Need advice on forced landing

[jfri]

I have reached the advanced maneuvers where I'm at the end must perform a forced landing. And at that point I always fail for the reason that I can't stop the plane so it goes of the runway and get damaged or completely demolished with a death in campaign scored .

Some thoughts here. Since I shot down both engines it makes sense to me that I can't lower the flaps or engage the air brake since I have no hydraulics. But is it realistic that I can lower the landing gears and engage the brakes without engine supplied hydraulics ?

What is the best way to do this landing and then stop the plane on the runway?

[cromhunt]

Don't exactly what aircraft you are talking about?

With a warbird,give a try to following:

Try to make your approach sliding a side to reduce speed close to minimum.When turn left push the right foot pedal while pushing stick to left side.If turn right push pedal left and stick right.

The fuse will make opposition to relative wind.Take care of speed to not snap roll.

Short final return to line maintain lower speed,when touch down maintain stick full back even after a bump.Apply brakes if working.

see you:)

[jcbak]

Try using the EMERGENCY BRAKE. Yellow handle below the left canopy rail.

[jfri]

Don't exactly what aircraft you are talking about?

With a warbird,give a try to following:

 

The aircraft of course is A10-C since that is the plane used in this DLC

[jfri]

Try using the EMERGENCY BRAKE. Yellow handle below the left canopy rail.

 

I just tried that and it seemed that this emergency break had no effect at all.

[majapahit]

the APU might work?

[Frederf]

The emergency braking lever only switches from left to right hydraulics for brakes. Make the decision based on the hydraulic pressures indicated. There are accumulators in the system, NWS and anti-skid are disabled. You have limited hydraulic accumulator reserve so make all efforts to not use any for other purposes and use as few brake applications as possible (at least 5 should be available). Take care not to skid the tires.

 

Emergency gear extraction is possible without hydraulic pressure using the emergency releases.

 

If departing the runway seems likely, shut off engines as early as practical in the landing (prevent idle thrust). Retract the gear (using the download override as necessary).

[jfri]

the APU might work?

 

I doubt that I'm supposed to do that, otherwise I think I would have been told to do so.

[jfri]

The emergency braking lever only switches from left to right hydraulics for brakes. Make the decision based on the hydraulic pressures indicated. There are accumulators in the system, NWS and anti-skid are disabled. You have limited hydraulic accumulator reserve so make all efforts to not use any for other purposes and use as few brake applications as possible (at least 5 should be available). Take care not to skid the tires.

 

Emergency gear extraction is possible without hydraulic pressure using the emergency releases.

 

If departing the runway seems likely, shut off engines as early as practical in the landing (prevent idle thrust). Retract the gear (using the download override as necessary).

 

Retracting the gears when on the runway ?:shocking: without damaging the plane ?

 

Since I'm getting tired at failing the mission after successfully performing all the previous tasks I wonder

It's said that I'm authorized to eject if not able to land. If I do that will I pass the mission ?

[majapahit]

the APU might work?

I doubt that I'm supposed to do that, otherwise I think I would have been told to do so.

 

If the APU still works its the solution to all your problems (by a mile)

[Yurgon]

If the APU still works its the solution to all your problems (by a mile)

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the APU have nothing to do at all with hydraulic pressure?

[majapahit]

the APU might work?

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the APU have nothing to do at all with hydraulic pressure?

 

do your flaps, surfaces and brakes work with the APU up and running?

[Yurgon]

do your flaps, surfaces and brakes work with the APU up and running?

 

On startup, nope, pretty sure they don't.

 

Flaps start to retract as soon as the left engine begins to spool up. At the same time, the corresponding hydraulic pressure gauge starts to indicate a rise in pressure.

 

Pretty sure the other systems also correctly depend on left and right hydraulic pressure which in turn depends on the corresponding engine to be running.

 

However, the manual mentions that the APU powers a hydraulic pump.

 

Then again, whenever single or dual hydraulic failure is mentioned in the manual, it never states that the APU should be turned on.

 

So, are you asking us to do our homework, or are you just guessing?

[majapahit]

On startup, nope, pretty sure they don't.

 

Flaps start to retract as soon as the left engine begins to spool up. At the same time, the corresponding hydraulic pressure gauge starts to indicate a rise in pressure.

 

Pretty sure the other systems also correctly depend on left and right hydraulic pressure which in turn depends on the corresponding engine to be running.

 

However, the manual mentions that the APU powers a hydraulic pump.

 

Then again, whenever single or dual hydraulic failure is mentioned in the manual, it never states that the APU should be turned on.

 

So, are you asking us to do our homework, or are you just guessing?

 

with A10C at least the empennage seems to be powered by the APU (or it does in DCS), no hydraulics

 

so perhaps you can make it back 'by the taill'?

:)

[Yurgon]

with A10C at least the empennage seems to be powered by the APU (or it does in DCS), no hydraulics

 

so perhaps you can make it back 'by the taill'?

:)

 

You mean the control surfaces (aileron, elevator, rudder)?

 

These should be powered by left and right hydraulics, the manual gives more detail which one is powered by which.

 

In Manual Reversion (MRFCS), they can be partly actuated even without hydraulics. Again, this is independent of the APU to the best of my knowledge.

 

Manual Reversion Flight Control System (MRFCS)

The MRFCS is used for emergency situations when both hydraulics systems have failed or a complete failure is impending. Flight control is radically reduced and primarily relies on use of trim tabs to fly the aircraft. While sufficient for light maneuvering, it is not feasible to land with.

 

I think I read that in MRFCS pilots also need a lot of force to work the control surfaces, which is a problem that DCS just can't simulate. So even if we can get some decent maneuverability out of the aircraft, it would probably be much less maneuverable in RL.

 

And so, coming back to the original topic:

 

What is the best way to do this landing and then stop the plane on the runway?

 

If you get really really lucky and can get a little juice out of the hydraulic reservoirs in order to apply a bit of brake pressure, you might make it. Officially, though, just punch out. Your chances of survival are too slim, and the Air Force invested way too much money in your career to lose both an aircraft and a pilot.

 

Think of MRFCS as a way to get you to your side of the FEBA so that you can punch out over friendly territory evading capture, so that you get to fly another day.

 

Oh, one more thing: If your wrecked aircraft blocks the runway, other battle damaged aircraft might not make it to the nearest divert airport, so their pilots might be forced to eject if you screw up. Just be a teamplayer, steer your Hog to the ground and eject. ;)

Edited September 11, 2016 by Yurgon

[majapahit]

with A10C at least the empennage seems to be powered by the APU (or it does in DCS), no hydraulics

 

so perhaps you can make it back 'by the taill'?

:)

 

How i noticed, have A10C on ramp, switch on battery, start APU, switch APU GEN PWR,

 

go outside et voila, the empennage sufaces work (Rudder, Elev)

 

I think I can remember from FS FlightsimX different aircraft have different setups for the APU, like running (some) hydraulics with the APU.

[QuiGon]

I'm with Yurgon here. From the best of my knowledge and what I remember from the sim the APU does not provide any hdraulic power at all.

 

Edit: I just noticed that there actually is an APU-powered hydraulic pump, but as far as I can see it is only used for maintainance. When I do a startup I only get hydraulic pressure when turning on the main engines.

 

I just tried that and it seemed that this emergency break had no effect at all.

The emergency brake handle only switches to the emergency brake system, but to actually brake you still need to use the toe brakes.

Normally the brakes are powered by the left hyraulic system, but if you pull the emergency brake lever it will switch to the right hydraulic system. Be advised, that the emergency brake system does not provide anti-skid.

If no hydraulics are available the emergency brake accumulator provides enough pressure for aprox. 3 brake pumps.

[funkyfranky]

You might also want to take a look at Bunyap's vids for left and right system hydraulic failure. He explains it very nicely (as always).

Left:

Right:

[jfri]

The emergency braking lever only switches from left to right hydraulics for brakes. Make the decision based on the hydraulic pressures indicated. There are accumulators in the system, NWS and anti-skid are disabled. You have limited hydraulic accumulator reserve so make all efforts to not use any for other purposes and use as few brake applications as possible (at least 5 should be available). Take care not to skid the tires.

 

Emergency gear extraction is possible without hydraulic pressure using the emergency releases.

 

If departing the runway seems likely, shut off engines as early as practical in the landing (prevent idle thrust). Retract the gear (using the download override as necessary).

 

But I didn't use any emergency release but instead the ordinary command to lower the gears.

 

I read in the manual that in case of a flame out the correct procedure is to activate the emergency brake. What is the point of switching from left to right hydraulics if there are no pressure in neither of them ?

 

How long should a brake application be ?