. That said, Price and Inputs don't matter that much to me, so I will buy the headset with the best specs, that supports the sims I want to fly. The only tough choice that I might face, is that Vive states better specs than the Rift at preorder time, but there haven't been any flight sims that have completed or even started Vive implementation. :doh:

All we know is that Vive said their hardware won't be cheap and Oculus has suggested that want to sell their hardware near cost, and make their money on the software side. Oculus has said there is no point in selling their hardware without a lot of available software, so they have been agressively funding third parties and have created their own software development company. This suggests that the Oculus could be significantly cheaper. If this hold true Vive better come up with a killer app to help sell their hardware. Preorders for both unit should start before the end of this year, so it won't be long before we have accurate pricing.

Reading the review people that haven't follow VR closely will assume that Oculus doesn't have full movement solution by comparing a Vive unit with "two" trackers, against a Rift unit with "one" tracker. That said I'm not sure if we will be able to preorder two trackers, or have to wait and buy the Touch inputs that would include the other tracker. One tracker will be fine for the majority of VR users that prefer cfs, or racing sims, while two tracking units will be popular with those that want more movement. I doubt that Oculus will make the mistake of selling only one tracker, and not have an option to buy two trackers with the first preorders.

I have seen no reason "so far" not to believe why Oculus, Luckey, prefer their camera tracking setup. They have almost unlimited funds, to test all possible solutions. I don't currently see the Vive unit as being better. Reviewers seemed to prefer the Vive unit when it came out, not because the headset was better, but because of the Vive wands, and ability to move around in a larger area than what Oculus was demonstrating. Reviewers saw little difference between the headset specs, and latency of the tracking solutions. Not to mention that many reviewers were comparing the Vive to an old Oculus DK2 prototype without inputs. The Oculus prototype tracking solution can track in an area just as big as the Vive unit, but Oculus has seen no reason to demonstrate that movement as there were few if any software developers writing software to take advantage of that movement. Not to mention that the Oculus touch inputs appear to allow more dexterity, and more versatility than the Vive wands. That said things can easily change before the consumer release. We won't know all the facts until these units become available for preorder. I haven't made a decision yet on which unit is better, but I'm leaning toward the Rift. I'll wait for more info before making a final decision. That said currently the headset specs appear very close, but I prefer the current Oculus input solution. Oculus should have a lead in content, since they've been funding, and developing more content for a couple of years longer than Vive. Vive will probably need a killer app to win that category. Price point could be the Vive killer if Oculus still plans to sell their hardware at cost. If that's the case, even if Vive releases their hardware a few months sooner, people will preorder the Rift unless the Vive is selling a better spec package. So far Vive is suggesting that there will be only a few Vive units sold this year, with the bulk being available next year. Also HTC appears to be on a downswing, but no word if it will effect the Vive release dates, but it appears to have affected the amount of Vive units that might be available this year. A major factor in my decision will be how well DCS is able to implement Vive and Rift support. There are still far too many unanswered questions.

I selected the B17 only because the Lanc wasn't available. Just love the Lanc with its four Merlins and large bombload.

According to Palmer the reason Oculus went with the camera tracking system over other like Vive's system is that the Rift camera system could track "everything" including body and facial expressions.

I'm sure the lessons learned by Carmack will serve Oculus well when technology improvements allow for future consumer Rifts to run untethered. Carmack is definitely one of the smartest VR people Oculus has hired, but I'm sure Abrash, and quite a few others of the hundreds of new hires they've made are no slouches either.

Oculus and Vive fully understand that gaming is the first step, as public enthusiasts are the only ones that have the hardware, or willing to spend the money on the hardware to run early consumer version VR HMD's effectively. Its also a relatively cheap investment for most businesses as the tech and software evolves to better serve them. Its hard to believe that Cameron can't see the difference between watching 3D on a TV, and being transported inside the TV into the world of Virtual Reality. You'll never get presence watching a TV screen no matter how good the 3D effect is. Comparing 3D TV and Virtual Reality is quite frankly a ridiculous comparison. My guess is that Cameron is wrong, and Facebook, Google, Microsoft, Samsung, Sony, etc etc are investing billions for good reason.

Oculus Interview Palmer Luckey interview with interesting questions and answers. Wearing glasses in the CV1 shouldn't effect FOV.

My VR chair will definitely need some sort of swivel mechanism, as I no longer have the flexibility required to easily check six. TrackIR is an old mans crutch. :)

Its too early to tell if its worth buying the consumer versions of VR yet. The DK2 is simply not good enough nor is the DCS software optimized enough for VR. BUT we can't say it won't work basing our judgement on prototypes and early implementations of DCS VR software. Things are changing. We do know that the consumer version of the VR headsets will be better, and DCS EDGE should further optimize DCS VR software. Hopefully Wags will have more info on that front soon.

I can see people creating docking stations in the stick and throttle positions for the Oculus touch units. A quick release, would also allow you to adjust cockpit switches etc with your left and/or right hand using the Oculus touch units instead of a mouse. Its possible that it could be a very realistic feeling, and immersive setup. :)

We should be able to see the HUD just fine with the CV1, or Vive. Also DCS2's new option to select a larger Icon representing distant aircraft could also help people using the Rift/Vive. :) In a few months Vive should be releasing its price and headset specs if they are still on course for an end of year release. I would expect Oculus to release the price and specs of the Rift for preorder at the same time to steal some of Vive's thunder. Especially since the Rift will probably be quite abit cheaper as their headset won't initially come with inputs, other than the xbox controllers thrown in by Microsoft. Wags should also know in the next few months whether or not DCS will also Vive support, along with Rift support, and if they do, will that support be ready by the end of this year. Still some big questions to be answered before deciding which VR headset to buy. I kinda like that Rift won't initially come with inputs. If I do decide to go with the Rift it should be much cheaper, and even more so if they still plan to sell the Rift close to cost.