Carpet bombing not working with B17 in 2.5

[Muybonito523]

Hey just wondering when someone gets a chance, try WWII carpet bombing in DCS 2.5 with B17 to see if it works for them, I just tried a mission I did a little bit ago and the bombers now just drop one bomb at a time starting from the leader back.

[IronJockel]

Hey just wondering when someone gets a chance, try WWII carpet bombing in DCS 2.5 with B17 to see if it works for them, I just tried a mission I did a little bit ago and the bombers now just drop one bomb at a time starting from the leader back.

 

Just tried it.

Nope

[Captain Orso]

I tried it too, setting up a formation the way I had previously done and successfully carpet bombed, and my formation didn't drop a single bomb :(

[BIGNEWY]

Hi Guys, I will check this internally.

 

Can you add your mission showing an example so I can compare

 

thanks

[Stonehouse]

Noticed an issue with aircraft attacking ships with bombs. They just fly over the target and don't attack. Possibly an issue with bombing generally?

[Blech]

Hi,

 

:dunno: Check your Loadout in the Mission-Editor. Set to EMPTY or 12xBombs ?

 

I created a test-mission under 2.5 Open Beta with 3*3 Bombers in formation with two carpet-bombings ( drop HALF / drop ALL)

 

No problems - Screenshot shows the second carpet-bombing

[Emmy]

Just went to build a test with B-17Gs and under the "Payloads" tab, the only existing option was "Empty"

 

Had to create a New Payload to choose bombs...

[Reflected]

It works for me. Check this mission I created to see how it's set up:

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=201916

[BIGNEWY]

It is working for us also internally :)

[Muybonito523]

Thanks for the mission I'll give it a shot, maybe be there is a new specific way to do it.

[Emmy]

Just sent 12 (3 flights of 4) on a raid in a wedge of Combat Box formations and all 12 dropped all their bombs with only two losses due to...

 

wait for it...

 

...trying to make a welded wing, drop out element landing together. The other 10 made similar landings but did it successfully.

 

Um, heavy bombers making element landings? No, no, no, no, no.... :doh:

 

They did keep excellent station en route however. :thumbup:

[Muybonito523]

Yep just made a mission and they work now, they must've fixed something in that last update because they weren't doing anything last time I tried to do the same exact thing. Good! I can make a bomber escort mission again!

[Emmy]

There's a surprise after they land and shut down...

[ECMO1]

Everything seems to work for me, but I need to enter the pattern length in meters. Although the field displays the pattern length in feet, it sees my input as meters and converts it to feet. Enter 1000 and the field will convert to 1640.

[Captain Orso]

Hi Guys, I will check this internally.

 

Can you add your mission showing an example so I can compare

 

thanks

 

Okay, I don't get it :(

 

I've attached two missions. Each is with only bombers and a gamemaster, so you can watch the bombers. I've added bombloads for the bombers, and IIRC did everything the way I learned it in 2.1.

 

If anybody can tell me what is wrong with these missions I'd be much obliged.

Cauc Test Carpet Bomb Krasnodar.miz

Cauc Test Carpet Bomb Krasnodar 00.miz

[Coxy_99]

I can confirm lead group dives the other element gores home.

[BIGNEWY]

Take a look at this example, it may help

B17.miz

[Blech]

Okay, I don't get it :(

 

I've attached two missions. Each is with only bombers and a gamemaster, so you can watch the bombers. I've added bombloads for the bombers, and IIRC did everything the way I learned it in 2.1.

 

If anybody can tell me what is wrong with these missions I'd be much obliged.

 

 

Hi,

 

I changed by each of the 4 groups -> ROE to ONLY DESIGNATED -> OK

 

:dunno: Don`t ask me. What is wrong ? RETURN FIRE should be ok

IF ROE = WEAPON FREE or RETURN FIRE -> the formation will split after some time (waypoint 1 ?), only group 1 is on course

[Emmy]

Trying to take a "scientific" approach to determining what makes this go Tango Uniform:

 

So Far:

Very simple setup over Normandy of Start In Flight at FL 250 -> One Waypoint -> IP Waypoint-> Target -> Off Target Waypoint

1 Bomber @ FL 250 will bomb

4 Bombers in one flight @ FL 250 will bomb

8 Bombers in two flights (lead and slot) @ FL 250 will bomb

16 Bombers in four flights (lead, rw, lw and slot) @ FL 250 will bomb

(Note that I have not changed any default settings for the aircraft or for the formation spacing(s))

Same 16 bombers with default settings and default formation will bomb from FL 250 with eight 88s defending the target and no defensive maneuvering was observed.

 

Ran out of time tonight, but next I'll introduce an escort flight of 1, 2, 3 and then 4 Mustangs @ co-alt and then 5K above. If that works, then I'll introduce a Cap flight of Bf-109s. If that still works, I'll back the bombers up by several waypoints and make the entire formation turn some before reaching the IP.

 

Bound and determined to figure out what breaks this... :) It's just too cool a function to not enjoy fully. BTW, a sh*t storm of flak coming up is an amazing sight!

Edited February 12, 2018 by Emmy

[Emmy]

Ok, so as I posted above, I:

- Added in a couple escort flights and that had no effect.

- Doubled the amount of flak, and that had no effect.

- Added two CAP flights of Bf-109s, and that had no effect.

- I moved the entire flight of bombers and escorts such that there was a 30-40 degree turn only about five miles before the IP...

 

DING DING DING

 

The entire scenario went to hell in a hand basket! The bombers headed off on some random direction but eventually tried to circle back to the IP. The opposing fighters shredded the formation until there were only three bombers left. Those bombers actually did drop three bombs each but from a much different heading than the mission called for and the bombs fell short of the target.

 

So, I dragged the IP back another 20 miles and ran it again without changing anything else. This time, the mission worked as planned. I think the fighters knocked down like two or three bombers but the rest put the full stick on the target.

 

One final try had me drag the allied formation all the way back to Cherbourg on a southerly heading with a nearly 90 degree turn at the first waypoint but I left the IP well back from the target (roughly 30 miles) And again, the mission worked as planned.

 

So the only conclusion I can draw is that a formation of B-17s needs a country mile to get their digital shorts on straight in order to properly strike a target.

 

The final iteration of the mission is attached (If I did it right...)

NORM No Fly WTF Is Up With Bombing.miz

[Captain Orso]

The issue was ROE. The ROE setting used to appear to mean only the on-board MG's, but appearance can oft be deceiving, and it is now different.

 

Changing ROE to "Only Designated" works :thumbup:, plus the MG's still fire on enemy A/C.

 

Whether having no ROE would work as well I didn't test, but since there is only a specific carpet bombing target, there should be no reason for a formation to even attempt to bomb anything else, like a kind of target of opportunity.

 

How one might make a mission, in which the primary target might have to be abandoned (weather is the only reason I can think of for this) and attack a secondary target (not seldom the case during the war) might be designated, I have no idea.

[Emmy]

The issue was ROE. The ROE setting used to appear to mean only the on-board MG's, but appearance can oft be deceiving, and it is now different.

 

Changing ROE to "Only Designated" works :thumbup:, plus the MG's still fire on enemy A/C.

 

Whether having no ROE would work as well I didn't test, but since there is only a specific carpet bombing target, there should be no reason for a formation to even attempt to bomb anything else, like a kind of target of opportunity.

 

How one might make a mission, in which the primary target might have to be abandoned (weather is the only reason I can think of for this) and attack a secondary target (not seldom the case during the war) might be designated, I have no idea.

 

I ran through all the iterations I posted above without giving the bombers a specific ROE.

[jonsky7]

On 2/10/2018 at 2:54 AM, ECMO1 said:

Everything seems to work for me, but I need to enter the pattern length in meters. Although the field displays the pattern length in feet, it sees my input as meters and converts it to feet. Enter 1000 and the field will convert to 1640.

OMG, thanks for this, I couldn't for the life of me figure out why every time I changed the pattern length it would change to 9843ft. That must be the maximum length if feet.