Fly By Wire landing

[jojo]

A question out of curiosity, when place the FPM between brackets and land, you always have the right speed i found. As you said empty 140 and heavy 160. Is this correct? I try to do it faster or slower i couldnt

 

Excuse me but I don't understand the question here ?

[TomCatMucDe]

When you place the FPM the brackets you have the ideal AoA for landing which is 14 deg. My question is the following, when you do just that, do you get the right landing speed depending on your weight? My impression is yes. I tried to do that while being fast or slower than 140-160 but I couldn't.

In other words, can you get the landing speed wrong if you place the FPM in the AoA brackets ?

[jojo]

Of course no. If you have the good weight and the good AoA you have the good speed, in any plane, FBW or not, AoA bracket or not. :thumbup:

[Fab]

I think that a lot for pilots in here, is dooing vers god, when we talk about, the tekstbook info for landings. You all get the right lineup, correct speed, god AoA ect....

Where you fail is The landing it self.... I Will try to explain.

 

Most of The sim pilots I have spoken with about landings, get The Numbers right. But they try to "land" the plane, by forceing it Down on the runway...

Whwn you are correct setup, Got all The Numbers right, you need to fly The plane Down The runway. Dont set it down, fly it as close to The Ground as you Can. When The plane bleeds of The speed, it Will settel Down gentely by it self.

I have sene a lot of sim and IRL pilots almost, fly The plane into The ground while landing.

I am a glider pilote IRL, and when I land, I Can hear The grass brusning underneath of The fuselag, as i keep flying down The runway, until The plane settels by it self....

[TomCatMucDe]

Of course no. If you have the good weight and the good AoA you have the good speed, in any plane, FBW or not, AoA bracket or not. :thumbup:

 

 

Thanks a lot mate! :)

[shagrat]

For the Take Off, the HUD has a brilliant aid: there is a horizontal line with a small vertical line sticking out (like a flat inverted "T") at the bottom of the HUD.

This is called the "rotation pitch marker".

Now when you reached 100kts start gently to pull back on the stick, until the nose lifts and hold the stick there until the rotation pitch marker reaches the Horizon line! Keep it there, do not pull any further!

Now the M-2000C flies itself off the runway automatically.

The whole thing happens quickly, so you need to train it a couple times...

 

Thanks to Audax for that piece if information :)

[Voodooflies]

For the Take Off, the HUD has a brilliant aid: there is a horizontal line with a small vertical line sticking out (like a flat inverted "T") at the bottom of the HUD.

This is called the "rotation pitch marker".

Now when you reached 100kts start gently to pull back on the stick, until the nose lifts and hold the stick there until the rotation pitch marker reaches the Horizon line! Keep it there, do not pull any further!

Now the M-2000C flies itself off the runway automatically.

The whole thing happens quickly, so you need to train it a couple times...

 

Thanks to Audax for that piece if information :)

 

VR is around 120kt, not 100kt according to the manual.

[shagrat]

VR is around 120kt, not 100kt according to the manual.

Yes, but I found that if you pull hard on the stick at 120kts you end up rushing it and need to counter.

When you gently(!) start pulling a bit at 100kts you start actually raising the nose at 118-120kts slowly so you can center on the horizon line easier...

[The LT]

I think the 14 AOA is easy to hold during the approach. On the flare I pull the stick very gently and start easing the throttle smoothly. I usually end up retracting the throttle fully just as my main wheels touch down. IMO this plane atm is the easiest to land.

 

Isn't the A-10 easier? :)

[jojo]

Yes, but I found that if you pull hard on the stick at 120kts you end up rushing it and need to counter.

When you gently(!) start pulling a bit at 100kts you start actually raising the nose at 118-120kts slowly so you can center on the horizon line easier...

 

Depending on weight (again), the Vr is between 120kt and 160kt (MTOW).

 

The trick is to pull gently toward take off AoA (inverted T on horizon = 13° AoA) while you are accelerating. It will take off by itself when it's good.

Don't try to rush to pull the T on horizon and wait there...

 

On airshow display HUD tape, you can see the pilot takes speed, rotate later and take off before reaching optimum AoA...

 

BTW, you're free to do it like you want, this way is easier...:thumbup:

[shagrat]

Depending on weight (again), the Vr is between 120kt and 160kt (MTOW).

 

The trick is to pull gently toward take off AoA (inverted T on horizon = 13° AoA) while you are accelerating. It will take off by itself when it's good.

Don't try to rush to pull the T on horizon and wait there...

 

On airshow display HUD tape, you can see the pilot takes speed, rotate later and take off before reaching optimum AoA...

 

BTW, you're free to do it like you want, this way is easier...

No problem! I just wanted to share the info about the rotation point marker and what I found working smooth for me currently with the standard loadout.

 

Mind we are still in beta and there is likely to be some adjustments to the performance, anyway.

 

The rotation point marker helps a lot, to keep a good AoA for the take off roll, that's the important info. :)

[gospadin]

I did a quick test at groom lake...

 

When I landed at around 160kts, the nosewheel didn't touch on its own until 65 kts. From 160 down to 65, I rolled 1.5 miles with the airbrakes out, throttle at minimum.

 

Is there really enough authority in the elevators to keep the nose in the air at such a low airspeed? I'd have expected the nose to fall earlier, around 85-100kts.

 

FWIW, my plane was at 50% max weight when landing. (~30% fuel or so)

 

Edit: Changed 58kts to 65kts after re-watching my video.

Edited January 1, 2016 by gospadin

[Jansgi]

Isn't the A-10 easier? :)

 

Not in my opinion. It's easy but I still think the Mirage is easier. In the A-10 you have to trim and constantly make corrections where as with the Mirage you have the FBW that helps a lot. But if anyone wants a challenge try landing the Mirage with a heavy loadout. With 2 Magics and 3 full external tanks my landing speed was 170-190 and it was impossible to stop without slamming the brakes right on touchdown.

Edited January 1, 2016 by Jansgi

[shagrat]

Try an asymmetricall loadout!

 

...and add a bit of crosswind for more fun.

 

As Zeus67 said, she is a bit twitchy on the ground when you have crosswind and are not very careful and perceptive with the nosewheel. ;)

[cmbaviator]

Does someone knows where the app mode is for the HUD, I can't find it :(

 

 

CMB

 

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[Blech]

Hi,

 

on the PCA

page 97

 

\DCS World 2 OpenAlpha\Mods\aircraft\M-2000C\Doc\DCS M-2000C Flight Manual EN.pdf