The Ka-50 Black Shark thread

[Yo-Yo]

One thing to point out- the TV3-117VMA has 2200 ehp take-off power without anti-dust device. When it is installed the max power decreases with 100 hp to 2100. This is valid for all versions of the TV3-117. The VK-2500 is brand new and is still testing and I don't beleive it has been installed on a serial machine. It features more power, fuel efficiency, more service life, FADEC and so on. Read more on the manufacturer's web site here: http://klimov.ru/en/products/military/turboshaft_engine/vk-2500/

 

May be it will be balm on your soul - the engines in the project have air duct for de-icer system. And it causes power loss. Anti dust cyclones also eat power if on. You can also see how t increases when they are on.

And it's not just a script... :)

[Force_Feedback]

It has some kind of sight (the Otklit-800), but I don`t know the workings of it, nor the specifics (the above mentioned sites describe it vaguely at best)

[chris2802]

Does that mean we will have to use them in the game in dusty/ cold conditions? What happens if you don't?? Bad things?!

 

-Chris

[Yo-Yo]

Does that mean we will have to use them in the game in dusty/ cold conditions? What happens if you don't?? Bad things?!

 

-Chris

 

 

Yes, we are thinking of it... ice in the compressor can shut down the engine as far as I know. It can be done in the project. Dust... hmm, of course rotor blades will suffer but it's not an instant effect, so we are in doubt. Of course we can deteriorate engines performance while in improper conditions like too much time at take off rating or with dust in intake.

[Chizh]

There are PDF scans from Military Technology magazine (9-2005) about tests Ka-50 in Northern Caucasus.

MILTECH_9-2005_Ka-50_in_Chechnya.pdf

[aimmaverick]

Little confused here. Does Ka-50 have RWR or not? Some people say it has, others that it doesnt. Janes claims it has... Well any response from a moderator would be welcome to clarify this thing once and for all. And what we will get in the game anyway. I personnaly cant imagine a modern helicopter without RWR. Its plain stupid. How on earth would it survive on modern battlefield? Frustrating for the pilots also. That armor plating wont help you against a missile fired at you, which you dont even know is there.

[MBot]

It has been said on the forum that the Ka-50 version in LOBS doesn't have RWR equipment.

 

I guess radar missiles are not the real big threat for a low flying helicopter.

[GGTharos]

Little confused here. Does Ka-50 have RWR or not? Some people say it has, others that it doesnt. Janes claims it has... Well any response from a moderator would be welcome to clarify this thing once and for all. And what we will get in the game anyway. I personnaly cant imagine a modern helicopter without RWR. Its plain stupid. How on earth would it survive on modern battlefield? Frustrating for the pilots also. That armor plating wont help you against a missile fired at you, which you dont even know is there.

 

It has no RWR. Only the new prototype does.

The main reason is that the Ka-50 is expected to be used as a rapid-reaction force in 'low intensity' environments, like Chechnya, where radar guided AAMs and SAMs are not the big threat - SA-7's, Stingers, AK-47's and ZSU's are the main threat there, as -well- as weather (Ka-50 is infinitely more controllable in gusting winds than conventional rotor-arranged aircraft).

 

It is -not- a front-line combat helo like the AH-64 or the Mi-28, at least not from the way it is being envisioned.

[Fufunka]

Ka-50 cockpit panel plans?

 

I'm wondering are there any Ka-50 cockpit panel plans with basic dimensions available? Is it going to be included in some rudimentary form in the manual from ED? F-15 and such are obviously documented all over the web, but this is a rare bird..

 

The idea is that nowadays you can get, glass instrument panels for Lockon

(perhaps in future incl. MFD)!, HUD data output and "easily" fabricated diy HUD, Tuchbuddy/7" LCD for additional overall sim keyboard control, so to have a decent cockpit with the main functions covered is possible and could be done in reasonable time not in years..

 

So far, I have found only two smaller pictures and one high res of the cockpit here:

 

http://www.aeronautics.ru/archive/vvs/helicopters/ka50_002.jpg

http://wmilitary.neurok.ru/ka50/hud-1.jpg

http://forum.lockon.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=4475&d=1139936610

 

Highres pic incl. prototype version rusting in the Kamov's hangar

http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?aircraft_genericsearch=Kamov%20Ka-50%20Black%20Shark&distinct_entry=true

http://www.sealauncher.ch/neue_datei23.html

http://www.sealauncher.ch/neue_datei1.html

 

 

!!!rartities!!!:

!real world Ka-52 cockpits photos:

 

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://avia.russian.ee/cockpits/ka-50mod.jpg&imgrefurl=http://avia.russian.ee/cockpits/index.html&h=361&w=563&sz=64&hl=en&start=24&tbnid=-Ao8F9-eNFcs1M:&tbnh=85&tbnw=133&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dka-50%26start%3D20%26ndsp%3D20%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den%26lr%3Dlang_cs%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:cs:official_s%26sa%3DN

 

http://www.myaviation.net/search/search.php?&view=&where=MSA9IDEgQU5EIGFpcmNyYWZ0X2dlbmVyaWM9J0thbW92JyA=&nr_of_results=45&first_this_page=40&page_limit=10&order=id&sort_order=DESC&thumbnails=&engine_version=&nr_pages=5&page=0&lastcheck=1

 

!k-37 helicopter extraction system:

http://www.ejectionsite.com/k37seat.htm

 

--

 

Glass 3D instruments and HUD data output for Lockon here:

(is there going to be Black Shark version too?)

http://www.simmeters.com/index.html

 

How to make DIY fighterjet HUD tutorial here:

http://forums.frugalsworld.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=93328

 

Touchbuddy for Lockon keyboard command centralization here:

http://forum.lockon.ru/showthread.php?t=13472&page=15

 

There are many sites dealing with cockpit building so just to name a few:

http://www.xflight.de/f16/pg_sim_pnl.htm

http://www.simkits.com/product.php?prodid=326#

http://www.opencockpits.com/modules.php?name=Content

 

plus various motion or feedback platforms/gadgets..

cheap diy projectors with big FOV on curved screen etc..

 

Thanks for any suggestions..

[Fufunka]

Ka-50 cockpit panel plans?

 

Just to give you the idea how it could work in principle.. Glass cockpit with instrumentation

in the foreground and projection or multidisplay further away..

 

http://www.mapide.de/deepblue/eech/test-2.jpg

http://www.simhq.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=30;t=004623

[Sleek]

see-ing as ur chatting about the cockpit i was wondering if the Dev's could post a screenie of the cockpit and point out what all the dial's and instrument's are used for(with photo shop or something) so we can learn what they are for and get aquainted before LOBS's release.

 

Regard's.Sleek.

[KGunzer]

I have an idea that'll make BlackShark pwn all combat heli sims. This icould be ther first sim where participants cooperate using one vehicle on a realistic scale (compared to BF2's vehicles).

 

How about the idea of paired computers to fly one sim (as in pilot and gunner tandem). Obviously, both players have to cooperate and work cohesively to play. Both of them will use their own individual computers to participate in "flying" one heli. Both of them can have their own flight control system and the chance of having one member of the pair being shot can be made possible!

 

Generally, participants of the game will connect normally over the net but they have to decide who will do what (who's piloting and who's delivering the ordinance) so that only one person will control the flight of the vehicle and another will control the weapon systems. There should be the ability to relinquish the control just in case one person gets taken out.

 

:idea:

[RvETito]

First, welcome aboard!;)

 

This is already implemented in Lock-On, ever since 1.02 came out, or maybe even before that. This is a test mode where two players fly one and the same aircraft. I first read about it 2 years ago in this forum with detailed instruction how to set it up. It works only in LAN because a single lag will cause it to fail. There were two icons of pilot seats on the screen, showing that this test mode is in use.

[Nate--IRL--]

First, welcome aboard!;)

 

This is already implemented in Lock-On, ever since 1.02 came out, or maybe even before that. This is a test mode where two players fly one and the same aircraft. I first read about it 2 years ago in this forum with detailed instruction how to set it up. It works only in LAN because a single lag will cause it to fail. There were two icons of pilot seats on the screen, showing that this test mode is in use.

 

This was removed after 1.02 along with the LAN code. IIRC

 

Nate

[RvETito]

I see. Well, I've never tried it and my post was based on my memories from 2 years ago:) Not that it really matters but...

[RvETito]

Well, I think the Ka-50 Black Shark was intended to be flown by a tandem team (so much like an AH-64A/D Apache/Longbow or an RAH-66 Comanche or PAH Tiger). A Hokum however, is piloted only by one.

 

Well, not quiet. The Ka-50 has been intentionaly designed as a single pilot from the very beggining. The two seat version is the Ka-52 Alligator which features upgraded avionics and targeting systems and it's main purpose is to serve as targeting platform and aiborne command center of a group of 4 Ka-50s, but it keeps the single-seater's armament plus some new type of weapons.

[saa]

The Black Shark description states that the cockpit will have 6DOF capability. Will the other aircraft have this as well?

[Tartan_Piper]

The Black Shark description states that the cockpit will have 6DOF capability. Will the other aircraft have this as well?

 

I'm sure i read that it will only be in the Ka-50 :(

[Silent Warrior]

What are we getting 'in the box' (can't remove those quotes in case of digital distribution, can I? :p), exactly? What I've noticed so far is:

One new flyable: Ka-50 (duh)

A right snazzy 6DOF cockpit to go with it

Not to mention an AFM

And a bucket-load of commands to map in Controls

Tuned-up graphics, performance-tweaks, blablabla

Misc. bugfixes, improvement on this and that

Missile AFM (aside from the more realistic trajectories, will this have any effect on their homing abilities?)

One Ka-50-campaign

One manual ('mere' BS-addendum or the whole thing, from v1.00 onwards?)

What have I missed? Will there be TWO Ka-50-campaigns (like there were two for Su-25T in FC)? Any campaign for the other flyables? Training for Ka-50? Updated training-tracks for the others?

[GGTharos]

What are we getting 'in the box' (can't remove those quotes in case of digital distribution, can I? :p), exactly? What I've noticed so far is:

One new flyable: Ka-50 (duh)

A right snazzy 6DOF cockpit to go with it

Not to mention an AFM

And a bucket-load of commands to map in Controls

Tuned-up graphics, performance-tweaks, blablabla

Misc. bugfixes, improvement on this and that

Missile AFM (aside from the more realistic trajectories, will this have any effect on their homing abilities?)

 

You missed a few posts that stated that the WAFM is out for now - no time to fully implement it in BS ... while WAFM will only affect the flight physics, sensor enhancements are also in the works - LOMAC is always improving. But there was a lot of stuff that had to be dropped from BS - speedtree, wafm (my pet peeve :) ) ... just on account of lack of time.

 

One Ka-50-campaign

One manual ('mere' BS-addendum or the whole thing, from v1.00 onwards?)

What have I missed? Will there be TWO Ka-50-campaigns (like there were two for Su-25T in FC)? Any campaign for the other flyables? Training for Ka-50? Updated training-tracks for the others?

[chris2802]

I've read a few posts mentioning Speedtree and WAFM. What exactly are/were they?

 

Cheers

Chris

[peterj]

Good looking trees http://www.speedtree.com

WAFM - Advanced flight model for weapons

 

GG - Is WAFM for the Vikhr dropped? (from the initial release)

[GGTharos]

Good looking trees http://www.speedtree.com

WAFM - Advanced flight model for weapons

 

GG - Is WAFM for the Vikhr dropped? (from the initial release)

 

 

No, the Vikhr has it, and it is proof that ID plans to further implement it down the line :)

 

And thank the heavens too ... I'll qualify that remark: The Vikhr without WAFM is the most uber missile out there. Unspoofable, nearly undodgeable. I wanted a bunch of Vikhrs on my F-15.

 

A word of warning: It is -difficult- to notice the the difference between WAFM and SAFM in simple circumstances, especially in a missile that spirals all the way in ... but they -are- there ... both in speed and g-loading.

[Force_Feedback]

Ok, I have a Ka-50 related question, well, there appear to be 2 kind of flare dispensing pods, one kind just has this rectangular opening with 64 flare launchers each. The other kind has this opening, and another one, having like 5-6 flare launchers, arranged vertically (in a line) behind the 64 flare box.

 

Type1:

 

Type2: (I know this is a bad pic, but you can see there is something behind the nav light, in a line)

 

 

Here is a better picture, although it's a ka-52

Will we get a vocal warning of laser illumination, and where it comes from? Because the 4 lamps on the Otklik panel are not the primary warning system, the nice lady voice is, telling someone is aiming something leathal at your precious chopper.

 

Oh, and, my final question, will the cockpit door, and the hatch on the right side be jettisonable? I imagine screwing up with the vortex rings, and crashing on your left side, blocking the door, then you just blow the right hatch, and live to fight another day.

 

 

EDIT: Never mind, I guess it is part of the laser warning system, there is a great page with lots of "rare" walkaround pictures, unfortunately, the ones I'd like to see, the ka-50 ones, are offline. All I have is a google thumbnail:

[EvilBivol-1]

The other kind has this opening, and another one, having like 5-6 flare launchers, arranged vertically (in a line) behind the 64 flare box.

Those are signal rockets. AFAIK, they will be implemented in LOBS, though "no promises."

 

Will we get a vocal warning of laser illumination, and where it comes from? Because the 4 lamps on the Otklik panel are not the primary warning system, the nice lady voice is, telling someone is aiming something leathal at your precious chopper.

Again, AFAIK, that is the plan. And again, "no promises." :D

 

Oh, and, my final question, will the cockpit door, and the hatch on the right side be jettisonable?

That I haven't heard anything about.