Working BVR tactic against modern targets

[Zeus67]

Hi Zeus,

 

As you said and il_corleone demonstrated the 530D requires launch from very high. It's critical to have the manual elevation of the radar functional. When you think this feature will be implemented? Is it planned for the next update ?

 

Right now we are prioritizing some critical bugs, but I'll put this in the ASAP list.

[Exorcet]

Thanks for your tips and your dedication to help other fellow simmers :)

I have a question, is rolling without changing course really effecting in bleeding g the missile from its range?

To me it doesn't make sense, the radar doesn't see that you are rolling. It only sees you flying in one direction and depending on speed calculates an interception course. If you roll and don't change anything the missile will, should fly straight to you without bleeding energy.

If truly in DCS the missile will roll with you, I believe it should be a bug and I personally wouldn't want to take advantage of it.

 

I may be wrong.

 

Tacview says the plane was pulling ~3 g during the roll, so it was a corkscrew and not straight and level flight.

 

That said, I think APN missiles (not in the sim yet) are basically designed to defeat such a maneuver.

[TomCatMucDe]

Right now we are prioritizing some critical bugs, but I'll put this in the ASAP list.

 

 

Thanks a bunch

[ckelly14]

Azimuth and bars work. What is not working is moving the antenna manually.

 

Ahah. Now I don't have to worry about mapping antenna movement to my POV3 hat!

[Dirty Rotten Flieger]

"I believe that it's like this in the sim but from the principle of how a radar works it shouldn't behave like this. From the literature I have read, rolling is never mentioned as a maneuver.

 

I believe it is a bug. It should be reported."

 

I think barrel rolling is just cranking in 3 dimensions. I have been doing barrel roll approaches to bleed missile energy too. I was doing my barrel rolls with about 30degree off target though so I was surprised your tiny 5 degree barrel rolls worked. But you were doing mach 2 so the small degree crank is compensated by the high speed.

 

I don't think this is a bug . If you were pointing straight at the target and rolling it wouldn't work.

[GGTharos]

It's a bug. That missile can pull upwards of 30g, do you really believe it cares about your little motion?

 

It's a guidance and fuze issue. If missiles were this ready to evade, no one would ever employ 3-9 evasions - just go straight in and let the numbers win.

 

Since Vietnam it had been impossible to physically generate a safe miss distance against a missile launched in parameters.

Edited December 30, 2015 by GGTharos

[XeNoise]

The problem is that until server admins will keep throwing eastern and western aircrafts in both blue and red teams,i will always need to inspect the bogey visually..

[mattebubben]

combat will be easier aswell once we get that rwr launch warning =P.

[Ktulu2]

The problem is that until server admins will keep throwing eastern and western aircrafts in both blue and red teams,i will always need to inspect the bogey visually..

 

Nah, call raygun in the chat and shoot after 5s like I do. If you teamkill, well they should have answered :thumbup:

[Hook47]

LOL. I like how "Luck" was cited as one of the tricks.

 

Good for Singleplayer, but honestly the best tactic in multiplayer for me so far is to fly the Mirage low and dirty.

 

Good videos though, I'll give it a try.

Edited December 31, 2015 by Hook47

[Hook47]

Nah, call raygun in the chat and shoot after 5s like I do. If you teamkill, well they should have answered :thumbup:

 

Until you get the boot :noexpression:

 

Don't do this... I don't have time in a nasty merge to bring up the chat box and type "BUDDY BUDDY"

[iborg]

Until you get the boot :noexpression:

 

Don't do this... I don't have time in a nasty merge to bring up the chat box and type "BUDDY BUDDY"

 

 

This.

Though it just gave me the idea of writing a HOTAS macro for calling Raygun and Buddyspike with a single button press...

[Ktulu2]

Until you get the boot :noexpression:

 

Don't do this... I don't have time in a nasty merge to bring up the chat box and type "BUDDY BUDDY"

 

If you are in the merge, you should be able to see the enemy, my answer was more BVR based.

 

But I do realise that it must suck for everyone :(

In the 104th, I did try to guess enemy/friendly based on the direction and heading, but when the enemy starts camping your spawn, it simply doesn't work any more.

[jojo]

I don't know what it worths, but it may be a "work around":

http://tacnoworld.fr/universradio-transponder/

[il_corleone]

Guys! I hope you didn´t forget me! I will be updating this thread with the "new" missiles of the Mirage (New Matra and Magic)

 

EDIT: So far so good, now with the new missiles this can be easier and more realistic

Edited May 21, 2016 by il_corleone

[Low Blow]

This has to be some of the most ridiculous BVR I have ever seen. DCS is a game, not a sim. Flying head on towards an Amraam while diving at Mach 2 doing an aileron roll?? You would die 100% of the time in reality. Something else that needs to be pointed out is that just because this technique of yours works 30 percent of the time in this game doesn't mean it is how you should fly BVR in the mirage. Utterly ridiculous.

Edited May 21, 2016 by Low Blow

[il_corleone]

This has to be some of the most ridiculous BVR I have ever seen. DCS is a game, not a sim. Flying head on towards an Amraam while diving at Mach 2 doing an aileron roll?? You would die 100% of the time in reality. Something else that needs to be pointed out is that just because this technique of yours works 30 percent of the time in this game doesn't mean it is how you should fly BVR in the mirage. Utterly ridiculous.

 

This was made when the Missiles were porked, so ridicoulous tactics were done and I said they are just things that might work, if you came that time with something to work with in BVR I would have been eager to see it :megalol:

 

Dont be so rude, this not a sim nor a game, is just the want player want it to be, I will be uploading more realistic things in a few days, also, you shouldnt be fighting a Amraam should you?

Edited May 21, 2016 by il_corleone

[Frostie]

AI is not a good gauge of how to fight BVR, the real deal is facing real players.

A simple snake manoeuvre in the Mirage works just fine against AI F-15C with AIM-120, i'm sure crank and dive works just as well, my time spent in the Mirage equals about 10mins but achieved this without too much problem, still a lot to learn but lock button and fire button work fine. :D

Mirage v F-15.txt.rar

Edited May 21, 2016 by Frostie

[BIGNEWY]

Guys discuss, debate

 

don't make it personal, be respectful

 

rules are here, follow them or get a forum warning

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/rules.php#en

[il_corleone]

Guys discuss, debate

 

don't make it personal, be respectful

 

rules are here, follow them or get a forum warning

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/rules.php#en

 

 

Thanks BIGNEWY.

 

so Low Blow, I will be making some testing, we could make a thread with all of our videos using Tacview and some hints, I think newcomers will benefit from it

[Low Blow]

I made a video of how I think BVR in the mirage should be done il_corleone. I respect your intentions, I just don't agree with the content.

 

I'll post the link shortly. :thumbsup: Sorry if I offended you earlier, not my intention.

[il_corleone]

I made a video of how I think BVR in the mirage should be done il_corleone. I respect your intentions, I just don't agree with the content.

 

I'll post the link shortly. :thumbsup: Sorry if I offended you earlier, not my intention.

 

Dont worry, I think it was a misunderstanding :thumbup:

[Low Blow]

As promised, here is a survivable way to perform BVR with the mirage:

 

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p.s My 6 G pulls from left to right and back again could be smoother and flown better...but you get the idea.

Edited May 22, 2016 by Low Blow

[il_corleone]

As promised, here is a survivable way to perform BVR with the mirage:

 

 

 

p.s My 6 G pulls from left to right and back again could be smoother and flown better...but you get the idea.

 

Nice tips Low Blow, now with the new missiles we can use that kind of tactics, thanks for sharing

[Low Blow]

Thanks you are welcome il_corleone