Where is everyone (online)

[Ultra]

I think the biggest problem with the Euro servers is the lack of airfield defenses. If you think you can run back to base and get help from the AAA, good luck. Sometimes they won't even kill your tail if you drag him along your airfield at 10 meters. They are terrible shots.

 

It's an easy fix, just put some Gepards down there with at least some skill level and people will stop vulching and such. (because they'll get torn apart)

[klem]

I don't know why are you upset.

 

EDIT: WAIT! I wrote that about DoW server... not ACG:huh:

 

None of the things that I have said is in any way that is not clear what I wanted from the experience. I just shared what I feel. I didn't demand, I didn't tell you what to do... just gave you feedback. Here, let me type you how I would see a fix to those problems:

 

1.I don't like the flak thickness

2.I don't like the AI in MP

3.I don't like Vulching

 

All 3 can be changed by:

1. Adding less flak zones to the mission

2. Not put AI into the mission (except for bombers they are fine)

3. Admining the server so when somebody strafes people on the ground gets a warn and if he does it again then a kick. If he comes back do the same a ban for a week.

 

My aim was not to upset you. Just give feedback. I am sorry that it made you mad :(

 

It really does depend on what you are looking for. WWII (and early jets - Korean War) is still maturing in DCS and while there are a handful of servers to choose from they are mostly 'dogfight' servers, there does not seem to be a broad base of WWII "Mission Objective" servers yet where organised Squads can battle against each-other over the Objectives and win or lose the map that way. Of course a WWII map might encourage that. In MP combat "Objective oriented play" attracts a smaller niche of guys in an already small niche of the genre as a whole. Actually, Squads are still at an immature stage in DCS WWII. Our Squad has quite a few flyers in CoD and so far only a handful have joined DCS (although it's rapidly growing). We just need to find DCS servers supporting 80-100 players, some organised opposition and some decent missions. I know, I know, we don't have a server and we don't do much in the way of making missions (because we have no server). I admit we are mission flyers not mission creators and greatly appreciate the server providers.

 

When you see the low numbers in servers on-line, AI has value in that at least it pads out the combat opportunities. As already mentioned ACG intelligently balances the sides by spawning and de-spwaning AI to keep numbers balanced. I use GCI scripting I found in these forums to do something similar on my own small missions.

[IronJockel]

I think the biggest problem with the Euro servers is the lack of airfield defenses. If you think you can run back to base and get help from the AAA, good luck. Sometimes they won't even kill your tail if you drag him along your airfield at 10 meters. They are terrible shots.

 

It's an easy fix, just put some Gepards down there with at least some skill level and people will stop vulching and such. (because they'll get torn apart)

 

Actually the aaa hits pretty hard if the target is low and slow.

 

 

We don't use to much aaa defense cause they kill the frame rate if overused. Currently it's 6 aaa guns, all set on highest skill possible and indestructable.

Plus if the aaa is a 100% saviour people would tend to stay all the time in the "safe" zone.

I'm currently thinking about enabaling the aaa guns for CA players.

[Ultra]

Actually the aaa hits pretty hard if the target is low and slow.

 

 

We don't use to much aaa defense cause they kill the frame rate if overused. Currently it's 6 aaa guns, all set on highest skill possible and indestructable.

Plus if the aaa is a 100% saviour people would tend to stay all the time in the "safe" zone.

I'm currently thinking about enabaling the aaa guns for CA players.

 

I've haven't been on the ACG in awhile but if it's anything like what JG27 has on their server it's very inconsistent. It's just annoys me when an enemy plane flies over the base at 70m and 3 AAA guns are all missing the whole time (and all missing in the same spot no less). It happens fairly often.

 

People wouldn't just stay in the safe zone. You run a dogfight server. The point is to go out and kill other players. Your not going to kill anything flying circles around your own airfield.

 

I think allowing CA is a very good idea.

 

I'm just saying, try putting one Gepard in there and see what happens. :D

[Nirvi]

We don't use to much aaa defense cause they kill the frame rate if overused. Currently it's 6 aaa guns, all set on highest skill possible and indestructable.

Plus if the aaa is a 100% saviour people would tend to stay all the time in the "safe" zone.

I'm currently thinking about enabaling the aaa guns for CA players.

 

I would have a lot of fun with this:D

[Solty]

If I was to write a concept of standard scenario:

I would say that both bases should be between 10-15km away from each other. This is far enough so that people when they see an enemy don't run immediately to their base and close enough for the players to find each other over the land in between. Those heavy flak scripts could be used on the playable boarders so that people don't fly way too far from the fight.

 

With a playing field that has ground units that are meaninful during a game.

This means supply bases that would be targets for CAS, concentraion of ground units so that players don't have problems with finding them.

 

Meaningful combat is quite needed.

 

CA idea is nice I think. Do we have things like ZSU-57?

[IronJockel]

 

People wouldn't just stay in the safe zone. You run a dogfight server. The point is to go out and kill other players. Your not going to kill anything flying circles around your own airfield.

 

I think allowing CA is a very good idea.

 

I'm just saying, try putting one Gepard in there and see what happens. :D

 

I remember from Aces High and other sims that as soon as a player realized he is in a disadvantage, he runned for the base luring his hunter to aaa instead of trying get rid of him by himself. On suchs a small map this is what will happen every time if the aaa is a 100% deathzone.

 

About CA. i will enable it for now and see what happens. I don't have the modul myself. So i have no option to test it myself properly.

[Ultra]

I remember from Aces High and other sims that as soon as a player realized he is in a disadvantage, he runned for the base luring his hunter to aaa instead of trying get rid of him by himself. On suchs a small map this is what will happen every time if the aaa is a 100% deathzone.

 

About CA. i will enable it for now and see what happens. I don't have the modul myself. So i have no option to test it myself properly.

 

That's my point, I think it's a legitimate strategy. When you're at a disadvantage you are suppose to run. I think we just disagree ;)

[IronJockel]

That's my point, I think it's a legitimate strategy. When you're at a disadvantage you are suppose to run. I think we just disagree ;)

 

In a campain mission or something like this yes, but not on a public server that has the goal to get people as fast as possible into dogfighting.

[IronJockel]

If I was to write a concept of standard scenario:

I would say that both bases should be between 10-15km away from each other. This is far enough so that people when they see an enemy don't run immediately to their base and close enough for the players to find each other over the land in between. Those heavy flak scripts could be used on the playable boarders so that people don't fly way too far from the fight.

 

With a playing field that has ground units that are meaninful during a game.

This means supply bases that would be targets for CAS, concentraion of ground units so that players don't have problems with finding them.

 

Meaningful combat is quite needed.

 

CA idea is nice I think. Do we have things like ZSU-57?

 

The last time we had "meaningful missions" the server stayed empty.

[Ultra]

The last time we had "meaningful missions" the server stayed empty.

 

It's an unfortunate fact, but the instant action servers do get a lot more attention than the hardcore servers.

 

I just don't get it, why do people like such properly simulated plane, but don't want to fly them in proper scenarios. It boggles the mind. :(

 

It's like saying I want to play ARMA, but only in 50m by 50m map and no vehicles ever. :doh:

 

I hope things change when the WWII map comes out, but of course it's a long ways away....

Edited May 6, 2015 by Ultra

[fastfreddie]

The last time we had "meaningful missions" the server stayed empty.

 

Hopefully you guys give it another shot and with the mod you guys run spotting is much easier than on other servers. TBH I wish other servers would all use your mod and add in the Mig/F86 to use on the Korean War Server. I wouldn't have to remove it everytime I want to jump on another server and the mod truly makes it a better experience.

 

I agree with others that the AAA is very ineffective in detering vulching but there is little you can do about that. Like you said ... adding more AAA units reduces everything to a slide show. DOW tried the auto destruct mode if they flew over the enemy airfield but they ran into problems with that also. Sadly we'll always have morons that get an enjoyable experience from shooting planes on takeoff but then complain about there being no one on the servers or they can't find anyone in the air to fight.

[IronJockel]

It's an unfortunate fact, but the instant action servers do get a lot more attention than the hardcore servers.

 

I just don't get it, why do people like such properly simulated plane, but don't want to fly them in proper scenarios. It boggles the mind. :(

 

It's like saying I want to play ARMA, but only in 50m by 50m map and no vehicles ever. :doh:

 

I hope things change when the WWII map comes out, but of course it's a long ways away....

 

CloD has a WW2 map and 90% of all dogfights in that game are low level over the channel :lol:

 

 

Event based missions and campains are the way to go.

[Solty]

CloD has a WW2 map and 90% of all dogfights in that game are low level over the channel :lol:

 

 

Event based missions and campains are the way to go.

 

You are right... but you need people for these events. To me it seems for now there are 3 or 4 squadrons that have max 12 or less people and these people mostly play this game.

 

If you make an event for example like the "Guardian Angel" where I can get to my P-51 and fly it with organised team, bomber escort. Thats fun.

 

But for normal purposes you need a medium difficulty mission. With clear objective that average Joe can follow.

 

You need a single objective Blue team must defend units in point A, Red team needs to destroy units in point A. With bases 10km from point A so that it doesn't feel boring to get to the target area. Some flak... but not too much. Those missions could be separated by typical TDM type of play like we have on JG 27 server.

 

I liked the system in IL2 46 where people who shot down/destroyed targets and landed their plane were rewarded for it with additional points. There should also be points for attacking mission critical targets so that you can see who contributed the most during a battle and be able to see what targets have I destroyed, how many times I was shot down, how many times I crashed, what was my accuracy, what was the best player and what plane did he flew... all that interesting stuff from MP point of view. We need a mutator for that though which we don't have... and it is not your fault... just DCS doesn't have it.:(

 

People can't easily see at the end of a fight leaderboard of players. We can only hope ED can deliver with DCS2.0 :cry:

 

PS. People need to feel involved, thats when they care. If they feel detached they don't play the game.

[9.JG27 DavidRed]

It's an unfortunate fact, but the instant action servers do get a lot more attention than the hardcore servers.

 

I just don't get it, why do people like such properly simulated plane, but don't want to fly them in proper scenarios. It boggles the mind. :(

 

It's like saying I want to play ARMA, but only in 50m by 50m map and no vehicles ever. :doh:

 

I hope things change when the WWII map comes out, but of course it's a long ways away....

 

 

because, there are no proper scenarios...no ground units no bombers, not even a map...i can understand people not interested in flying proper scenarios, without the "proper" :)

 

also, the still very low numbers, very likely due to the above mentioned lacks, makes proper scenarios pretty much useless...

 

nothing as distracting as flying a warbird, in a proper scenario, just to look down seeing several nuclear powerplants :)

Edited May 7, 2015 by 9./JG27 DavidRed

[Solty]

because, there are no proper scenarios...no ground units no bombers, not even a map...i can understand people not interested in flying proper scenarios, without the "proper" :)

 

also, the still very low numbers, very likely due to the above mentioned lacks, makes proper scenarios pretty much useless...

 

nothing as distracting as flying a warbird, in a proper scenario, just to look down seeing several nuclear powerplants :)

Actually you may be right...

 

Again this is why people don't fly, they feel detached from the world, they don't feel part of it. There is no customisation and real WW2 theatre.

 

I have a wierd feeling that influx of people will start only when the WW2 project is finished, because of the facts you have pointed out.:(

 

But for the map we need the Edge. The map (as I remember from kickstarter videos) was suppose to be made for DCS 2.0

[Nirvi]

Actually you may be right...

 

Again this is why people don't fly, they feel detached from the world, they don't feel part of it. There is no customisation and real WW2 theatre.

 

I have a wierd feeling that influx of people will start only when the WW2 project is finished, because of the facts you have pointed out.:(

 

But for the map we need the Edge. The map (as I remember from kickstarter videos) was suppose to be made for DCS 2.0

 

Yes, I think a big portion of the WW2 community is just waiting for a real theatre before they start to play and we will see a lot of new players as soon as the normandy map is released.

 

But for me, the "airquake" missions now are the perfect opportunity to learn the planes and fight. It's like flightschool preparing for the "real war" when normandy is released.

[9.JG27 DavidRed]

^^thats what its intended for!

but i fear it will be a long way until we have a ww2 map, considering that edge is not yet released, and two more maps are being developed before they will start to work on the ww2 map.so i see no chance of the map being released this year...with luck maybe in like two years from now would be my guess.

 

with that perspective...i am really tired of looking at things like nuclear powerplants or the like, im even starting to think about exchanging buildings on the map with each other, to give a little more ww2 look...i already tried to replace 1building with each other..and it seems to work..but i have a problem that i cannot find the different lod models for the buildings.so when im a little further away, the building switches shape to the one i was trying to exchange...well if i could only do 3d modelling

[SlipBall]

I think that ED needs to hire more people and get these maps out ASAP...delay is killing what ever excitement there was, and for me that was a lot at the beginning of this concept project :(

[9.JG27 DavidRed]

I have a wierd feeling that influx of people will start only when the WW2 project is finished, because of the facts you have pointed out.:(

 

yes, thats certainly true...if you observe, after a warbird is released, for a few days, the ww2 servers are really populated...but then, after not too much time, we are back at the usual suspects who fly those birds no matter what...the others, well, probably fly other ww2 sims, which have maps....

 

but im also of the opinion, that ED would sell way more warbirds, if there was a map...i think, many do buy the warbirds, try them, and lose interest soon because of the lack of a proper environment...

 

but i am convinced, that way more people would buy them, if there was this proper environment...so yeah, GT 5.0, i totally agree...the maps, should have top priority...especially the ww2 one. i dont believe, that many guys, even the most hardcore dcs ww2 fanbodys, will wait and use dcs for the next 2years without a proper map...people will start to fade away, try something else, and lose interest in this project. thats my fear.

 

maybe some snippets of information about really anything dcsww2'ish would help to keep the enthusiasm alive, but even that is too much to ask for it seems...

[Ultra]

I agree with all that's being said, I just still like the servers that try to simulate semi-realistic scenarios more. :D

 

DavidRed, that's a good point in your last post. I'm worried about that too.

Edited May 7, 2015 by Ultra

[Merlin-27]

It's good to know people are still passionate about the topic. Please keep in mind that the servers you fly on are all supported by the community and done on a volunteer basis. It takes a considerable amount of time and effort to maintain them and keep them current. I have offered to host missions built by those who have ideas and ambition to offer but received practically nothing. Missions take time to build, test & update when needed. Good missions consume even more. Administering the server full time would be nice, but not a reality. We HAVE adapted to a degree based on constructive feedback but have also held strong on a few things for various reasons. It is true that the majority of clients seem to prefer "air quake" over mission oriented objectives. That fact has never prevented us (DoW) from enjoying our squad events and having fun flying in the current DCS: World. We do appreciate everyone who has joined us and offered something to the experience. Yes, it will be more immersive when we have period maps, but I have no doubt in my mind that air quake servers will continue to attract the most clients online. That does not bother me in the least and my only hope is that the community continues to grow.

[Ultra]

I think Community Events are something that is missing. Maverick started doing the Red Flag event for the modern aircraft and it fills within a matter of a few hours.

 

I think a WWII event would be just as popular and it would bring the community closer together.

It doesn't even matter if it's an 'airquake' event, it just needs a thread on the forum in the Community News section and a set date & time so people can plan to show up in advance.

[NineLine]

maybe some snippets of information about really anything dcsww2'ish would help to keep the enthusiasm alive, but even that is too much to ask for it seems...

 

I agree mostly with what you said, then you close out with this? We get information on something related to DCS WWII almost every newsletter... no matter what ED does, or what they talk about, someone will be disappointed with what they didn't say.

 

Honestly, as much as I want a map, I would be just as happy with era specific units to tide me over. Proper flak, ground targets, etc would go a long way. But at the end of the day, when you are dog fighting, the ground you are over just gets in the way.

[msalama]

I don't know. Haven't flown OL at all lately, but if I ever start again, I'll certainly run a server with a Koreanish/Vietnamish scenario - which isn't WW2, I know, but close enough still ;) Consider this:

 

* We've got a Stang, a Sabre and a Fagot. Check.

* We've got a Huey for the rotorheads. Check.

* We've got mods featuring period units. Check.

* We've got mods featuring WW2 units. Check (and use as applicable).

* We've got a jungle evironment to make it all look a bit spiffier. Check.

 

So the circumstances taken into account, what's _not_ to like? Yeah, it's still the same old boring Caucasus map and the German birds don't really fit in, but one can still cook up a believable/pseudo 50s-60s scenario this way at least. So how about _that_ while we wait?

 

The reason I've been a bit wary of doing this is the humongous amount of mods I've got running. Everyone would need the exact same setup, and some of those I've modded further so that'd be a headache indeed. Not an insurmountable one by any means though, so maybe I'll really do this some day! We'll see...