USAF gas bill

[hitman]

Its a "theory" and not one that has not had a lot of research done to help prove it, but it fits certain groups agendas well, I think its gonna become another one of them "internet facts"

 

It is a well known fact that algae produce just as much oxygen than the average rain forests, and any biologist or botanist can prove that fact. Internet facts? I hardly believe that biologists research algae production online. Red tides are nasty for ocean critters simply because the algae bloom sucks out all the oxygen in the water and releases that into the atmosphere. Dont just google that, call up your local high school and ask a biology teacher or science teacher. OR you can take the extra step and call up the local college and ask a biology professor.

[Trident]

I think everyone that is so concerned with the earth resources should walk the walk. Give up the plane trips, the cars, stop using those precious resources to heat your homes. Leave them for us non-environment whackos, who tend to be the optimists of the world. I put my faith in bigger things then men and their egos.

 

That's not the point. The point is that using 10.6 tons of oil per capita per annum to support a lifestyle that can be achieved just fine with 5.1 tons is, to be completely frank, a horrendous and irresponsible waste. That's not being optimistic it's being ignorant.

[diveplane]

its just a matter of time now when fossil fuels run out ..

 

but its a matter of time in what we can all do to help the planet..,and

look for alternative fuels and quickly....

 

we have 2 options 1=act asap for alternative fuels and clean the planets enviroment messes up

2=do nothing, and let the future childrens children suffer...

[JG27_Arklight]

Weather is an amazing thing. It was 96 here day before yesterday and 97 yesterday.

 

 

 

lol

[Trident]

Germany uses 5.1 tons (most European countries are in that ballpark, some lower some higher), the US and Canada about 10.6. Don't tell me your standard of living is proportionately higher, infact I doubt there is any practical difference at all. Efficiency is how you can achieve similar results using far less resources.

 

This is not some utopian vision, it's the reality today.

[Pilotasso]

One funny thing is that on the other side of the pond having cars with big consumptions is a measurement of manhood. In the US the fuel is much cheaper than over here. Everybody wants to have big cars if they can afford like hummers. If you declare you want to buy a hybrid car you will be labelled as ghey. :D

 

I dont want a big car. Its not a toy just an utility. And I want it to be the cheapest to maintain. If I want to drive something potent it has to litelry got to fly. ;)

[SwingKid]

I dont want a big car. Its not a toy just an utility. And I want it to be the cheapest to maintain. If I want to drive something potent it has to litelry got to fly. ;)

 

Ever since I read your sig, I knew that we would agree about everything.

 

:beer:

 

-SK

[Pilotasso]

Ever since I read your sig, I knew that we would agree about everything.

 

:beer:

 

-SK

 

 

I actualy drive a car heritaged from my mother who meanwhile ceased to drive. Its a Renault Twingo and its a complete eggshell LOL.

 

I dont think buying a new one right now is a good deal. Things are changing rapidely and I will save for a hybrid in a few years after I get my definitive engineering Job. The wife part is for later :D who knows? I have no decent paycheck to show a face in front of all these gold diggers LOL.

[169th_Crusty]

One funny thing is that on the other side of the pond having cars with big consumptions is a measurement of manhood. In the US the fuel is much cheaper than over here. Everybody wants to have big cars if they can afford like hummers. If you declare you want to buy a hybrid car you will be labelled as ghey. :D

 

I dont want a big car. Its not a toy just an utility. And I want it to be the cheapest to maintain. If I want to drive something potent it has to litelry got to fly. ;)

 

Yes... I did drive "utility" when my sig could have been the same as yours...

Now, it`s time for toys:D ...

I`m perfectly satisfied with my vehicle: fine Bavarian 530xi (2006), but...

the "manhood" thing kicked in. So, for the next year I`m looking at M5:P

(the speed limiter chip will be removed!!!:music_whistling: )

[Guest IguanaKing]

I can't speak for "environment whackos," but I can confirm that there are a remarkable number of my fellow microwave and antenna engineers who, like myself, refuse to own a mobile phone. We still encourage the rest of you to buy them though, and continue paying our salaries. They're perfectly safe. Really! ;)

 

Speaking of which, have you upgraded your computer lately?

 

-SK

 

Just came across this old thread. LOL!!! That's no ****, SK, its the same reason ATC radar and transponder techs like me refuse to own one. Seriously though, the mental distraction one of these devices causes while driving will surely kill MOST who decide to use them regularly, long before the effects of EMR.

[Guest IguanaKing]

That's impossible!!! Only nations with nuclear power plants could do that!!! :smilewink: Cool vid, Hydrogen to start the combustion, and Oxygen to sustain it AND make it stable. It really goes back to the basics of combustion...when something is burned it ALWAYS produces what two molecules? Carbon Dioxide and Water (AKA DHMO...read about its dangers at DHMO.org).

[Roman G]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dihydrogen_Monoxide

 

And yes - it causes cyclones, because hurricane (which is one type of cyclone) do need ocean. And ocean has a lot of Dihydrogen Monoxide - which is simpe water :).

 

BTW, the HHO seem to me the same kind of hoax, because you can write it's formula as H2O too ... Also they claim "they drive 100 miles using four ounces of water". Excuse me !???! :) Maybe if the vehicle size is the size of bycicle ... Or maybe they used it just to clean windshied ? :)

 

4 ounces is equal to about 0.125 kilograms. There is about 0.0125 kg of hydrogen in that amount of water. Burning one kg of hydrogen to water gives you about 150 Mega Joules of energy. For example, burning one kg of gasoline in atmosphere gives you about 50 Mega Joules of energy (three times less than hydrogen). To drive 100 miles on good-size vehicle you need about 6 kg of gasoline - which equals to about 300 Mega Joules of energy. So they are claiming that burning of 0.125 kg of "HHO" will give them that 300 Mega Joules - which is puting energy density of HHO to about 2500 Mega Joules per kilogram !!! - way higher than when burning unbound hydrogen !!! ... maybe they found a way how to put a bit of antimatter into the HHO gas by that "unique elecrolysis process" ... ?? ;)

 

Well, good luck to HHO investors !!! - sadly it seems that we will pay part of bill in form of taxes since one of the investors seems to be US Army ...

[Guest IguanaKing]

The web-site is a joke...literally. I hope I'm misinterpreting some of the posts here as being anything other than sarcasm themselves.

[Guest Cali]

Germany uses 5.1 tons (most European countries are in that ballpark, some lower some higher), the US and Canada about 10.6. Don't tell me your standard of living is proportionately higher, infact I doubt there is any practical difference at all. Efficiency is how you can achieve similar results using far less resources.

 

And how big is Germany compared to the US or Cananda? Maybe they don't drive around for no reason like some people here, maybe they walk more. But I'm not walking anywhere when it is 108 degrees outside and nothing is close to my house. The nearest food store is mile away, I'd die by the time I got there.

[Weta43]

It's this bit though "Efficiency is how you can achieve similar results using far less resources." - you could probably still drive, just drive something smaller & more fuel efficient ( If it's only used for driving to the store & work, then a Mitsubishi gallant (or US equivalent) will do just as well as some 2 ton SUV with the aerodynamics of a brick & will do it using probably less than half the gas ( & the energy / resources needed to make it - & will handle better at the same time ).

Of course if people actually cary 1/2 a ton of goods in the back across open country I can see the point of an SUV.

[Trident]

What Weta said, although your point is valid. Besides, even a reduction to about 7.2 tons or so would still be a huge step in the right direction (think of the absolute amount of oil and emissions saved each year!), but somehow I doubt that will happen :(

[bflagg]

And how big is Germany compared to the US or Cananda? Maybe they don't drive around for no reason like some people here, maybe they walk more. But I'm not walking anywhere when it is 108 degrees outside and nothing is close to my house. The nearest food store is mile away, I'd die by the time I got there.

 

I concur... also....

Our fellow european neighbors forget we have a vast stretch of land to cross.

Every foreign car, vw, bmw, saab, renault I have owned here just can't hold up to the continuous straight high speed highways we have here.

They all die horrible boneyard deaths...

Consider this senario... go 30miles one way to work (avg) @60mi a day (100km) now do that 5-6 days a week...now lets' go 1000mi to visit family (or vacation / getaways). now repeat this 3-4 times a year.

The little cars just die because they are not designed for long straight roads....

 

City driving...yeah... smaller cars make sense..but suburbia / country...

forget it... the smaller cars just don't hold up. (well.. maybe the "newest" ones)

[Pilotasso]

What Weta said, although your point is valid. Besides, even a reduction to about 7.2 tons or so would still be a huge step in the right direction (think of the absolute amount of oil and emissions saved each year!), but somehow I doubt that will happen :(

 

They are still all wanting to drive hummers. Its a desease :D

 

I went to a car expo in the infra structures re-used from the world exposition 1998 (pretty much the best spot to hang arround in my town).

 

I went to see it and a few american brands were there. Among them I gazed a Dodge Viper with special attention. Man that engine is a big as the tin can I drive right now! :D For "only" 200000 Euros, yummy!! ;) If you want a Lamborgini or a Ferrari better throw MUCH MUCH more than that and they are all hand made... only for special occasions, if you dent it...its troublesome just to get it fixed Im sure.

 

One thing I noticed, all these brands use similar emblems. All 4 legged big mamals. :D And they all drink like horses.

[bflagg]

They are still wanting to drive hummers. Its a desease :D

 

I went to a car expo in the infra structures re-used from the world exposition 1998 (pretty much the best sopt to hang arround in my town).

 

I went to see it and a few american brands were there. Among them I gazed a Dodge Viper with special attention. Man that engine is a big as the tin can I drive right now! :D

 

Those viper is definately sweet...

Wait till you see a Shelby.. you'll pee yourself. (if I only had the cash)

 

Alot of folks here have the big cars. some for status, some for safety, some for tax write offs.

But to ambiguously say we all want to drive these hogs is sterotyping.

 

My last visit to both Ireland and England..those folks on the motorway

were pushing those 3/4 cylinder cars to some ungodly speeds and I was

was going 70mph (120kph?) and they were passing me up like I was standing still...

 

Now if you all will excuse me I got to get ready and watch Jack Bauer save the world by making Chuch Norris knock himself out....

[Alfa]

Every foreign car, vw, bmw, saab, renault I have owned here just can't hold up to the continuous straight high speed highways we have here. They all die horrible boneyard deaths...

 

"high speed highways" - what with 55 mph(~ 90 km/h) speed limits? :) . I don't know Brett but even in my little micro-country we have motorways criss-crossing the country with speed limit of 120 km/h(75 mph).....which BTW is (grossly)exceeded by most people driving on them :D. I believe Germany still has autobahn stretches without any limits at all :)

 

Consider this senario... go 30miles one way to work (avg) @60mi a day (100km) now do that 5-6 days a week

 

I did that for years just going to high-school and later university - it is definitely not uncommon even in my little country :)

 

...now lets' go 1000mi to visit family (or vacation / getaways). now repeat this 3-4 times a year.

 

My father drives his Citroen the 2000 miles(~3500 km) of motorway to his house in southern Spain and back every year and has done so for years.....it has 300,000 Km on the clock and shows no signs of "dying horribly" yet ;) . As a mechanic I have worked my fair share on US cars and let's just say that I wouldn't recommend my father to swap his Citroen for any of those - apart from not being terribly impressed with the engineering standard of the ones I have worked on, the fuel cost of his trip would just ruin him :) .

 

However, this is not meant as a "bashing" of US made products in general - I run a small landscaping company where we have used US made garden tractors for years and they are superb quality.....the best you can get :) .

 

The little cars just die because they are not designed for long straight roads....

 

"Designed for long straight roads"?. Brett, the worst driving conditions you can expose your car to is exactly short stretches and city driving - multiple cold starts, constant acceleration/braking = wear on engine, clutch, transmission and brakes - any car will last several times longer driving on long straight roads....trust me ;) .

 

Cheers,

- JJ.

[504Goon]

I concur... also....

Our fellow european neighbors forget we have a vast stretch of land to cross.

Every foreign car, vw, bmw, saab, renault I have owned here just can't hold up to the continuous straight high speed highways we have here.

They all die horrible boneyard deaths...

Consider this senario... go 30miles one way to work (avg) @60mi a day (100km) now do that 5-6 days a week...now lets' go 1000mi to visit family (or vacation / getaways). now repeat this 3-4 times a year.

The little cars just die because they are not designed for long straight roads....

 

City driving...yeah... smaller cars make sense..but suburbia / country...

forget it... the smaller cars just don't hold up. (well.. maybe the "newest" ones)

Oh yes, our cars can take the punishment just aswell:) I drive a small peugeot about 100km each day, and a 800km drive to go see my family about once a month, and so far it has not died..:) And couple of months back i drove 3000km trip to france with the only stops beeing when switching drivers, and one of the countries was Germany, and like Alfa said, you can go "fairly" fast at the autobahns there.. my average speed was something like 150km/h through Germany, and everything went fine.. Of course, i wouldn't have taken the trip with a 20 year old Fiat 500..:)

[bflagg]

not knocking you guys.. but in my personal experiance.. both as a backyard mechanic and a owner/user..almost every car I've had from europe has died.

I've left Fiats, Audi's, VW's on the side of the highways to be towed away...

(must admit..I only owned one BMW and I traded it in - it didn't die on me)

 

But back to the main point I was trying to convey to Pilotasso, is america is not full of egotistical maniacle dimwits who absolutly have to expand their manhood by buying Hummers/Escalades/F450's or have to boost their egos by doing so.

 

Now I have a Sonata. It's ok and comfortable..but performance wise..there is much to be desired.

At 28k I can hear and feal that engine getting tired, yet my older POS rust-mobile, GM Dynasty (115K) kept on tickin until the rust made the floor board on the passenger side drop. (and since the wife looks nothing like Barney Rubble...I had to get rid of it fast)..

 

anyway... back to work for me.

ttl

[Andrew_McP]

But back to the main point I was trying to convey to Pilotasso, is america is not full of egotistical maniacle dimwits who absolutly have to expand their manhood by buying Hummers/Escalades/F450's or have to boost their egos by doing so.

 

I think we all appreciate that; it's a big nation with plenty of sensible folk as well as plenty of idiots. :-)

 

The problem the USA as a whole has though is that many of its major cities need cheap oil to function well, whether that's because of *massive* urban sprawl or because they were built in places no sane person would normally live without cheap air conditioning or cheap heating.

 

In Europe we *generally* have better public transport and cities that grew over centuries which still have the potential to operate well without people having to commute large distances (though often people do to have the luxury of living somewhere pretty while working somewhere uglier). Many US cities grew up in an age of cheap personal transport and were fundamentally designed around cheap car transport.

 

Facing the challenge of increasingly expensive fuel will put severe economic stresses on the US economy, and the sooner that process starts the better for everyone. The whole world will have big problems because of increasingly expensive fuel, but the USA is right at the extreme end of energy (ab)use, and the higher you are on the economic food chain, the further you have to fall if not prepared for what's ahead. And in a global economy where we're all connected more than we tend to appreciate, it's not in anyone's interest to see the USA struggle.

 

Andrew McP

[Pilotasso]

not knocking you guys.. but in my personal experiance.. both as a backyard mechanic and a owner/user..almost every car I've had from europe has died.

I've left Fiats, Audi's, VW's on the side of the highways to be towed away...

(must admit..I only owned one BMW and I traded it in - it didn't die on me)

 

 

:D Cars made in italy and spain are notorious for their electrical problems.

Audis and VW's are sturdy though. You probably ran into specific problems wich dont occur usualy.

 

But back to the main point I was trying to convey to Pilotasso, is america is not full of egotistical maniacle dimwits who absolutly have to expand their manhood by buying Hummers/Escalades/F450's or have to boost their egos by doing so.

 

LOL dude, It was bit of a sarcastic joke. I had put a simlie in there to in the hopes you would see through it.

Its a bit of an european mindset to throw a rant to the other side of the pond from time to time. Thats all. In case you may not have heard me saying this, my brother stayed for 18 months in the US training in the T-6 and T-38's. He told me stories how he and his american colleagues used to rant at each others when they were bored just for the sport of it.

 

Every body has a way to satisfy his egos, over here its how many cell phones you have. In 10 million inhabitants we have 14 million cell phones. Sure we like the best cars we can get but there is a distinct taste difference. This is true. Usualy an european likes smooth curves, lots of fancy accessories, and some like to have fast accelerartion for 0 to 60M/h.

 

The American car choices are very different. US always liked to build typicaly bulkier cars. The American tastes evolved different from european tastes solely after their different mindsets. US Car industry was in pace with the oil industry boom and as such "thirsty" cars were aplenty because it was good for the economy, and for decades there was no prehocupation in increasing their efficiency. Further more Fuel is still ALOT cheaper in the US than here as my brother reported me. Imagine the oild prices of Katrina hurricane, We live like that every day!

And that molded the custumers tastes. In Europe the car industry had to live through 2 world wars and racioning was a major concern, and this taste for powerfull cars dimmed down because there was no room to concieve engines after the feeling of pure perfomance.

 

This is not steriotyping at all. American like hummers and pickups as much as the Europeans like shiny fancy family vans, or 3 door cars that look like eggs.

Usualy the average american laugh at a typical european car, as much as an european would be unneasy to drive a hummer or one of those big trunk cars that have watter bed like suspension systems.

 

If you look at the US imports from europe youll most likely see BMW's or Mercedes, all of them pretty much front line cars in europe that correspond to the american tastes best. If you take a peugeot or a Renault or a fiat they it will stand out from the crowd. The kind of wich when you know people are looking at your car with curious expressions on their faces. Probably the main reason why they dont find market in there.

 

A Chevy Impala would stand out over here too. ;)

[diveplane]

have better public transport .........yep agree on that

 

 

usa was built around the car.... hence the high demand for oils