[NOT REALISTIC FOR US BLK 50] Moving Map?

[Anonymous User]

Anyone know if this is a capability on the F16, if so what block?

[Deano87]

Preeeeeety sure US wise it would only be the jets that have received the Raytheon Center Display Unit upgrade that have moving map ability. And the Block 70 jets with the 3 massive screens mostly likely have it too.

 

But don’t think the Block 50 without mods has any ability to do it. You will get a HSD which is similar to the HSI or SA page on the Hornet, but no map in the background.

 

Edited August 25, 2019 by Deano87

[Kev2go]

Preeeeseety sure US wise it would only be the jets that have received the Raytheon Center Display Unit upgrade that have moving map ability. And the Block 70 jets with the 3 massive screens mostly likely have it too.

 

But don’t think the Block 50 without mods has any ability to do it. You will get a HSD which is similar to the HSI or SA page on the Hornet, but no map in the background.

 

 

That may be the case IRL but i don't see why what limitations that it couldn't be done otherwise, if full colour capability exist. Dont see why Moving map couldn't be a possibility on HSD overlay with 5x5 inch screens. The A10's screens are also 5x5, smaller than the new center pedestal panel.

Edited August 25, 2019 by Kev2go

[Deano87]

That may be the case IRL but i don't see why what limitations that it couldn't be done otherwise, if full colour capability exists. Dont see why Moving map couldn't be a possibility on HSD overlay with 5x5 inch screens. The A10's screens are also 5x5

 

I agree? Lol.

 

But as far as I know they didn’t make it happen in the real jet for whatever reason. Happy to be wrong! Not that I use the map in the Hornet ever anyway lol.

[Kev2go]

I agree? Lol.

 

But as far as I know they didn’t make it happen in the real jet for whatever reason. Happy to be wrong! Not that I use the map in the Hornet ever anyway lol.

 

I dont disagree, i dont want Moving map if its not a realistic feature on USAF plane. IM just saying even if they dont use MM that its not likely due to any technical limitation or becuase the displays are too small or something

 

ANd i think the reason some people dont like using MM on the Hornet is because of how its formatted. The formating blends in with the MM.

 

Compared to the Hornet, Its a different story on the A10C. I used MM on that all the time, because it TAD page formatting contrasts much better against the MM. It stick out more due to certain symbology or alphanumerics being displayed against a black backdrop

 

 

 

Looking at the video you posted with the new F16 Center Pedestal panel it seems they went along the same lines of the A10.

Edited August 25, 2019 by Kev2go

[Deano87]

I agree again! The text directly on top of the map on the Hornet make it very difficult to read, also having as the centre screen only further reduces its usability imho.

[Kev2go]

I agree again! The text directly on top of the map on the Hornet make it very difficult to read, also having as the centre screen only further reduces its usability imho.

 

Considering its the only fully colour capable screen, not other choice in the Legacy Hornets for a proper full color moving map. USN didn't implement full color DDI displays until the Lot 25 Supers. IRRC with regards to the Legacies in USA, only the Marines with F/A18A++ program replaced those Green CRT's with LCD colour displays. The Recent F/A18C+SkateZilla claims those have new cockpit displays but i haven't seen any written defense articles stating so, nor any published cockpit photos of them proving their existence. All sources just say C+ is nothing more than an airframe refurbishment to keep em flying longer without falling apart.

 

From what i read about the Hornets development ultimately they decided Bottom display was best suited for navigation as combat related pages stuff was prioritized for upper displays.

 

That being said i read that old DDI displays should be able to generate a basic monochrome map.

Edited August 25, 2019 by Kev2go

[Cupra]

I have seen a US F-16C Blk30 Model from a Texas ANG squadron that had a moving map on the MFD.. so this option exists. I just dont know if this software is available to the version we will get. But the function itself exists. Maybe just on one plane..

 

EDIT: Just took a closer look. It was a F-16D Block 30E. Serial Nr. 86-049. This aircraft had a coloured moving map on its HSD on the rear seat…

Edited August 25, 2019 by Cupra

[Deano87]

Well that’s cool. So maybe it can do it.

[Weasel]

Considering its the only fully colour capable screen, not other choice in the Legacy Hornets for a proper full color moving map. USN didn't implement full color DDI displays until the Lot 25 Supers. IRRC with regards to the Legacies in USA, only the Marines with F/A18A++ program replaced those Green CRT's with LCD colour displays. The Recent F/A18C+SkateZilla claims those have new cockpit displays but i haven't seen any written defense articles stating so, nor any published cockpit photos of them proving their existence. All sources just say C+ is nothing more than an airframe refurbishment to keep em flying longer without falling apart.

 

From what i read about the Hornets development ultimately they decided Bottom display was best suited for navigation as combat related pages stuff was prioritized for upper displays.

 

That being said i read that old DDI displays should be able to generate a basic monochrome map.

According to AFM magazin (Aug 19 issue) only 19 legacy hornets will be upgraded to F/A-18C+. Initially 30 aircrafts were planned to be upgraded to C+

 

"The F/A-18C+ is equipped with an upgraded APG-73 Radar, Link 16, colour cockpit displays, a moving map display, ALE-47 infrared countermeasures, the Naval Aircrew Common Ejection Seat (NACES) and the JHMCS. The service life of the airframe is also extended from 6,000 to 8,000 flight hours. To date, only three C+ Hornets have been completed and delivered; two having joined VMFA-115 (one of which has been lost in a mishap) and one to VMFA-112 at Fort Worth, the unit that is scheduled to receive most of the C+ aircraft"

[Fri13]

Sad thing, as moving map is one of the fundamental digitalization features for modern aircraft to perform in combat.

 

No need to look a paper map or try to play with numbers, when you can look from nap where you are. Really increases the situational awareness.

 

Sure the GPS, waypoints etc are enough to for navigation in low visibility or at night, but not in combat.

[Cupra]

But it is also a big problem when the map doe not work. You still have to do all the navigation work too. Does not matter if you have a moving map or not.

[Kev2go]

According to AFM magazin (Aug 19 issue) only 19 legacy hornets will be upgraded to F/A-18C+. Initially 30 aircrafts were planned to be upgraded to C+

 

"The F/A-18C+ is equipped with an upgraded APG-73 Radar, Link 16, colour cockpit displays, a moving map display, ALE-47 infrared countermeasures, the Naval Aircrew Common Ejection Seat (NACES) and the JHMCS. The service life of the airframe is also extended from 6,000 to 8,000 flight hours. To date, only three C+ Hornets have been completed and delivered; two having joined VMFA-115 (one of which has been lost in a mishap) and one to VMFA-112 at Fort Worth, the unit that is scheduled to receive most of the C+ aircraft"

 

SOunds like everything a US Navy Lot 20 legacy already has ( be it USN origin or USN hand me down to USMC) :smilewink:

 

BY that i mean i have heard other sources say that Lot 12 introduced all "color" displays.

 

Because in a way its true the DDI's aren't purely monochrome anymore since Lot 12 . Besides green, can display yellow and red. They just don't have a full range of color capability, like the MPCD display or succeeding AMPCD had.

Edited August 25, 2019 by Kev2go

[Kev2go]

I have seen a US F-16C Blk30 Model from a Texas ANG squadron that had a moving map on the MFD.. so this option exists. I just dont know if this software is available to the version we will get. But the function itself exists. Maybe just on one plane..

 

EDIT: Just took a closer look. It was a F-16D Block 30E. Serial Nr. 86-049. This aircraft had a coloured moving map on its HSD on the rear seat…

 

Yup likely tape 4.2 or 4.3 don't have that ( circa 2007)

 

But it would interesting to then know which tape introduced the Moving map, as you have pointed out this capability is present on at least some F16's.

[USA_Recon]

I just hope it's more readable than the Hornet map, especially in VR.

[aileron]

Don't they just stick the equivalent of an Ipad on their leg and have moving map features, Flight planning, Comms, etc, etc? I'd rather have that.

 

Or is that before this aircraft's time.

[Deano87]

I just hope it's more readable than the Hornet map, especially in VR.

 

It will be 100% less readable then the Hornet moving map, as it doesn’t have one.

[mvsgas]

The Central Display Unit ( CDU) was part of the USAF Reserves and ANG F-16C ( block 32 and below) System/Software Capability Upgrade (SCU) 8 starting on 2013.

[Wags]

US F-16C Block 50s, at least in 2007, never included a moving map display.

 

Thanks

[SilentSierra]

In this video, the HSD has moving map. But I don't know the Block.

 

Start at 14:06:

[Kev2go]

In this video, the HSD has moving map. But I don't know the Block.

 

Start at 14:06:

 

Thats a Hellenic Air Force F16C .

 

 

probably block 50 or 52.

 

However similar, there are some minor difference between them and USAF based Vipers. Those for eg still retained analog HSI's. EGI navigation became standard on them much earlier than USAF vipers ( our 2007 version has INS + GPS instead) to mention a few things that come to mind.

Edited August 26, 2019 by Kev2go

[mvsgas]

But I don't know the Block.

 

The look like Block 52+ here is a list.

 

Noticeable differences from DCS F-16C USAF, after CCIP, circa 2007

- Larger NLG tire

- Larger Lights on intake

- Different ECM/RWR package

- F100-PW-229 engine

- Digital Video Recorder (DVR) camera ( In front of the HUD, replacing AVTR system)

- Different air scoops around the aircraft

- Conformal fuel tanks (CFT)

- Enlarge dorsal spine housing different equipment

 

Many more equipment, weapons, and capability differences.

[Cupra]

All teh funny stuff available for F-16 will not be included in DCS: F-16 ;) There will come a new module in 2025 ^^ But interesting that a Link16 will be included…

[Kev2go]

All teh funny stuff available for F-16 will not be included in DCS: F-16 ;) There will come a new module in 2025 ^^ But interesting that a Link16 will be included…

 

why is that interesting?

 

Link 16 basically became a common standardized thing in fighters in the 21st century. I think only ANG block 30's were fitted with SADL instead.

[Shimmergloom667]

In this video, the HSD has moving map. But I don't know the Block.

 

Start at 14:06:

 

That's Greek F-16s. While they use blocks 30, 50 and 52, they have been extensively modified and are not what we get ingame. As has been stated more than once.