Gen 1.5-2 HMD Roundup for DCS

[Supmua]

I don't believe you can play VR in any resolution other than the native one. At least for CV1, Odyssey, Vive and P5K+. There's no way to change the resolution, and when you change it in-game, it's just ignored.

 

In SteamVR settings/Application or Video, you can set the custom rendering resolution to <100% (it also shows exact rendering resolution for each eye). I believe DCS PD <1.0 also does the same thing.

Edited May 30, 2019 by Supmua

[hansangb]

In SteamVR settings/Application or Video, you can set the custom rendering resolution to <100% (it also shows exact rendering resolution for each eye). I believe DCS PD <1.0 also does the same thing.

 

Hmmm, didn't know. Never did understand why you could go below 100. Now I know! thnx

[wormeaten]

Personally, my favorites so far are Reverb and Rift S and maybe Acer Ojo and Index.

 

First of all even I have high expectation from Pimax 5/8K was a huge disappointment for me personally and lets no talk about it. Pimax RIP.

 

So far Reverb and Rift S show as my personal favorites.

The index is interesting too but I need some answers first. If it's not showing some significant benefit in visual probably no go for me. Most of it right now is price. This is not questioning is it worth this 1000$ or not. The price is fair for this level of technology and builds quality but the question is do I personally need it?

 

My point is, I will use it 80% of the time for DCS or some other siting sim. Rest of the time will occasionally play some other title as Onward or Darth Vadar blah bla, you know just recreationally. Doubt is, do I need to pay this additional 400 or 600$ when inside out tracking is more than efficient for my personal usage. Better to invest that money to GPU such as 2080ti and increase performance.

 

Acer Ojo is alternative to Reverb but the only difference is IPD adjustment and my IPD is .something belove 67mm. So Reverb and Rift S will do the trick.

 

So Real doubt is just between Reverb and Rift S. Price level is good for both HMD. So in the end, the only real question is

 

Reverb - Superior clarity but lower in game details

or

Rift S - just good clarity but higher in game details

[mhe]

I think for your use case it might be useful to wait for Acer's ProjectD OJO. It is basically a Reverb but with hardware IPD, rest should be pretty similar and it would make sense to price it similarly. It might also end up having superior optics compared to Reverb, but we will have to wait and see.

 

I have a bog standard 64mm IPD and am happy with my RS and am eagerly awaiting my Index come end of June but there is definitely a use case for 2k² HMDs and DCS definitely is one of them.

[gorzasty]

Personally, my favorites so far are Reverb and Rift S and maybe Acer Ojo and Index.

 

First of all even I have high expectation from Pimax 5/8K was a huge disappointment for me personally and lets no talk about it. Pimax RIP.

 

So far Reverb and Rift S show as my personal favorites.

The index is interesting too but I need some answers first. If it's not showing some significant benefit in visual probably no go for me. Most of it right now is price. This is not questioning is it worth this 1000$ or not. The price is fair for this level of technology and builds quality but the question is do I personally need it?

 

My point is, I will use it 80% of the time for DCS or some other siting sim. Rest of the time will occasionally play some other title as Onward or Darth Vadar blah bla, you know just recreationally. Doubt is, do I need to pay this additional 400 or 600$ when inside out tracking is more than efficient for my personal usage. Better to invest that money to GPU such as 2080ti and increase performance.

 

Acer Ojo is alternative to Reverb but the only difference is IPD adjustment and my IPD is .something belove 67mm. So Reverb and Rift S will do the trick.

 

So Real doubt is just between Reverb and Rift S. Price level is good for both HMD. So in the end, the only real question is

 

Reverb - Superior clarity but lower in game details

or

Rift S - just good clarity but higher in game details

I would really like to hear about Pimax and your experience with it. In a month or two I will change my CV1 and Pimax is my choice at the moment. Fov is the most important thing for me. Res. Is also, but I could live with Oculus. I've heard a lot of good things about it, so I'm very curious your opinion. 5k+ seems to be the best choice for sims. Fov, good res. I know it is not cheap and demands many tweaks before the game start but... I think it gives us so much in return. Can you tell us what version of PiTools you were using?

 

Wysłane z mojego SM-G960F przy użyciu Tapatalka

Edited May 30, 2019 by gorzasty

[wormeaten]

I would really like to hear about Pimax and your experience with it. In a month or two I will change my CV1 and Pimax is my choice at the moment. FOV is the most important thing for me. Res. Is also, but I could live with Oculus. I've heard a lot of good things about it, so I'm very curious your opinion. 5k+ seems to be the best choice for sims. Fov, good res. I know it is not cheap and demands many tweaks before the game start but... I think it gives us so much in return. Can you tell us what version of PiTools you were using?

 

Wysłane z mojego SM-G960F przy użyciu Tapatalka

 

Like I said before it is more personal than about performances.

When I know what they build in and end quality of the product plus bad customer support Pimax is highly overpriced. Have in mind 5K+ is 700$ only naked HMD. When you add controllers and tracking plus the simple audio price is climbing up to 1500$ for full functional Pimax. No way man.

 

Simply for such wide FOV, there is no GPU who can run it without major reducing in details.

 

Rift S, according to reports have better clarity and colors than Pimax what suggesting higher quality LCDs and optic. Right now wide FOV coming with a huge trade-off.

I think it is not time yet for such wide FOV.

My advice to you is to wait for Index reviews. This could be a good compromise between Performances, clarity, and FOV after all better experience than Pimax. An index is 1000$ with everything.

 

Make your decision about your preferences and what is offered from Pimax and Index with taking into consideration all aspects.

 

It is just my humble opinion and doesn't take it for granted. In the end, you are buying your VR HMD for your self and you know the best what you want from it. I'm just trying to show you and different angle for all, in the end, it is up to you.

Edited May 30, 2019 by wormeaten

[wormeaten]

I think for your use case it might be useful to wait for Acer's ProjectD OJO. It is basically a Reverb but with hardware IPD, rest should be pretty similar and it would make sense to price it similarly. It might also end up having superior optics compared to Reverb, but we will have to wait and see.

 

I have a bog standard 64mm IPD and am happy with my RS and am eagerly awaiting my Index come end of June but there is definitely a use case for 2k² HMDs and DCS definitely is one of them.

:thumbup: Good thinking.

 

I got 67 IPD so according to users with same IPD there is no problem in RS so why should be with Reverb.

 

Both are good and my doubt is go for higher clarity or in game details?

[gorzasty]

Like I said before it is more personal than about performances.

When I know what they build in and end quality of the product plus bad customer support Pimax is highly overpriced. Have in mind 5K+ is 700$ only naked HMD. When you add controllers and tracking plus the simple audio price is climbing up to 1500$ for full functional Pimax. No way man.

 

Simply for such wide FOV, there is no GPU who can run it without major reducing in details.

 

Rift S, according to reports have better clarity and colors than Pimax what suggesting higher quality LCDs and optic. Right now wide FOV coming with a huge trade-off.

I think it is not time yet for such wide FOV.

My advice to you is to wait for Index reviews. This could be a good compromise between Performances, clarity, and FOV after all better experience than Pimax. An index is 1000$ with everything.

 

Make your decision about your preferences and what is offered from Pimax and Index with taking into consideration all aspects.

 

It is just my humble opinion and doesn't take it for granted. In the end, you are buying your VR HMD for your self and you know the best what you want from it. I'm just trying to show you and different angle for all, in the end, it is up to you.

Thank you. I understand your point of view. Meanwhile I have bought P5k+ used once for 550EU. I think it was a good price for it. I will test it by myself and decide. Always can sell it again. I've heard performance is quite ok if you enable 64Hz. They also go for opencource with their software and this can bring some new fresh stuff. Anyway let's try it.

 

Wysłane z mojego SM-G960F przy użyciu Tapatalka

[Nagilem]

Adding Pimax to front for completeness.

 

 

 

Feel free those with a PiMax to give me pros and cons.

[dawgie79]

Since the VR tech is still in it's infancy, and will be for the next few years, I think it's crazy to buy goggles that cost 1000+, unless you drown in cash.

 

Also because you need a way to expensive GPU for that (the 2080Ti is not worth 1000+ compared to a 1080Ti. NVidia really needs some competition for us to get lower pricing on GPUs).

 

Those high prices for infant tech which you never can utilize fully within DCS due to the high demand on hardware, that just doesn't make sense. In my humble opinion of course. :)

 

Remark for the startpost: Odyssey+ is not available in EU officially.

[Svsmokey]

Since the VR tech is still in it's infancy, and will be for the next few years, I think it's crazy to buy goggles that cost 1000+, unless you drown in cash.

 

Also because you need a way to expensive GPU for that (the 2080Ti is not worth 1000+ compared to a 1080Ti. NVidia really needs some competition for us to get lower pricing on GPUs).

 

Those high prices for infant tech which you never can utilize fully within DCS due to the high demand on hardware, that just doesn't make sense. In my humble opinion of course. :)

 

Remark for the startpost: Odyssey+ is not available in EU officially.

 

Good points all...

[mhe]

:thumbup: Good thinking.

 

I got 67 IPD so according to users with same IPD there is no problem in RS so why should be with Reverb.

 

Both are good and my doubt is go for higher clarity or in game details?

 

I think that is kind of a mixed bag - the higher the clarity and resolution of the HMD, the more obvious a lack of in-game detail will be. So they kinda go hand in hand. Optimizing for VR is a whole game in itself, per HMD model that is.

 

If I had to choose, I'd go for clarity of resolution instead of in-game settings. But with reprojection techniques getting better all the time, the upcoming VR optimization patch and hardware getting better, it becomes less and less necessary to compromise.

[Nagilem]

@dawgie79 - updated start post

 

@mhe - I hope you are right and the VR optimizations come and make some of our current impossible choices, more… well... possible hehe

 

I think what you buy today will likely be good for about 18mo - 2 years. The pace at which truly new and much better GPUs seems to be slowing a bit. Not sure if that is because of software or hardware limits. I also agree 2080 cards are expensive, but so are the 1080 cards now. The difference is maybe ~$150.

[wormeaten]

I think I'm going for Reverb! :smartass: :pilotfly:

 

 

[Nagilem]

Lots of folks will be going to the reverb for sure.

 

I have an index on order and I want to try that directly before making the final decision on reverb or index.

 

The tough decision for me is - continue with WMR which is painful, or setup the index lighthouses, which is also painful, albeit briefly so.

 

While many will say its all about resolution, I have to wonder if that really will translate in the sim. I can read my cockpit now. What I want is to be able to spot better and actually IFF planes that I merge with.

 

I may have to order a reverb to try while I wait for the index and just return or sell the one I don't choose.

 

 

UGH!

[Panthera_Tigris]

 

The tough decision for me is - continue with WMR which is painful, or setup the index lighthouses, which is also painful, albeit briefly so.

 

 

I am on the same boat as you but backwards. I already have lighthouses setup from my Vive so the Index is a cheaper option for me. But I really like the Reverb's res and I mostly play seated sims. The only non-seated sim I play in VR is Beat Saber and I can continue to use my Vive for that.

 

But I am apprehensive about making the switch to WMR because people keep saying it sucks and coming from SteamVR I don't want a worse experience.

 

If the Reverb was a SteamVR headset, instant buy for me. But most likely, I will still buy it.

[Thadiun Okona]

There seems to be some confusion about the 'sweet spot' on Index, likely stemming mostly from a misinterpretation of what Norm from Tested brought up. The sweet spot he was talking about was the relation of your eye to the lenses and how much wiggle room there was for the hmd to get out of position, not edge to edge clarity. The dual element lens system requires your eyes to be properly aligned, so if the headset shifts on your face it can more easily go out of the desired location.

 

 

However with the headset actually in that location, apparently edge to edge clarity (what most people are talking about when they mention sweet spot) is extremely good. The dev from Hotdogs Horseshoes and Hand Grenades goes into more detail about this (around 5:30)

 

 

 

[Nagilem]

@PT - yup, I agree. Reverb res on steam would make this an easy decision.

 

 

 

I think that is what is frustrating me the most, that the decision isn't clear, and each hmd represents a serious compromise. The index in price (I don't have lighthouses) and finding a reasonable place to put the LHs vs the Reverbs high clarity and WMR shortcomings.

 

 

 

For me, I am only playing DCS in VR now, but I do want to try some other games. The question I haven't been able to answer is, how much will I play room scale? The o+ I have isn't very good for room scale today so I've been waiting to see the index come in to really try it.

[Nagilem]

Ok - so my solve for this conundrum was to order a reverb and keep my index preorder hahaha. Will report back what I find when I get them in.

[Harlikwin]

Since the VR tech is still in it's infancy, and will be for the next few years, I think it's crazy to buy goggles that cost 1000+, unless you drown in cash.

 

Also because you need a way to expensive GPU for that (the 2080Ti is not worth 1000+ compared to a 1080Ti. NVidia really needs some competition for us to get lower pricing on GPUs).

 

Those high prices for infant tech which you never can utilize fully within DCS due to the high demand on hardware, that just doesn't make sense. In my humble opinion of course. :)

 

Remark for the startpost: Odyssey+ is not available in EU officially.

 

IMO, the reverb will be seen as the first gen2 headset. And for DCS yes you need high end hardware, for anything else, nope. So the real question is, how much do you want to invest in playing DCS in VR. It will be at least 2 years before we see anything much better VR or GFX card wise, and by then you'll still need the best of the best to run DCS since its always a moving target.

[Harlikwin]

@PT - yup, I agree. Reverb res on steam would make this an easy decision.

 

 

 

I think that is what is frustrating me the most, that the decision isn't clear, and each hmd represents a serious compromise. The index in price (I don't have lighthouses) and finding a reasonable place to put the LHs vs the Reverbs high clarity and WMR shortcomings.

 

 

 

For me, I am only playing DCS in VR now, but I do want to try some other games. The question I haven't been able to answer is, how much will I play room scale? The o+ I have isn't very good for room scale today so I've been waiting to see the index come in to really try it.

 

Can't answer the room scale thing for you. I tried a few games and they were more or less weaksauce IMO. So for me its an easy decsion since sims are my deal, or flat screen games.

 

I do think WMR will get updated eventually, maybe even with better controllers.

[Icebeat]

Ok - so my solve for this conundrum was to order a reverb and keep my index preorder hahaha. Will report back what I find when I get them in.

 

you can buy one Index and one base station for more or less the same price as reverb, and check Ebay, I am sure many vive wands are going to be available in July

[Nagilem]

@icebeat - that is a great suggestion. Unfortunately I already pre-ordered the full index kit on 5/1 so both headsets will be inbound in June. That could be helpful for others though...

 

That does beg a question - will you get full tracking with just one lighthouse? I know any BFM I've gotten into that I crane my head around quite a bit. Not sure if one LH will allow checking six without hiccups or glitches. Does anyone have experience with only one LH?

 

So now my new conundrum - which headset to sell... Better figure it quick or June will be a raman kind of month! Though I prolly won't eat much anyway if the VR improvements hit for real next week.

 

I think it may have to be my trusty o+...

[dawgie79]

IMO, the reverb will be seen as the first gen2 headset. And for DCS yes you need high end hardware, for anything else, nope. So the real question is, how much do you want to invest in playing DCS in VR. It will be at least 2 years before we see anything much better VR or GFX card wise, and by then you'll still need the best of the best to run DCS since its always a moving target.

I don't know WMR that well. I guess if it's matured enough one can view the Reverb as a gen2.

 

I understand DCS is always in motion, however, VR won't be. Like with smartphones, VR will eventually mature as well. But for the time being, well, I would wait till a gen4 or something is released in a few years. Right now the leaps between iterations will be higher so the price is more of a factor than it will be in a few years because techdevelopment moves more quickly in the beginning, most likely.

 

And, maybe by then there'll be haptic suits to simulate G-forces as well, who knows. :pilotfly:

All in my humble opinion of course. If I would have more than enough money I would certainly be upgrading to every new, top tier iteration. But money is a factor for most, so that was sort of my consideration for my initial post. :)

[Supmua]

I'm not sure I would call Reverb a gen 2 because other than having a glorified hi-res screen, there's no improvement in other areas and everything else remains gen 1. Still the same tracking mechanism with dual camera system, and the controllers remain meh compared to competitions. Unless Microsoft decides to step up their game, we're not going to see much advancement in those areas--and you know they probably want to sell those hololens devices more.