Squiffy

If you are starting at 30K ft. make them follow you down. Get them to commit at transonic speeds, like over 350. Pop your speed brakes and pull out. Watch them continue down and auger in with their thick wings an non flying stabs. Keep your speed up unless you can whittle down their numbers and spread them out. If you can keep a good range on them their canons won't hit you as easily. Practice fighting in the vertical. See if you can loop with them and score hits near the top of a loop and then on the diving side. Close but don't overshoot. When you follow them in the vertical roll out early and hammer head, yoyo turn to cut the loop short so you don't stall out. Again close in a dive. there are a couple .lua hacks you can do to help practice but you can't use them online. Increase your muzzle velocity in the shell_table.lua under weapons to about 880m/s and in the MiG-15bis.lua reduce their g limit to about 4 to 6 gs and max bank angle to 75-80 degrees. This will limit their g tolerance and make it more realistic compared to the Sabre with g suit. Let me know if you need help with the files. Others can help here too.

Awesome!

Wow isn't that something! ;)

Just a nice screenshot after the last update. I reloaded my lua edits except for the MiG. :D

Good point. Who knows?

Yes, ATC will tell you but to be honest, it's hard to discern some numbers in their radio voice. Sometimes "Two" sounds exactly like "Zero" and it's not even a "Five" or a "Niner." I normally fly out of Kobuleti and it happens from time to time.

Awe nuts! Did the low angle rear light reflection get fixed? The glare on the instrument panel? That may have led to this. It was way strong, when taking off West in the morning with sun behind you.

Of course. Still wonder why one has a line missing in the matrix when they were based on each other supposedly.

Haha Javelina :D Their Rolls Royce was better, but in rocketry, "Our Germans were better than their Germans." Love that Von Braun quote. :D

Ah interesting! And I did note that the matrix for the Sabre skips the Mach 0,1 line, implying it's the same as 0.0 or static thrust. This eliminates the "blip" I thought I saw in the first place, which again makes it moot, just like the fact that's it's AI SFM and not player input modelling. Changing the line entries in the list within the ~Airplace.lua does have an effect. (Not SFM) You can reduce g specs, active weapon distance, thurst, speed, g tolerance and other cool things. This is where we discovered the problem with the MiG-19 g tolerance being 200% of the natural scale in game. An obvious error that was corrected. Editing some of these figures has resulted in good dog fighting engagements in my practice offline against AI. Expert is still wicked but fights are a bit more fair in the lower levels of AI.

Still good at 2700 kg max thrust. :D And a 100 kg boost at Mach 0.2. ;)

Haha, yes of course. What I found odd was that the MiG-15 didn't really have all that much more if that, and I wanted to understand why the SFM for the MiG had NO difference in thrust output between Mach=0 and Mach =0.1. As I look at the matrix again I see that the grid is different. Sabre skips M=0.1 and goes directly to 0.2, implying the same figure for 0.1 so I guess that's OK at this point. The MiG does have less loss from 0.2 to 0.3 which is the sweet spot I suppose. Also it's lower wing loading and higher trust to weight ratio explains a lot of it's known climbing advantage. So I guess this is a false alarm for a couple reasons. One, the apparent "nerf" is only due to the omitted line and it still covers the same range. Two, SFM is used by AI and not players AFAIK so all of this may be moot. I did cheat the Sabres max trust up nearly 1000 pounds in the list and it seems to have made a difference, albeit totally fake. ;) It is pretty neat to dance and float with the MiGs at zero G over the top. :D

I am curious now that I decided to hack a little further into the performance of both of the Korean era ships. I looked at the engine performance figures, the matrices in the .luas and the facts about thrust performance with speed and altitude. But what I found may have been the easiest explanation of the "Sputnik" like performance of the MiG while the Sabre got doggedly slow at low energy. Now yes the climb performance was decidedly better for the thicker winged, higher thrust to weight ratio of the MiG, but this has more to due with weight and wing loading for the most part. Unless I am missing a critical factor of the engine performance of the MiG's Rolls Royce knock off (haha, get my digs in) the engine matrix figures tell a different tale. First glance just now made it seem like the Sabre's engine was nerfed. It may be so in real life due to engine design issues but the raw numbers show a distinct "blip" in the matrices. Check this out, Sabre first: table_data = { -- M Pmax Pfor [1 ] = { 0 , 26296 , 26296 }, [2 ] = { 0.2 , 24072 , 24072 }, [3 ] = { 0.3 , 23441 , 23441 }, [4 ] = { 0.4 , 23088 , 23088 }, [5 ] = { 0.5 , 22981 , 22981 }, [6 ] = { 0.55 , 23011 , 23011 }, [7 ] = { 0.6 , 23088 , 23088 }, then MiG: table_data = {-- M Pmax Pfor { 0.0 , 26000 , 26000 }, { 0.1 , 26000 , 26000 }, { 0.2 , 24430 , 24430 }, { 0.3 , 23040 , 23040 }, { 0.4 , 22090 , 22090 }, { 0.5 , 21490 , 21490 }, { 0.6 , 21310 , 21310 }, { 0.7 , 21400 , 21400 }, Note the first 2 lines of each. The Sabre drops off at the second line, the MiG holds steady through the second line. When fighting in the vertical near stall, this is critical. It may be true, but for engines that supposedly had similar max thrust potential, this clear difference at low speed seemed a little off. This is independent of weight and wing loading which could still explain the known performance difference. Those in the know please chime in. I'm curious.

Dont't worry, the Sabre is still a good ship. When it come s to dogfighting, you may notice the points above. You will see shotgun like dispersion after a few bursts and not much effective range. After some time to get familiar, the next level will make these points more noticeable. The MiG has crazy strong climb at or near stall and the massive cannon will make the inaccurate machine gun dynamics more apparent. Roll rates are pretty accurate but player control at low speed in the Sabre will be more difficult than AI in the MiG. My worn out Cougar makes this all the worse but you will do a lot of control correction and "opposite lock." My gimbals have an issue at stick back near max where it's not balanced left and right, probably from the weight of the stick and hand creating a bias to the left in wear. I get some roll out at 90' bank which interferes with scissoring and circles. Also the sensors are spiky so I lose full back at end of travel. You have to wiggle the stick or tap it back a few times to clean the contacts and keep the elevator full aft. Most of these issues probably don't occur with new equipment.

The Sabre is a great ship. You may want to tweak you M3 50s though. The updated APIT rounds are better but not great. Use an editor like Notepad++ to reduce the barrel heat and warp effect by about 75% in the F-86.lua. Look at the equation and make the changes there. Then in the shelltable.lua in the scripts-database-weapons folder, find the M2: ##shell("M2_50_aero_AP", _("M2_50_aero_AP") and ##shell("M20_50_aero_APIT", _("M20_50_aero_APIT") and edit the v0 to this: ##v0 = 883, for a more realistic muzzle velocity for engaging jets. Adjust your seat height up several clicks so you can see down over the nose some more Then forget the pipper and use the tracers to see your "hose arc" and dead eye marksman your own solutions. Also add bullet life to 9: ##life_time = 9.0 back in the 86.lua, extend the effective fire range out to this: ##tbl.effective_fire_distance = 2100 The result is very satisfying without being overkill. Especially being able to snipe leading shots from large distances which is a benefit of a machine gun over cannon.

Change the theme in the menus to F-86 not Caucuses.

Welcome Sky Dancer! It sounds like you are in good shape regardless. I still use my old worn out stock gimbal Cougar and ham fist my way around the dead zones and stick weight biases with abandon. If it weren't for my collector cars, F1, and tuning hobby, I would buy the latest tech or even VR. You should be fine! "Monrning Squadron leader, how goes it?" :D

Yes! Bob, please let us know. I'ts pretty much all I fly and I just am not ready to share my skill in mulitplayer. The Torque and PFactor of the props also drive me up the wall. The slop in my worn out Cougar make slow flight and fine adjustments pretty silly. For deflection shooting in the Sabre and Mustang, I have the 4 way hat switch on my throttle set on the y axis for seat position. I also have TrackIR and use padlock. It helps a lot to click in a couple notched of seat height up so you can see down over the nose some more. Usually enough that the pipper is not visible all the time. I track my tracers more and stay with short bursts to see the bullet arc. This way, you can "hose" the bandit a lot easier. When slow and close like at the top of a loop or vertical, the pipper makes more sense, but at higher g and tighter turns, use your tracers and hose them with what you see out in front.

Haha, nice thread restore guys. With all the updates I'm not surprised. I am actually a musicologist and former music librarian now cross trained for teens and young adults. Video games and Anime cartoons haha! But to the point, the Sabre menu music is 50s rock n roll. It's early style with jazz style semi-acoustic electric guitars, like Chuck Berry and so on. Rock n Roll grew out of Jazz just like Rhythm n Blues. Big Band swing even predates WWII so it is definitely 1930-40s stuff. But the 50s brought us rock n roll so it is timely for that. I am not sure what tune it is and wouldn't be surprised if it sounds like one you know. Most pop, jazz and rock tunes followed the 12 bar blues chord progression, I IV V IV I for all you music theory nerds out there. I will look for those tunes you mentioned and see. I was actually a renaissance specialist and choral singer. Had a pro gig with the St. Paul's choir school in Cambridge, which also serves as the Harvard Catholic Center, for on to 17 years before I retired. Yesterday was our first mass back after quarantine! I still like and use the epic orchestral battle theme from the Caucuses menu. edit* I have since changed my menu theme to the Sabre. I guess Big Band still applies to describe the ensemble but the style is definitely more towards Rock n Roll. Sock Hop kinda thing.

Awesome Bob! Thanks so much and really glad you are here! The cannons on the 100 must have been something!

Thanks. But is that a missing texture error or not? Maybe a low light angle issue on the model? Been away from this stuff for a long time and not really fluent on the DCS or recent generation anyway.

Now that modding is back in play. Consider adding a bit more muzzle velocity to your M3 50 caliber rounds. Go into the scripts-database-weapons-shell_table.lua. and about 1/5 a page scroll down will land on the M2 and M20 50 cal rounds. Edit BOTH to 890 m/s muzzle velocity. Do this in Notepad++ or compatible editor. A recent update added 870 to the Apit but you want 890 on both. In the 1950s they weren't using crap WWII cartridges anymore, especially after encountering MiGs. In the Sabre.lua, edit the effective range out to 2000 meters and the lifetime up to 10 for some quality rifle work from these weapons. The barrel warp is crazy too. You can edit the heat et al down by 75% Now on the flight model side, I gripe about MiGs having cymax greater than 1 at v=0 which is impossible. If you mean Mach 0.15, then the matrix needs to show that. V=0 is lift coeff =0 no matter how you slice it. However, this is also true in the Sabre.lua! So even the Sabre is cheaty in this respect. The SFM has cymax at about 1.1 or so in both aircraft. Roll rates should still be a little more different even though they are in the right proportions with Sabre better than MiG. Also note, dive kills are possible in the Sabre. I have locked 2 pursuing Migs into compressibilty dives at about 380 kts before popping the speed brake and pulling out. The MiGs have kept going. G tolerance on the MiGs is a bit high too, you can cut that down to 0.20 g suit and max gs down to 5 or 6. 8 Gs in sustained high speed dog fights? I don't think so, not without a g suit. Diving away is actually a pretty good defense tactic after the updates. Be sure not to get low e when out numbered. You can with space but not when you can get snagged from behind.

And modding is back in play. Maybe just keep your folders clean of extra files while the manifest file is in place. I suspect this is an upgrade file architecture for online play in the future. Edited luas will load now. They were not meant to be banned in the open beta.

Thanks Nightstorm. I confirmed and have gone back to tweaking. I left the folders clean with only the modded file and saved the originals elsewhere. I figured this would keep the manifest file happy. And for the Sabre fans out there, muzzle velocity for the M3s at 890 m/s is the sweet spot. Do both M2 and M20 APIT in the shell_table.lua. This actually was not effected like the aircraft files but still, it makes a big difference. You can also tweak the effective range for the Sabre out to 2000 m. This is very cool when e fighting in loops. Supersonic 50 rounds keep the MiGs honest over the top. Thanks for the fix! :D

I can confirm that edited .luas in the aircraft core mods folders do now work. I have kept them clean of other files and saved the originals elsewhere but modding is active again. I can also say that 890m/s is the sweet spot for the M3 Browning ammo. I also tweaked a little more effective range to really let the Sabres snipe with the 50s. Especially rewarding at low speed, high angle off and long range over the top in loops and hammerheads. I have cut the barrel heat and warp down by 75%. In defense of the original files from ED/Belsimtek, the effective range and muzzle velocities of the MiG cannons are pretty fair. I wondered about it and checked. And I do need a new stick! :D