everest101

@Dangerzone, thanks for your tip. I will look into this work-around and report back ASAP in case other's are after a solutions. Later... ...after verification & setup testing of the WinAuth app I can confirm that this approach has solve and unlocked my free trial 2FA capabilities...thus allowing me to test 3 planes before end of the 15th anniversary saving oppertunities. Thanks again @Dangerzone for the fine tip that you have proposed. For my part, this posting is solved. Everest...Out!

@Dangerzone, thanks for your tip. I will look into this work-around and report back ASAP in case other's are after a solutions. Later...

Trying befor buying is very very important. I allows the customer base to take a decision before commiting to buy....but, I do not have a (so called) smart phone or tablet and cannot configure the 2 factor authentication. Cannot use Google authentication app because do not have a device to d/l it to!!! Why don't you introduce a method to send the code to our email address in our profile...that would solve my problem for Free Trials (we receive the code, enter it on the DCS web page & bingo) . Or, since my email is a Google Gmail account, set up a method to validate authentication via Google Gmail account authentication....simple and it doesn't require a dumb mobile phone! But what is strange is that I have tried out Free Trials not too long ago (a year ago or so) without using Google authentication method....strange. Anyways, what is the work around for this? I have come across trials of some ships which I could not tolerate (won't mention them here to not impact on DCS)...and I did not buy those ships. If I can no longer test the ships before I buy them, well, I will just stop buying!!! I already have to many ships anyways! Thanks for a quick solution... Regards,

I do not have a (so called) smart phone or tablet and cannot configure the 2 factor authentication. Cannot use Google authentication app because do not have a device to d/l it to!!! Why don't you introduce a method to send the code to our email address in our profile...that would solve my problem for Free Trials. Or, since my email is a Google Gmail account, set up a method to validate authentication via Google Gmail account authentication....simple and it doesn't require a dumb mobile phone! But what is strange is that I have tried out Free Trials not too long ago (a year ago or so) without using Google authentication method....strange. Anyways, what is the work around for this? Thanks for a quick solution... Regards, Everest

Wow...an AVRO Arrow DCS plane in the works!!! Sounds excellent. So what is your Discord server...could you share that link here, thanks.

FYI, for me, using DCS MT with the Pimax-5K HMD has been solved and works great. See the following for details... @YoYo & others, I know that many of U approach OpenXR Toolkit with a 10 meter yardstick and want to avoid it, but U might want to give it a 2nd look using Turbo ON mode in the Toolkit...it might work for U guys as well. The Toolkit has many of the capabilities of Reshade & VRPerfKit. You can read on it here...https://mbucchia.github.io/OpenXR-Toolkit/ I hope the tip helps you as well. Good luck in solving your problems and that you may exploit the benefits of DCS MT. Regards, Everest...Out!

I pretty well have the APP choices you suggested EXCEPT I did not have OpenXR Toolkit 1.3.2 Turbo set to ON. Big difference!!! I would quality my setup as satisfactory, no more image stuttering / jittering in the Pimax 5K HMD. Behavior as good as in ST...looks like my problem is solved! Many thanks @mbucchia for this break through tip. I can now enjoy DCS OB MT with my HMD. Also @BIGNEWY, take note about this important news...that, DCS MT + HAGS OFF + Pimax Client 1.10 + PimaxXR 0.3.4 + OpenXR Toolkit 1.3.2 Turbo ON solves my problem with the Pimax HMD. PS.. My successful text run was using PiTool v1.0.1.284 instead of Pimax Client 1.10 which is OK, for now. Will upgrade to client version a/r. PSS...My HAGS setting was already set to OFF. The big change happened in setting the OpenXR Toolkit 1.3.2 Turbo to ON. PROBLEM SOLVED!!!

Thanks for your reply. 2 Questions... Could you clarify what U mean by HAGS off? Where do U set this, in Pimax Client? And is Pimax Client 1.1 equivalent to using PiTool v284? I dont like Pimax Client but I may need to migrate to it for MT. But clearly, I need to double check using your suggested APP combination and report back here.

I understand your point and I have supplied 2 dcs log file of my test runs 1 & 2 in the initial post of this topic. But I can't tell if they reveil anything! When you say to provide a track, you probably mean a track of the mission flight itself, right? But I don't see how the track could provide information about a stuttering problem in the GUI screens of the game. You can get it here...https://www.mediafire.com/file/65qbthbv74jooxf/DCS_OB_Stuttering_in_MP_screen_Pimax5K_Left_Eye_2023.04.23_-_20.13.25.01.mp4/file Check out my media fire short mp4 video regarding the stuttering in the MP GUI screen. It may not seem like strong stuttering but in the VR HMD, you are much closer to the image, it fills the view and is plain horrible. A track file will not help for the GUI screen stuttering. However, I will push the test to logging into a MP server to see if problem persists and record the whole ADVENTURE...the DCS log, the track, the dxdialog data and my HMD settings and report back here for @BIGNEWY and PimaxXR maker @mbucchia. Will be back soon with all this... Regards.

Thanks for responding and providing feedback on this problem. Don't hesitate to count on me to provide more data on this...I will be happy to help. Regards,

Same problem persists with latest version of softwares... Software configuration: DCS World Open Beta v 2.8.4.39313 (latest) PiTool v1.0.1.284v PimaxXR v0.3.4 (latest) OpenXR Toolkit v1.3.2 (latest) To see a video about the stuttering problems see a short video I made showing Left eye VR image captured off my primary display...https://www.mediafire.com/file/65qbthbv74jooxf/DCS_OB_Stuttering_in_MP_screen_Pimax5K_Left_Eye_2023.04.23_-_20.13.25.01.mp4/file @mbucchia, @BIGNEWY & @YoYo, any thoughts?

OK @YoYo, thanks for the tip...I have your info via your signature...soo, You are using an HP Reverb G2 and are having same problems as me with my Pimax5k. I am impressed to see that you are getting these problems on the PC rig described in your signature!!! @BIGNEWY, please take notes... Clearly, ED will need to fix these OpenXR + MT problems... Severe VR view stuttering in the GUI screens (especially the MP GUI screens), Minor VR view stuttering in the ME GUI screen, VR view stuttering settling into the main GUI screen. See the video I took some days ago about the stuttering...see https://www.mediafire.com/file/65qbthbv74jooxf/DCS_OB_Stuttering_in_MP_screen_Pimax5K_Left_Eye_2023.04.23_-_20.13.25.01.mp4/file But what this all tells me is that there is a serious problem persisting with MT + OpenXR and problem seem to be active with several HMD brands...at least for 2 brands (Pimax & HP). Are there others? If yes, lets hear you!!! I have raised a ticket in this MT forum section regarding MT + OpenXR problems with the Pimax HMDs and gotten ZERO feedback regarding the problem. See, I could add HP Reverb G2 after Pimax5K in the title of that post but my point here is that clearly the problem is spread across HMD brands. The main point HERE is that OpenXR + MT is buggy...and the buggyness seem similar across HMD brands. So this VR stuttering problem is REAL and needs to be looked at by ED in some form or way. In the mean time ST game running goes on until ED RECOGNIZES & FIXES this problem...but lets first see RECOGNITION! Finally, @YoYo, OpenVR support by ED sounds crappy but it may be necessary for ED to focus on the real problems of the OpenXR implementations. OpenXR is the NOW and the FUTURE of VR. Yet, OpenVR VR rendering is saving the face of DCS ST VR gaming for the time being (at least for the G2 folks). But VR image stuttering with OpenXR needs to be addressed by ED for sucess with the future of MT. For the Pimax folks, @mbucchia, could the OpenXR problems in DCS also be linked to PimaxXR? Nooo idea!!! Lets give @BIGNEWYsome time to exchange with the appropriate ED team to get some forme of feedback on this subject...

? What signature? Sorry @YoYo but I do not see any of your signature information...which is why I asked the question! So what is your HMD brand? I have a Pimax5k HMD and I think we have the same problem with OpenXR in MT...which is interesting. If 2 HMD brands have the same problem with OpenXR and MT then maybe their are other brands that fall into the same basket of problems...and that would be serious enough to press this problem with ED. Bare with me, I use the same work-around as you and revert back to ST except that I go the ST + OpenXR + PimaxXR route which is way more stable than MT + OpenXR + PimaXR. I don't know why but, on my PC rig, OpenXR in MT is just a KO way of running the game. Ps...For your info, my PC & VR data is as follows: Hardware configuration: Mobo: MSI X570-A PRO/PCIe 4 CPU: AMD RYZEN 9 3900X (12 CORE) GPU: EVGA-RTX 3080Ti RAM: DDR4-32 GB (3200MHZ wt XMP) HMD: PIMAX-5K SUPER Software configuration: DCS World Open Beta v 2.8.4.39313 (latest) PiTool v1.0.1.284v - Version 284 is required as per PimaxXR requirements. PimaxXR v0.3.4 (latest) - This app is the runtime required for OpenXR to work with PiTool and to bypass SteamVR's OpenVR implementation. PimaxXR runtime is needed to avoid DCS kick starting SteamVR's OpenVR. Install PimaxXR and make sure that PimaxXR is selected as the OpenXR runtime. This also forces SteamVR runtime to use it's internal OpenXR runtime implementation. OpenXR Toolkit v1.3.2 (latest)

You never mentioned the brand name & model of the head mounted display (HMD) that you are using. What is it?

What you are showing in your image is running the DCS Steam version where, yes, you can specify to use the OpenXR runtime built into SteamVR. What I am refering to is the DCS non-Steam version where one cannot force OpenXR as you are showing. In my version of DCS I cannot force using the internal OpenXR runtime of SteamVR. So my version of SteamVR uses the OpenVR runtime of SteamVR...quit different! What is wierd is that when I use PimaXR, my SteamVR shows exactly what is in your picture but, The game is totally unstable, especially in multiplayer...so, right now, I can only use SteamVR's OpenVR runtime in MT since it is more stable than forcing OpenXR. Its a complicated situation but at least I can benefit from MT with SteamVR. VR is smooth and stable. Hopefully, OpenXR will get fixed for use with PimaxXR.

OpenXR use in MT is still a problem for me even after the latest release of DCS OB v2.8.4.38947. With this latest patch, the same KO behavior originally described in this topic are still present. For me, using MT + OpenXR with my Pimax 5k HMD is totally KO. What save the day is that MT + SteamVR now works much better although FPS gains don't seem to be up to speed...no big gain over using ST + SteamVR run method. But at least, MT seems to be doing its word from the CPU perspective. The many AMD CPUs seem to be much busier than running the game in ST. So I quess I will need to swallow the SteamVR run method untill OpenXR gets fixed. So be it!

Isn't OpenVR supported via using SteamVR (which is using OpenVR internally)? You say that OpenXR will need to be used instead. OK but for me, with the Pimax 5k HMD, OpenXR + MT is barely usefull in single mission playing...even though some jitter settles into some of the GUI screens. However in MP, the game is unusable...too much jitter in the images projected into the HMD in VR. OpenXR seems to be a implementation direction for ED. There is, for sure, a plan to fix the jittering in VR with the OpenXR run method on Pimax HMDs but I don't need to know about the plan and I am sure that ED is working on it .

I don't get it...isn't OpenVR supported via SteamVR? What I have noticed it that, with the latest release of DCS OB v2.8.4.38947, I can now run DCS OB in MT while using SteamVR. My understanding with respect to SteamVR is that it works, internally, with OpenVR. So why are we saying that MT with OpenVR is not supported?!? Actually my latest test with MT, since this latest update of DCS OB, is that MT now works OK with SteamVR for my Pimax5k HMD. For me, it is actually the ONLY way to use MT smoothly...although I notice no big gain in FPS in MT with SteamVR. While not being a problem, for me, this is still good news. Will ED work on making the SteamVR MT run method better from a performance perspective? Hopefully yes, but this is not my preference...instead, What I would like to see is DCS OB to work better in MT with the OpenXR run method. I get 30 FPS improvements in MT with OpenXR on the Pimax5k HMD. But graphics stability in the HMD is KO & unplayable in multi-player!!! Severe jitter that settles in MP makes MP game unusable. I would much prefer using MT with OpenXR to bypass using SteamVR and it's processing overhead. But until OpenXR + MT method is fixed, I cannot use it with my gear. Hopefully, ED will fixe the OpenXR problems & in the mean time forcing SteamVR will be the way to go. This thread is named "SteamVR causing crash on startup" Seems to me that this has been solved with the latest DCS OB patch v2.8.4.38947. Problem solved? Well in some ways it is solved for me.

Thanks for clarifying those acronyms... But I don't use MR or FSR. As I no longer use SteamVR to run the Pimax 5k HMD and instead exploit DCS's OpenXR and also using PimaxXR + OpenXR Toolkit, the MR & FSR features are covered via the toolkit. FOV adjustments via the toolkit improves FPS. I realise however that not all HMD VR users can go down this roadmap of APP usage. A new DCS upgrade just came out (DCS OB 2.8.4.38947)...lets hope it solves most of our MT problems

Not only should ED not fix this colored Shkval bug, but they should improve on it and add night vision to the Shkval. This would transform the KA-50 III into a night attack helicopter. Keeping the colored Shkval and adding night vision would be some SERIOUS improvement to this ship!!! If the high fidelity pilots say No, No, don't touch this, them ED should just make Shkval colorization and night vision optional. Just untick the options to not use the color and night vision options...like that, everyone is happy!

A bug??? I call this an improvement!!!

Sorry, but I am getting an acronym blank!!! MR?, FSR? ...what do you refer to?

Really!!! Being a KA-50 III pilot, I have to check this out in MT + OpenXR + SP missions and will report back ASAP. But thanks @LeCuvierfor the heads up...

On my PC, I can use OpenVR (via PiTools for my Pimax5k Super HMD). However, I must call SteamVR indirectly...by not specifying "--enable_SteamVR" in the shortcut command line. Instead, if I just specify "--enable_VR"t. The game handle starting SteamVR (which uses OpenVR), starts the MT game but with no benefits (no fps improvement or faster loading time) from the MT code. In other words, for me, MT + indirect SteamVR is just not worth it! I tested this for SP missions. Don't know the impacts with MP but also not worth testing... Regards,

True, operating DCS OB with OpenXR by itself is not that great. To make things nicer, use OpenXR Toolkit. With the toolkit, you can fiddle around with colors, fov, etc... In my case, using the toolkit is a must. If U like, I could make a image collection of the Toolkit setups that I use. Also, with my PC, MT does work with OpenXR using my Pimax 5k Super HMD. However, it only works with ME single player (SP) missions. In multi-payer (MP), the MT experience is plain horrible! In MT, the HMD images jump around & is truly unstable and unpleasant. Regards,