Introducing the VKB-Sim ‘Modern Combat Grip’ (MCG)

[AeroGator]

Oooooooooooooopssssssss

 

I was kind of wondering there myself.

Did I expect VKB to be an enthusiastic ball of fire about an email I sent to Wheel Stand Pro? No.

 

Ooops, a giant misunderstanding here.:doh:

 

First, Buckeye wrote about some other product in "our" thread, and I somehow presumed he was talking about our future product. Especially when he said, I wrote to them (which I took as to us, ourselves). "Their" reply looked quite similar to a reply I always give in similar situations, so I also presumed it was my reply to him...

 

We are of course receiving a lot of suggestions, and not all of them we can accept, and not all of them we can review in detail.

Sometimes the suggestions are about something we are already planning to implement.

So as you guys probably know we are not really opening a big discussion before the product is officially announced, and its picture and basic specs published. Till then, I only reply like "thanks, we will look into it". (and we do).

 

Once again, I was barking at the wrong tree, sorry. Hope, the right trees don't feel insulted ;)

 

I would like more information about the vkb desk mounts in development

They exist in drawings, more or less final, and will be announced early next year. Would be earlier, but we've got behind the schedule with the MCG and want to get back on track before giving more promises we might have troubles keeping. However, we're pretty sure our mounts will be a hit.

[Buckeye]

Introducing the VKB-Sim ‘Modern Combat Grip’ (MCG)

 

All good, Aero...no worries. Look forward to future announcements from VKB, I'm still holding tight waiting to see everything both you and VPC offer before I make my "Warthog HOTAS replacement" decision.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[simo1000rr]

i had a warthog that i used to mount on an air force one play seat , by default the play seat comes with all the holes in place to mount any thrustmaster or Saitek product , However when i bought the Gladiator Pro the holes position didnt match any of the Supplied Steel plate with the Play seat " it comes with 3 steel plate " So i drilled my own holes using a vertical drill holder from amazon . it is better when the holes comes pre configured however its very easy to drill your own holes.

[StandingCow]

I actually use 3M locking tape instead of bothering to drill holes. The stuff is amazing. They hold my rudder pedals, I am sure they will have no trouble holding my stick to my stand.

[simo1000rr]

I actually use 3M locking tape instead of bothering to drill holes. The stuff is amazing. They hold my rudder pedals, I am sure they will have no trouble holding my stick to my stand.

 

ya but with those type of velcro tape you still get a wobbly feeling when moving the joystick especially if the joystick springs need some heavy force to move it around which will create a moment around the base where you fix the tape to. drilling holes took me exactly 10 minutes on a Sunday morning while drinking my coffee literally

[StandingCow]

ya but with those type of velcro tape you still get a wobbly feeling when moving the joystick especially if the joystick springs need some heavy force to move it around which will create a moment around the base where you fix the tape to. drilling holes took me exactly 10 minutes on a Sunday morning while drinking my coffee literally

 

Hmmmm, I will see if that's the case when I mount my stick. Yea, drilling holes wouldn't be a big deal if I get that wobbling.

[Buckeye]

Introducing the VKB-Sim ‘Modern Combat Grip’ (MCG)

 

 

I believe the mounting brackets of the Gunfighter base are larger than the Wheel Stand Pro joystick mounting bracket (designed for the Warthog). It would require a "middle adapter" piece to go in between them that could have one set of holes used to mount itself to the WSP base and then another set of holes to have the VKB base mounted to it. One example I had seen previously was done with very thick plexiglass.

 

Edit: found the pic...

 

 

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Edited November 8, 2017 by =Buckeye=

[Sokol1_br]

I believe the mounting brackets of the Gunfighter base are larger than the Wheel Stand Pro joystick mounting bracket (designed for the Warthog).

 

Holes for base plate screws in Gunfighter base is spaced 64,2mm x 69mm. The holes for fit the plate in "cockpit" is 79mm x 93mm.

 

https://vkbcontrollers.com/?product=gunfighter-pro-basic-measurements

 

In Warthog the holes in the base is spaced 60,1mm x 60,1mm.

 

https://imagescdn.tweaktown.com/content/6/5/6533_23_thrustmaster_hotas_warthog_flight_stick_review.jpg

Edited November 8, 2017 by Sokol1_br

[Fri13]

Sounds fantastic! I hope it's the same size/mounting pattern as the Warthog for simplicity purposes when mounting into existing cockpits.

 

But why to limit possibilities by imitating a competitor?

 

A throttle could have a 10cm more length and that to be used for a 2-3 row of buttons, switches, knobs or even levelers.

[Bearfoot]

But why to limit possibilities by imitating a competitor?

 

A throttle could have a 10cm more length and that to be used for a 2-3 row of buttons, switches, knobs or even levelers.

 

+1.

 

I agree.

 

1000%.

 

The TMWH was decent (not great, though better than what used to be there before). There is absolutely no reason that all future products by all other companies should be shackled to this form/plan. It is absurd that designers/developers/engineers from around the world should want to build every control according to a A-10C design/dimensions as seen by a particular company a decade ago.

 

Start from scratch, and give us the best for what we fly today without compromise, and let form follow function.

[Buckeye]

Introducing the VKB-Sim ‘Modern Combat Grip’ (MCG)

 

But why to limit possibilities by imitating a competitor?

 

 

 

A throttle could have a 10cm more length and that to be used for a 2-3 row of buttons, switches, knobs or even levelers.

 

 

 

Why? Because it will make my life easier mounting it to my WSP and I fly in VR, so I don't need a million buttons. For most things that aren't urgent in a flight, I prefer to click in the cockpit instead of some "fake positioned" switch or button on my throttle. The VPC design, which is the same size and mounting as the TMWH, has more than enough.

 

Will that be everyone's preference? No. But it's mine.

 

 

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[Rocky49]

 

I believe the mounting brackets of the Gunfighter base are larger than the Wheel Stand Pro joystick mounting bracket (designed for the Warthog). It would require a "middle adapter" piece to go in between them that could have one set of holes used to mount itself to the WSP base and then another set of holes to have the VKB base mounted to it. One example I had seen previously was done with very thick plexiglass.

 

Edit: found the pic...

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Buckeye: This is exactly what I am going to do

[Fri13]

Why? Because it will make my life easier mounting it to my WSP and I fly in VR, so I don't need a million buttons. For most things that aren't urgent in a flight, I prefer to click in the cockpit instead of some "fake positioned" switch or button on my throttle. The VPC design, which is the same size and mounting as the TMWH, has more than enough.

 

Will that be everyone's preference? No. But it's mine.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Why not just get a stick with 3 buttons and fly with keyboard as VR and size is so important?

 

The HOTAS idea is to have your hands on throttle and stick and we have multiple modules instead one, meaning HOTAS needs to be as flexible as possible.

 

In VR you don't have a half of the real things you would needs as the HMD is blocking your view and you are relying far more to physical controls in HOTAS than virtual ones.

In reality pilots train to fly the thing without thinking it, hands operate things without looking and thinking because their places are known and settings are known.

 

You can do same in VR as there is no tactile and haptic feedback.

 

In a simpit one can drop hand on weapon panel to operate it without looking it. In VR it doesn't work that way.

 

In VR dropping hand on throttle where there are physical buttons and switchboard, allows to do more things faster than in VR by looking.

 

 

 

--

I usually post from my phone so please excuse any typos, inappropriate punctuation and capitalization, missing words and general lack of cohesion and sense in my posts.....

[Rocky49]

Why not just get a stick with 3 buttons and fly with keyboard as VR and size is so important?

 

The HOTAS idea is to have your hands on throttle and stick and we have multiple modules instead one, meaning HOTAS needs to be as flexible as possible.

 

In VR you don't have a half of the real things you would needs as the HMD is blocking your view and you are relying far more to physical controls in HOTAS than virtual ones.

In reality pilots train to fly the thing without thinking it, hands operate things without looking and thinking because their places are known and settings are known.

 

You can do same in VR as there is no tactile and haptic feedback.

 

In a simpit one can drop hand on weapon panel to operate it without looking it. In VR it doesn't work that way.

 

In VR dropping hand on throttle where there are physical buttons and switchboard, allows to do more things faster than in VR by looking.

 

 

 

--

I usually post from my phone so please excuse any typos, inappropriate punctuation and capitalization, missing words and general lack of cohesion and sense in my posts.....

 

Fri13: Do you currently fly in VR

[aaron886]

Well, if we’re all just currently making preferences heard... I’d rather the new throttle not match the WH base unless VKB feels that meets their desired performance. I know the TMWH was widely purchased, but it’s not worth emulating. I think VPC made a mistake there.

[Sokol1_br]

I think that instead stretch this (T50) throttle base more, add a switch/buttons panel X-56F style will result more practical.

 

https://virpil.by/images/stories/virtuemart/product/MT-50_Throttle_04.jpg

https://virpil.by/images/stories/virtuemart/product/MT-50_Throttle_05.jpg

Edited November 8, 2017 by Sokol1_br

[elecsys]

@ rrhode or aerogator

May I ask when will we be able to order the left-hand MCG?

Where does this one sit on the planned roadmap?

 

Sorry if the question has already been asked.

[AeroGator]

when will we be able to order the left-hand MCG?

I hate to disappoint you, but the only thing I can say is, Not any time soon.

It is planned, and it will be released, but there are many higher prioritized products that we will focus on before getting to MCG-L.

Technically it is not going to be a mirror flip of the MCG-R; so it's a mistake to think there is less to r-n-d for a left-hand version. Different internal layout, different molds, etc., etc. At this moment I can't even tell whether it is going to happen within 2018 or not. But it will happen eventually.

[Buckeye]

I hate to disappoint you, but the only thing I can say is, Not any time soon.

It is planned, and it will be released, but there are many higher prioritized products that we will focus on before getting to MCG-L.

Technically it is not going to be a mirror flip of the MCG-R; so it's a mistake to think there is less to r-n-d for a left-hand version. Different internal layout, different molds, etc., etc. At this moment I can't even tell whether it is going to happen within 2018 or not. But it will happen eventually.

 

Any interest in speculating if the throttle will be a 2018 release? :smilewink:

[Mars Exulte]

Two weeks.

[Sideslip]

But why to limit possibilities by imitating a competitor?

 

A throttle could have a 10cm more length and that to be used for a 2-3 row of buttons, switches, knobs or even levelers.

 

I just want to point out that it is really trivial for an engineer to design the throttle to use the same mounting holes as another device like the tmwh. You only need to make holes with the proper internal support in the right locations, the holes don't need to be at the extremities of the device. This is even easier if it bolts on from the bottom only as it doesn't affect the appearance.

 

Standardizing attachment methods and dimensions is never a bad thing, and makes life much easier for the end user. I've got a mount for the x-55 and while if/when I get a VKB I will drill the required holes in the plate, it would be much less hassle if it were just a simple swap.

 

It is the same principle as the development of their new sticks which are intended to swap out of all bases. It's even the same principle as DCS World in so far as all modules and aircraft are intended to work within the same framework so that netcode, graphics updates, weapon changes and multiplayer communities are all tied together regardless of which product you buy (if they ever merge the damn version). Imagine if the A-10 guys couldn't play with the su-27 guys or the upcoming f-18 as they were all different games. Compatibility makes purchases more likely.

 

I could rant for hours about lack of standardization.

[AeroGator]

Any interest in speculating if the throttle will be a 2018 release? :smilewink:

Problem is, speculating doesn't really help to speed it up.

We hope it will.

We are actually planning to focus on it as soon as the MCG is out.

But.

There are many more variables though than you can imagine. (and me, too)

Edited November 10, 2017 by AeroGator

[AeroGator]

it is really trivial for an engineer to design the throttle to use the same mounting holes as another device

A very popular mistake but still a mistake. :noexpression:

[aaron886]

I think that instead stretch this (T50) throttle base more, add a switch/buttons panel X-56F style will result more practical.

 

https://virpil.by/images/stories/virtuemart/product/MT-50_Throttle_04.jpg

https://virpil.by/images/stories/virtuemart/product/MT-50_Throttle_05.jpg

 

To be fair, for people like me, this would be a null result. I have an (somewhat expensive) MonsterTech HW throttle mount that would likely not be compatible with some wild panel attachment like the X-65F. This is just to highlight how much more complicated an issue this is than some people appreciate.

[Sokol1_br]

Fair. :thumbup:

 

Opera resume: everyone want a throttle/joy/pedal.. that fit "PnP" in their actual personal "cockpit", not adapt their "cockpit" for new hardware design's. :D