Which Tornado do you want?

[joey45]

A very late F4 maybe, but the GR1/IDS would be best..

[Richard Dastardly]

Wasn't the TFR disabled in the GR4 update? that'd make me go for the GR1 immediately. GW1 era with TIALD would still give precision munitions. I've no idea how the German or Italian ones were updated, maybe they've got some interesting halfway between the original & fully GPS etc.

[AeriaGloria]

I’ve learned so much about the Tornado from this thread

[TLTeo]

Wasn't the TFR disabled in the GR4 update? that'd make me go for the GR1 immediately. GW1 era with TIALD would still give precision munitions. I've no idea how the German or Italian ones were updated, maybe they've got some interesting halfway between the original & fully GPS etc.

 

 

https://www.panavia.de/aircraft/ this makes it sound like the upgrades the 3 countries did were/are fairly similar in terms of scope, so I wouldn't be surprised if they had all disabled the TFR.

[kam]

Wasn't the TFR disabled in the GR4 update?

 

I don't believe so, why would they disable it?

[TLTeo]

I don't believe so, why would they disable it?

 

 

To make room for more avionics and because the low altitude all-weather mission hasn't really been a thing since Desert Storm because it exposes the aircraft too much.

 

 

 

Strike missions now usually involve stuff launched from standoff range (think JDAM, JSOW, SDB, or even Storm Shadow), all of which are launched from medium altitude. If you're going to fly at 30k ft 100 miles away from the target then turn around, you don't need TFR. I don't know about the GR4, but the German Tornadoes definitely do not use TFR anymore.

[kam]

It wasn't removed to make room for more avionics in the GR4, crews used to routinely hand fly it when low level in VFR and TFR in IFR. RAF have up to now regarded low level flying as an essential skill, not sure if it will continue with the F-35 as you say - is it needed?. Will be interesting to see.

[TLTeo]

Fair enough. What I was saying though isn't that nobody flies low level anymore, just that low level ingress and egress does not define how real life strike packages operate anymore (and therefore a TFR isn't as useful).

[kam]

My point is DCS Tornado must have TFR, as we can simulate history :thumbup:

[TOYKILLA]

Definitely the German Tornado IDS

 

Gesendet von meinem SM-G973F mit Tapatalk

[QuiGon]

Apparently the TFR in the upgraded german Tornados (ASSTA 3.1) is not functional anymore, as the new software upgrades did not include the TFR and render it unfunctional as there was no need to retain its functionality. That's at least what I have heard and it makes me really sad if true. :(

[Bananabrai]

As of my knowledge, TFR is still functional in the german birds, however it is not used any more.

They froze the training for it, I heard.

 

A bid weird. If it's broken, they need to repair it, but they never use it/do maintenance.

90s and early 2000 german IDS are pretty different to late GR.1 and GR.4.

Targeting pod and guided munitions became a thing a lot later.

[TLTeo]

So Youtube just recommended this to me:

 

 

 

which beyond my obsession for the Tornado, shows what seem to be Tornado IDS (note that some of the aircraft have both guns and no flir pod, unlike the ECRs in the video) carrying some variant of the AGM 88. It's possible that those are even AGM-88E models, since they were just recently introduced to the Italian fleet. The SDB is also supposed to come soon.

 

All this to say, assuming I'm right, a modern Italian bird would be a good candidate for a DCS module. You'd get fancy standoff weapons no other module brings (Storm Shadow, SDB, AARM) for people that like that sort of things, and it's still fairly close to the more classic 80s bird (unlike the Gr4 which looks completely different). Having the TFR available or not could just be a mission editor option or something.

Edited November 3, 2019 by TLTeo

[naloxone]

An IDS would be fantastic. One of my favorite Sims was the old Tornado...it could be great in DCS too.

Screaming in a 100ft with the TFR on to crater a runway with the JP233. Two seater too

[Vulek]

Tornado IDS GR.1/GR.1A with Brimstone (same as Hellfire AGM114 but for Jets)

[QuiGon]

Tornado IDS GR.1/GR.1A with Brimstone (same as Hellfire AGM114 but for Jets)

So same as AGM-65 Macerick, just a bit better ;)

[TLTeo]

Did the Gr1 even carry Brimstone?

[joey45]

No

[QuiGon]

Did the Gr1 even carry Brimstone?

No, the GR.1 was already out of service when Brimstone entered service. I didn't notice he was talking about a GR.1 with Brimstone :music_whistling:

[Vulek]

sorry, my bad. you're right, "In March 2005, Brimstone entered service with No. 31 Squadron RAF.[42] Full Operational Capability (FOC) was declared for the Tornado GR4 in December 2005[42][43] The first operational sortie of dual-mode Brimstone was over Iraq as part of Operation Telic[44] on 18 December 2008[20] by a Tornado GR4[44] of IX(B) Squadron."

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brimstone_(missile)

[FRECCIA01]

For sure the first version of the Tornado must be the IDS with Mk103 engine.

Must be the standard and common version of the 1982, because each countries had some customization.

 

The correct DCS module, I think must be an early IDS version of 80's, in order to insert the aircraft in the correct scenario of the Cold War and 90's Gulf and Balkan War with the opposite right similar aircrafts.

There are some FOM (Flight Operation Manual) and APM (Aircraft Performance Manual) of the PA200 available on the website, so I think that will be simple to develop the module with the references and avionics variance reported on these documents.

 

CSAS, RPMD, ESSRD, TFR, TV/TAB, SAHR, GMR, and many more are the key avionics system that make the Tornado the best every weather low level fighter-bomber.

[Richard Dastardly]

So Youtube just recommended this to me:

 

 

 

which beyond my obsession for the Tornado, shows what seem to be Tornado IDS (note that some of the aircraft have both guns and no flir pod, unlike the ECRs in the video) carrying some variant of the AGM 88. It's possible that those are even AGM-88E models, since they were just recently introduced to the Italian fleet. The SDB is also supposed to come soon.

 

All this to say, assuming I'm right, a modern Italian bird would be a good candidate for a DCS module. You'd get fancy standoff weapons no other module brings (Storm Shadow, SDB, AARM) for people that like that sort of things, and it's still fairly close to the more classic 80s bird (unlike the Gr4 which looks completely different). Having the TFR available or not could just be a mission editor option or something.

 

The UK ones had Sea Eagle many years ago & the German Navy ones carried AS-34, so you'd not be short of anti-ship no matter which IDS.

 

Modelling a variant that has seen action might be a good idea though. The Luftwaffe have only done recce with theirs, I think?

[QuiGon]

Modelling a variant that has seen action might be a good idea though. The Luftwaffe have only done recce with theirs, I think?

That is true for recent conflicts (Afghanistan and Syria/Irak), but in the Balkan wars German ECR Tornados fired ~300 HARMs in action.

[Elor]

That is true for recent conflicts (Afghanistan and Syria/Irak), but in the Balkan wars German ECR Tornados fired ~300 HARMs in action.

I believe he was talking about the IDS version only and not the ECR variant.

[joey45]

The UK ones had Sea Eagle many years ago & the German Navy ones carried AS-34, so you'd not be short of anti-ship no matter which IDS.

 

Modelling a variant that has seen action might be a good idea though. The Luftwaffe have only done recce with theirs, I think?

 

That would be the GR1B variant which was a special mod for the Sea Eagle.

 

The GR1A/4A was the recon variant.