Any chance for a Yak-38 in the future after MiG-29?

[IcedVenom]

I know it's *a bit* newer than the MiG-29 but it's a really cool naval VTOL aircraft and it would be very cool to be able to learn and fly it in opposition to the Harrier. I don't want any argument or discussion between the two aircraft. Both are cool. I am merely asking if there's any chance or news regarding the Yak-38. Also, by any chance does anyone know anything about a Draken coming to the game? Thanks!

[upyr1]

  Cuban Ace is working on a Yak-38. 

https://www.facebook.com/138020453352341/posts/1140230609797982/

There will be a Kiev class carrier 

[Ikaros]

Cuban Ace isn't a 3rd party.

[upyr1]

19 minutes ago, Ikaros said:

Cuban Ace isn't a 3rd party.

Not yet unless something has changed Cuban Ace is planning to become an official dcs developer. 

https://www.facebook.com/138020453352341/posts/948865815601130/

[Northstar98]

+1 I'd go for a Yak-38/Yak-38M. The main problem though would be trying to sell it, luckily enough there's nothing that complicated about it. The FDM would be the most tricky thing to do.

It doesn't have a RADAR, and the only guided weapons it has is the R-60M and Kh-23/25 (the latter requiring the use of a guidance pod). In general performance is quite poor too. Think of it like a faster L-39ZA that can hover, with a superior armament and gunsight.

Mind you, even an AI aircraft would be fantastic.

But it only makes sense when paired with a Pr. 1143 "Krechet" [Kiev class] heavy aviation cruiser, as well as era appropriate Soviet naval assets, such as an 80s Sovremenny (Pr. 956), Udaloy I (Pr. 1155), Kashin (Pr. 61), Krivak I (Pr. 1135), Kirov (Pr. 1144), Nanuchka I (Pr. 1234), Grisha III (Pr. 1124) and Boris Chilikin (Pr. 1559V).

Edited June 28, 2022 by Northstar98
formatting, grammar

[Fri13]

Again would be a great addition to the DCS by speciality and uniqueness.

We just need more that era aircraft.

[Northstar98]

5 hours ago, Fri13 said:

Again would be a great addition to the DCS by speciality and uniqueness.

We just need more that era aircraft.

 

It is probably the latest era where we can have feasible peer-to-peer scenarios from a historical and development feasibility standpoint.

[kseremak]

13 hours ago, IcedVenom said:

I know it's *a bit* newer than the MiG-29 but it's a really cool naval VTOL aircraft and it would be very cool to be able to learn and fly it in opposition to the Harrier. I don't want any argument or discussion between the two aircraft. Both are cool. I am merely asking if there's any chance or news regarding the Yak-38. Also, by any chance does anyone know anything about a Draken coming to the game? Thanks!

 

Yak-38 is *a bit* older than MiG-29. Yak-38 entered service in Soviet Navy in mid '70s and it has been phased out together with fall of the USSR around 1990.

It was a counterpart of British cold war Sea Harrier GR.1 (Ground/Reconnisance) with quite comparable capabilities.

 

I agree it would be nice as full fidelity aircraft, it would be challenging to fly, especially during VTOL operations, it would require manual aiming most of it's weapon, interesting USSR Kiev Class aircraft cruiser operations, it was quite simple so it wouldn't take long to model it.

 

 

 

 

Edited July 5, 2021 by kseremak

[upyr1]

6 hours ago, Northstar98 said:

+1 I'd go for a Yak-38/Yak-38M and only the M is newer than the MiG-29 (and the main difference is engine power). The main problem would be trying to sell it, luckily enough there's nothing that complicated about it. The FDM would be the most tricky thing to do.

 

It doesn't have a RADAR, and the only guided weapons it has is the R-60M and Kh-23/25 (the latter requiring the use of a guidance pod). In general performance is quite poor too. Think of it like a faster L-39ZA that can hover, with a superior armament and gunsight. 

 

Mind you, even an AI aircraft would be fantastic.

 

But it only makes sense when paired with a Pr. 1143 "Krechet" [Kiev class] heavy aviation cruiser, as well as era appropriate Soviet naval assets, such as an 80s Sovremenny (Pr. 956), Udaloy I (Pr. 1155), Kashin (Pr. 61), Krivak I (Pr. 1135), Kirov (Pr. 1144), Nanuchka I (Pr. 1234), Grisha III (Pr. 1124) and Boris Chilikin (Pr. 1559V).

 

Hopefully Cuban Ace is going to come through. he plans to add the Kiev and Yak-38,

[rkk01]

Wasn’t the Yak-38 utterly useless…?

 

or was that just Cold War propaganda/ bias???

[drPhibes]

3 minutes ago, upyr1 said:

Hopefully Cuban Ace is going to come through. he plans to add the Kiev and Yak-38,

Don't hold your breath. His track record is not particularly good (to put it mildly). He has announced, and then cancelled, too many projects to count.

 

[kseremak]

On 7/5/2021 at 4:25 PM, rkk01 said:

Wasn’t the Yak-38 utterly useless…?

 

or was that just Cold War propaganda/ bias???

 

It was similar to Sea Harrier GR.1 with Sea Harrier being arguably a bit more successful having only one engine. VTOL requirement naturally cost reduced range and usefull payload, both of them were quite simple attack aircrafts. But having  attack aircrafts, even with limited range and payload, was important advantage for the fleet. 

Yak-38 utilised unique automatic ejection system which saved the lifes of many pilots during VTOL operations accidents.

 

Full-fledged aircraft carrier counterparts like A-4 Skyhawk or A-7E Corsair were obviously a bit less compromised having bigger range and payload, not being forced to use additional engines or movable nozzles and some other design compromises, but they required an aircraft carrier.

 

Both Sea Harrier and Yak-38 had their charm being the only two operational VTOL aircrafts of the XX centaury and VTOL operations add additional attractiveness.

Edited July 8, 2021 by kseremak

[upyr1]

7 minutes ago, drPhibes said:

Don't hold your breath. His track record is not particularly good (to put it mildly). He has announced, and then cancelled, too many projects to count.

 

This and the Su-57 are the only projects I know about

[drPhibes]

A few of them:

 

SU-22(or 17?): cancelled

YF-23: cancelled

Mitsubishi F-2: cancelled

F-16: probably never really a project, just a few stolen renders with the author's signature/watermark removed

F-84: cancelled

KC-130T: cancelled

 

TL;DR: don't get your hopes up.

[rkk01]

Not sure the comparison with the Sea Harrier is valid

[kseremak]

2 minutes ago, drPhibes said:

A few of them:

 

SU-22(or 17?): cancelled

YF-23: cancelled

Mitsubishi F-2: cancelled

F-16: probably never really a project, just a few stolen renders with the author's signature/watermark removed

F-84: cancelled

KC-130T: cancelled

 

TL;DR: don't get your hopes up.

Agree, in my experience Cuban Ace is not to be treated seriously, unfortunately. I would like normal DCS module.

[MBot]

I always had a big sweet spot for the Yak-38. Of course it would be crappy and limited and uncompetitive But that would be part of its appeal and why it would be an interesting module.

 

48 minutes ago, rkk01 said:

Wasn’t the Yak-38 utterly useless…?

 

or was that just Cold War propaganda/ bias???

 

I think this aircraft must be judged by its most important trait, which is that it could provide the Soviet Navy air power at sea where no other fighter could go. And among the blind, the one-eyed is king. A Yak-38 present is better than a no-show MiG-29.

 

The primary role of Yak-38 was probably to counter NATO maritime patrol aircraft. You have to keep in mind that previously any Soviet surface action group at sea could be shadowed by NATO P-3 Orion or Nimrods with impunity. They could orbit just outside of the SAM engagement range of the warships all day long, observe and provide continuous up to date targeting information for NATO air, sea and sub-surface strikes. The Kiev-class cruisers with the Yak-38 were able to restrict NATO maritime reconnaissance in certain areas and therefore increased survivability of Soviet ships and submarines at sea far beyond pure air defence.

 

Interestingly, this is exactly the same role that the Royal Navy had assigned to its Sea Harriers prior to the Falklands War.

Edited July 5, 2021 by MBot

[rkk01]

Fair point regarding intended role for the Yak.

[Northstar98]

3 hours ago, rkk01 said:

Wasn’t the Yak-38 utterly useless…?

 

Yes, though I don't really care.

 

Even an AI aircraft would be great. The other thing with Soviet doctrine is that the ship is the primary weapons system, not the aircraft it carries (unlike western carriers), the Kiev class is able to do area and point air defence, is fairly capable in ASuW and does have a limited amount of ASW capability as is.

 

It's best counterpart in terms of capability is probably the Sea Harrier FRS.1, though that has a multi-mode doppler RADAR (nothing super duper fancy, and we're still talking mid 70s technology) and I think it's superior in a few other ways too. 

Edited July 5, 2021 by Northstar98

[cubanace]

2 hours ago, drPhibes said:

A few of them:

 

SU-22(or 17?): cancelled

YF-23: cancelled

Mitsubishi F-2: cancelled

F-16: probably never really a project, just a few stolen renders with the author's signature/watermark removed

F-84: cancelled

KC-130T: cancelled

 

TL;DR: don't get your hopes up.

Hello it has been a while i hope everyone is doing good,

 

Anyway like i have said before yes 4 years ago i was stupid and inexperienced and made a terrible mistake that i have regret all this time but i cant turn back time, Instead i stopped all those projects and Focus only in the SU-57 and YAK-38M, 4 years ago i was blind and i did not really know how hard it was to make aircraft for dcs world, its lot more than just 3d models or animations, the hard part is the development costs and licensing ect.

 

Anyway i am still here and learning and my only goal is one day becoming or joining another 3rd party in order to make DCS a better experience and after doing this for more than 4 years i have come to learn a lot and i love it, i don't regret any second or time or effort i put into learning coding,modeling,animation and the dcs overal core.

 

Again my apologies for my past but that is now behind.

 

best regards: cubanace

Edited July 5, 2021 by cubanace

[cubanace]

3d Modeling progress Externally,

I am also modeling the internals for

Better damage modeling.

[Seaeagle]

10 hours ago, Northstar98 said:

+1 I'd go for a Yak-38/Yak-38M and only the M is newer than the MiG-29 (and the main difference is engine power). The main problem would be trying to sell it, luckily enough there's nothing that complicated about it. The FDM would be the most tricky thing to do.

 

It doesn't have a RADAR, and the only guided weapons it has is the R-60M and Kh-23/25 (the latter requiring the use of a guidance pod). In general performance is quite poor too. Think of it like a faster L-39ZA that can hover, with a superior armament and gunsight. 

Yes - not on par with a contemporary Harrier, let alone the "Night Attack" version we have in DCS, but..

Quote

Mind you, even an AI aircraft would be fantastic.

...yes it would still be a pretty cool addition to DCS for 70'ies and 80'ies scenarios.

Quote

But it only makes sense when paired with a Pr. 1143 "Krechet" [Kiev class] heavy aviation cruiser, as well as era appropriate Soviet naval assets, such as an 80s Sovremenny (Pr. 956), Udaloy I (Pr. 1155), Kashin (Pr. 61), Krivak I (Pr. 1135), Kirov (Pr. 1144), Nanuchka I (Pr. 1234), Grisha III (Pr. 1124) and Boris Chilikin (Pr. 1559V).

Indeed. Also other 2nd generation types such as the Kara(Pr. 1134b) and Kresta(Pr. 1134A) classes would be era(70/80'ies) appropriate for a Yak-38/Kiev class.

 

Mind you, the Sovremenny, Udaloy and Kirov classes are a generation newer(third generation) than the rest of the types you mentioned and are(along with Boris Chilikin class) also sorely missing for more recent 90'ies scenarios involving the Admiral Kuznetsov....well we do have a Kirov class(Pyotr Velikiy), but its from 1998 and quite different from the initial layout, so barely applicable even for a 90'ies scenario.

 

 

Edited July 5, 2021 by Seaeagle

[Seaeagle]

1 hour ago, cubanace said:

3d Modeling progress Externally,

I am also modeling the internals for

Better damage modeling.

Nice work!

[IcedVenom]

1 hour ago, cubanace said:

3d Modeling progress Externally,

I am also modeling the internals for

Better damage modeling.

Wow! Maybe one day I really will be able to have an official Yak-38 module to learn and show off with. Please don't give up bringing your project up to DCS standard

[Northstar98]

30 minutes ago, Seaeagle said:

Yes - not on par with a contemporary Harrier, let alone the "Night Attack" version we have in DCS.

 

Yeah, it's most comparable to a first generation Harrier, best I put it is the FRS.1, though that aircraft is superior, but they should be a match for each other.

 

30 minutes ago, Seaeagle said:

Also other 2nd generation types such as the Kara(Pr. 1134b) and Kresta(Pr. 1134A) classes would be era(70/80'ies) appropriate for a Yak-38/Kiev class.

 

Completely forgot about those.

 

30 minutes ago, Seaeagle said:

Mind you, the Sovremenny, Udaloy and Kirov classes are a generation newer(third generation) than the rest of the types you mentioned and are(along with Boris Chilikin class) also sorely missing for more recent 90'ies scenarios involving the Admiral Kuznetsov...

 

Yeah, I think they are the most suitable Soviet ships for DCS - in preferably their 80s configurations (though the Udaloy did only get SA-N-9 later in its life - before it was FFBNW AFAIK).

 

And when talking about the Kirov, I'm talking specifically about the Kirov, with the SS-N-14s, 2 AK-100 (as in the Krivak II) and AK630s.