HTS - triangulated coordinates

[Rongor]

Since we have the possibility to receive the approximate coordinates of an emitting site in the DED when working with the HARM Targeting Pod and display them in the DED, I wonder what to do with these.

It would help to transfer these coordinates into a markpoint for example, yet I don't see how this would be possible right now.

So my question for those who know:

Might this be a real life feature which is waiting to be implemented in DCS some day?

If not, how to put these coordinates to use in any way elsewhere?

Using them as a Markpoint would be the obvious benefit...

[Tholozor]

Have the AG radar point at the HTS-generated SPI and make an FCR Markpoint.

[Deano87]

As soon as you lock something with the HTS it points the TGP to the centre of that uncertainty zone, obviously depending on the quality of the HTS track that may not be where the emitter actually is. But regardless its then very simple to create a mark point from the TGP.

Obviously if that did actually end up looking pretty much at the emitter then you can refine the position by slewing the TGP. Create a TGP markpoint. Swap your current steerpoint on the DED to that markpoint and then launch whatever weapon you want at that stp, JDAM, Maverick, JSOW, Dumb bombs etc.

This is part of my standard HARM + JDAM flow, find the site, markpoint with TGP from HTS, Harm the radar, then JDAM the rest of the site.

If you don't have a TGP... well then you're flying with one arm tied behind your back in this scenario but I guess AG radar could work as mentioned above.

Edited January 6, 2022 by Deano87

[Rongor]

Yeah well, I am with you with the availability of these workarounds. Yet even more the question comes up then: what is the coords readout in the DED good for?

[FoxOne007]

8 hours ago, Rongor said:

Yeah well, I am with you with the availability of these workarounds. Yet even more the question comes up then: what is the coords readout in the DED good for?

They’re not really workarounds. That’s just how it has to be done in the jet. And I assume the coords are there to be readout over the radio to say a wingman, etc.

[Rongor]

12 minutes ago, FoxOne007 said:

They’re not really workarounds. That’s just how it has to be done in the jet. And I assume the coords are there to be readout over the radio to say a wingman, etc.

Oh, they totally are, as creating a Markpoint would be the obvious and simply convenient solution.

[Chain_1]

Not much sense in making a markpoint where there might not even be anything.  Better to take the TGP and refine the approximate position to where the emitter actually is. 

[Rongor]

13 hours ago, Chain_1 said:

Not much sense in making a markpoint where there might not even be anything.  Better to take the TGP and refine the approximate position to where the emitter actually is. 

Assume you don't have a TGP. Or you are out of HARMs and wanna come back later, recalling these coordinates to navigate there. Please be creative. 

Btw. if 'there might not be anything', the TGP is not helping much anyways.

Guys, please. Just stick to the thread. I know the TGP is convenient. But I was asking for the use of the DED coordinates.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Rongor

[twistking]

You can always do the markpoint from the AG radar. Like others have said, i think the coordinates on the DED might be sueful for communicating with other units, that are not on the data-link. Or as backup if data-link is not avaialble and you want to give location to wingman etc.

[Deano87]

59 minutes ago, Rongor said:

Guys, please. Just stick to the thread. I know the TGP is convenient. But I was asking for the use of the DED coordinates.

You literally said in your first post

“It would help to transfer these coordinates into a markpoint for example, yet I don't see how this would be possible right now.”

and we’ve explained how you can do that, either via the FCR or TGP. Remember the coordinates in the DED are simply the centre of the HTS’s best approximation of where the emitter is. It’s the same location it hands off to the TGP. So using a TGP to refine those coordinates is highly recommended if you want any kind of precision.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Deano87

[Rongor]

2 minutes ago, Deano87 said:

You literally said in your first post

“It would help to transfer these coordinates into a markpoint for example, yet I don't see how this would be possible right now.”

and we’ve explained how you can do that, either via the FCR or TGP. Remember the coordinates in the DED are simply the centre of the HTS’s best approximation of where the emitter is. It’s the same location it hands off to the TGP. So using a TGP to refine those coordinates is highly recommended if you want any kind of precision.

 

Yes and this doesn't address what I literally said at all. Thanks anyway

[Deano87]

1 minute ago, Rongor said:

Yes and this doesn't address what I literally said at all. Thanks anyway

What do you mean?

[Rongor]

13 minutes ago, Deano87 said:

What do you mean?

I mean that some readers assume I am looking for precision or how to set a Markpoint by radar or by TGP. Which I am not.

The HTS is obviously capable to show data on the DED. So the next logical step would be to expect this data also being available for creating Markpoints, just like the DED is showing an interface to the other sensors providing coordinates, FCR, HUD, TGP... So I asked if this is possible in the F-16C or even already available in the DCS F-16C. My interest clearly shows intentions to learn how it is done, if already implemented.

Instead dudes tell me I can do it by slaved TGP and emphasize how very necessary the use of the TGP is to get a pinpoint location. How is this addressing my question? It doesn't.

I often see this on the boards. People fail to understand queries because they have tunnel vision on the workflow they use. Any question from outside the box gets bend in a way to enable a reply which is based on their use of the module. They can't see beyond how it is working for them. So any question not matching their way of doing things is basically labeled as a faulty approach, the OP then gets lectured how he should approach the matter correctly.

This is not helpful at all. Not only does this not answer a specific question, it even destructively prevents us all - the ones asking and the ones answering - to learn new things, to benefit from viewing stuff from different angles and to get enlightening responses from people who actually have an answer.

 

I don't care for the precision of the coordinates. I know how to create Markpoints by radar and the TGP. Thanks! These answers are off-topic. I wasn't looking how to get any Markpoint by Radar or TGP. Even my line you quoted explicitly repeats what I was asking for: a transfer of coordinates not only into a readout page of the DED but into the Markpoint creation page of the DED. Obviously, this transfer isn't possible or at least nobody participating in this thread so far knows that it is possible.

The next question would be if it is possible in the real world F-16. We also didn't receive hints on that.

So, assuming there is no such capability, the question remained: What is the DED coord display good for? Answers arriving here suggested that this serves to send these coordinates to wingmen and others by radio. I find this idea not very well thought through, because for all your emphasizing on using the radar and the TGP for creating the Markpoint, why would you then still readout the coordinates from the DED? You could simply read them off your radar and TGP display to tell your wingmen.

 

It's still unclear, what the DED display showing the HTS coordinates is intended to be used for. We can assume those engineers implementing this data to the DED by TMS right had something in mind. I would like to know what this might have been. Shrugging this question off by suggesting "simply use the TGP" doesn't really promote the investigation, don't you agree?