GiGurra Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 Below is a copy of an Email I sent to the DEVs. Hopefully they and people here will agree with me, at least partially :) ====================== Dear devs There's one thing in how the f15 has been modelled that I find questionable, and thats the impossibility to IFF in non-BVR modes. At the moment the only way to IFF is to use BVR mode ("2") and NOT lock with the radar. When you're in a close fight with someone or when on a public server with lots of enemies and friendlies, IFF becomes almost impossible (except in squad battles where you can ask on Teamspeak/Ventrilo). For example if two contacts are approaching you from less than 2-3 miles and from like 30-40 degrees above or below you. If you try to slew the radar in that situaion, they will have fired/shot you down/moved already before you can IFF. I've thought about this a long time, and at the moment this is probably the most limiting feature of the F15. Would it be possible for you to add this ability in a hotfix/quick patch? I find it highly unlikely that the systems in the F-15C cannot identify while having a lock, although it can without a lock! On public servers I am currently forced to fly the Russian planes only, and I would like to fly planes on both sides. A fix is urgently needed, especially on small public missions with lots of players, where you are engaged by several bandits at the same time, while being backed up by several friendlies. Also a short note that isnt as important, would be the deceleration of the Aim-120C. After analyzing it's flight path in TacVIEW (ACMI analyzer) we have seen how it loses its speed very fast after it motor burns out, much faster than the R-77 for example. Now the problem is not the idea of an ETA difference. It's the magnitude of the difference that's debateable. Currently the R77 reaches it's target almost twice as fast as the aim120. I believe it would be good if you gave the 120 a __slight__ speed boost (or less air friction). Hope to hear from ya soon! //Johan "Gurra" ************ Former member of http://www.ironangelslockonsite.com ==== 1 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Pic does not refer to =RvE=Flame in any way
STRIKER Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 GiGurra, As a prior avionics guy in the USAF and now a flyer I totally agree with you bud on this subject in which I have had many of headaches when trying not to shoot my own friendlies in this game. If the F15 in real life had the same limited IFF capability as in LOMAC they probably wouldnt even fly untill they got that fixed...its that much of a safety concern, especially in todays world. IFF modes 2 and 4 in real life will definitely take care of your problem unforunately ED hasnt modeled that feature especially when in close and non BVR. As far as the aim120, I totally agree with you on that too and again only hope ED is working on a fix for that (which I actually hear they are :thumbup:) This is a subject that I and many others have personally brought up and I support your email to them bud. We are at the mercy of ED when it comes to the F15's avionics capability and I can only hope they incorporate at the very least the known IFF and aim 120 issues (although rumor has it they are adjusting the 120 stuff for 1.2) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Pilotasso Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 The F-15 and the A-10 basicaly fill the secondary role of apealing western clients for LOMAC. There are several issues with it that probably wont get fixed untill the next sim featuring AA fighters wich apears to be more generalistic towards the public. This SIM features several gameplay balancing issues wich seem to afect the F-15 in particular, one fact that I do understand since this is a russian game and russian aircraft wouldnt be as atractive to players if the eagle had a kill ratio of the real thing. Most notably these gameplay features are: 1)Standoff ECM jamming capability-almost nullifies the F-15 multi engagement capability, but increases the migs BVR capability by going HOJ beyond its own radar detection range. 2)Similar chaff resistance to both R-77 and AIM-120, AIM-7 and R-27's 3)American missiles are notably slower than russian missiles with the AMRAAM accelerating instantaneously but to only arround mach 2.5-3 max. AIM-9 has a range of 8 KM not 8 miles like the real thing, i.e. 60% reduction of range in optimal conditions. 4) Data link on russian fighters only, this has been a compromise because its only partialy modeled but the same hasnt been done for the F-15 on the grounds of lack of info for maximum realism(wich I dont understand why since many other more extensive aditions were made in every patch based in incomplete info). 5) Gci doesnt work for the west side. 6) Target recognition, but no Iff for F-15 wich leaves up for the mission designer to decide if each side should have specific aircraft or not, thus making it more difficult for those who choose the eagle. 7) by contrast IFF recognition is instantaneous regardless of the range. .
britgliderpilot Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 Granted, it's hidden away after a sticky clear-up, but there is a LOOOOOONG list of things that we'd like improving about the Eagle - see this link: http://forum.lockon.ru/showthread.php?t=5658 The Devs have read it, they've weighed in, they've taken it on board - what remains to be seen is whether they have the time to implement it in v1.2, the lions share of which is inevitably going to be focussed on the Ka50. They'd like to see improvements as much as we would, but pressures of development and funding may delay it longer than some would like. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v121/britgliderpilot/BS2Britgliderpilot-1.jpg
Force_Feedback Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 GCI still doesn't work as it should, the emphasis is not on Russia's fighters remember, they wanted to fix those issues from Flanker, when there was no F-15/A-10, all they did before release were very minor fixes concerning detection ranges. Now, the F-15 and A-10 are the next step to correct, and add as much features as is possible. And all of you thinking the Su-27 is better moddeled than the F-15, think again. Next project will focus of the F-16C and possible some mig-29 variant, with more in-depth systems (which will be a b**ch to find for the 29M/SMT ). In 1.2 there will be the 120B with a higher range, the Aim-9P and updated textures and models for many Western weapons (Vulcan vid). Creedence Clearwater Revival:worthy:
Pilotasso Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 The AIM-9M has been acting like an AIM-9P already, Im curious too see how both missiles behave in 1.2. .
GGTharos Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 AIM-9P will not track targets head-on. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
Force_Feedback Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 AIM-9P will not track targets head-on. It better not, I want a damn dogfight, not the 'eh, there's an enemy somewhere near, lets launch 5 missiles at him' lame game. Creedence Clearwater Revival:worthy:
Pilotasso Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 AIM-9P will not track targets head-on. The range of the AIM-9M inhibits its use from the rear also. Anyone traveling at 500kts and above, might as well take the gun instead. Its longer ranged. .
tflash Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 We've had these discusisons before, but GiGurra's post states it crystal clear. Lack of IFF and the airbraking Amraam are the two top annoyances in an otherwise superb game. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Cosmonaut Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 We've had these discusisons before, but GiGurra's post states it crystal clear. Lack of IFF and the airbraking Amraam are the two top annoyances in an otherwise superb game. I totally agree .. I don’t believe in the idea that ED are trying to balance game play in anyway and comparing the r/l kill ratio of the F15 to lomac is a little tricky because the Eagle has never faced most of the fighters in LO. .. That’s not even mentioning skill level (training), out numbering the enemy etc. Cozmo. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Minimum effort, maximum satisfaction. CDDS Tutorial Version 3. | Main Screen Mods.
Shaman Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 I don't believe that ED did it on purpose because they "balance" the game. That's just B.S. I also completely disagree about taking kill-ratio as primary concern and "then build the airplane around it". It's like doing a scientific experiment where you begin with results, what is wrong. There's no real F-15vsSu-27 kill ratio anyway only some incoclusive results from Cope India exercises. I'd also like to see some avionics improvements in LockOn but it's not going to happen in this product I guess. Raygun-buddyspike combo works well for me on TeamSpeak. 51PVO Founding member (DEC2007-) 100KIAP Founding member (DEC2018-) :: Shaman aka [100☭] Shamansky tail# 44 or 444 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 100KIAP Regiment Early Warning & Control officer
cool_t Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 F-15c fix? Well, In most cases I do not even bother locking up air-craft in the 20nm range due to the F-15c's lack of IFF. But with all of the reductions the F-15c has faced in LOMAC and if us Eagle drivers get updated I feel that we will need combat to prove its' new upgrade. To tell you the truth I never bothered to research LOMACs' AIM120s specs to the R77 or any other AAMs in any case. I do not have any issues with my SPAMRAMS. We got what we payed for $. Also when Flaming-Clifs came out I was disapointed but just like in any "life" situation I learned how to improvise with the downgrading. Some of us clients of LOMAC have also stated that there is a HUGE Western market over here that can be taped into. LOMAC 1 I had a kill ratio of 12 to 1:thumbup: LOMAC FC I have a kill ratio of 8 to 1:mad: I do not include forgeting to deploy:( my landing gear when I land (Crash) or SAM kills. If what some of you gents are saying is true then "S" See ya in your G suit
Kenan Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 I know BS is all about chopper, but it would be kinda silly (if they are already taking so much time to finish it) not to fix some of those issues with the F15. It's not like we're asking for new avionics or AFM for fighter jets, just simple fix, like this IFF thing. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Commanding Officer of: 2nd Company 1st financial guard battalion "Mrcine" See our squads here and our . Croatian radio chat for DCS World
nscode Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 Ough, update their silly aircraft so we can still shoot them down and continue with our lives :D Never forget that World War III was not Cold for most of us.
GGTharos Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 And where is my cupholder?! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda
Guest IguanaKing Posted September 2, 2006 Posted September 2, 2006 And where is my cupholder?! Yeah, and what about piping some XM or HD radio into that 3-D sound system the F-15 already has? :D
GiGurra Posted September 3, 2006 Author Posted September 3, 2006 I hope the Devs will read and reply to my email. I'm not counting on it though =( [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Pic does not refer to =RvE=Flame in any way
Cosmonaut Posted September 3, 2006 Posted September 3, 2006 I hope the Devs will read and reply to my email. I'm not counting on it though =( I doubt they’ll reply but they are listening... so don’t be =( .. be :D Cozmo. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Minimum effort, maximum satisfaction. CDDS Tutorial Version 3. | Main Screen Mods.
Camoman Posted September 3, 2006 Posted September 3, 2006 Well said mate and I hope these two thigns are looked at as it will really help out alot. =IronAngels= Http://www.ironangelslockonsquad.com Iron Angels Lockon Squad Iron Angels: The Proud, The Few, The Elite
SUBS17 Posted September 3, 2006 Posted September 3, 2006 GCI still doesn't work as it should, the emphasis is not on Russia's fighters remember, they wanted to fix those issues from Flanker, when there was no F-15/A-10, all they did before release were very minor fixes concerning detection ranges. Now, the F-15 and A-10 are the next step to correct, and add as much features as is possible. And all of you thinking the Su-27 is better moddeled than the F-15, think again. Next project will focus of the F-16C and possible some mig-29 variant, with more in-depth systems (which will be a b**ch to find for the 29M/SMT ). In 1.2 there will be the 120B with a higher range, the Aim-9P and updated textures and models for many Western weapons (Vulcan vid). The thing I like about the F-16C is that it has both a data link and IFF so in reality with the data link you can track your element on the HSD in BVR and also the aircraft your flight locks up also shows up on the HSD. [sIGPIC] [/sIGPIC]
SUBS17 Posted September 3, 2006 Posted September 3, 2006 I don't believe that ED did it on purpose because they "balance" the game. That's just B.S. I also completely disagree about taking kill-ratio as primary concern and "then build the airplane around it". It's like doing a scientific experiment where you begin with results, what is wrong. There's no real F-15vsSu-27 kill ratio anyway only some incoclusive results from Cope India exercises. I'd also like to see some avionics improvements in LockOn but it's not going to happen in this product I guess. Raygun-buddyspike combo works well for me on TeamSpeak. You can't base anything on kill ratio for any aircraft since it boils down to experience, A/A tactics and AWACs support. [sIGPIC] [/sIGPIC]
Xealot Posted September 4, 2006 Posted September 4, 2006 Yeah, and what about piping some XM or HD radio into that 3-D sound system the F-15 already has? :D You know what we really need.. throw out the RWR and other useless hardware like that MFD and slap in a FM radio instead, perhaps a mini TV.. and dont forget some games too, like in Bensky & Mutch The community newbie http://winsbydefault.com/pics/dctf1ibxh7.gif Replace this image! It's too big! © Administration (max size: 150pix height, 50kb)
tflash Posted September 4, 2006 Posted September 4, 2006 You mean like the nostalgic Black&White TV in the Su-25T with the local Caucasus program? I still didn't find how to tune it to CNN. ;) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
Pilotasso Posted September 4, 2006 Posted September 4, 2006 You can't base anything on kill ratio for any aircraft since it boils down to experience, A/A tactics and AWACs support. This is a 2 edged sword. The baseline flanker has been known to have fought with R-27's against the same Mig-29's the US aircraft did but with much poorer results for the russian missile. The R-73 on the other hand has proven itself. But without good BVR missiles and a modern cockpit the Su-27 is impaired realy. .
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