F-14 Tomcat Patch March 17th 2022 Feedback Thread

[IronMike]

Dear all, as always please post your feedback to the recent thread below. A more detailed write up of the new features you can find here:
 

Here is the full changelog, too:

DCS: F-14 Tomcat by Heatblur Simulations - March 17th 2022

• NEW: Added ability to switch between pilot and RIO seat in Multiplayer.
• NEW: Complete overhaul of the Autopilot and subsystems:
  • Autopilot remodeled according to real life systems and limitations.
  • Added functional Ground Track submode (press AP ref button to engage).
  • Improved autothrottle reliability and responsiveness.
  • Removed artificial engagement restrictions.
  • ATT Hold will return to within 60°bank and 30°pitch if exceeding limits.
  • ALT Hold will disengage if exceeding 10lbs force on pitch axis.
  • Future-proof modeling for greater FM flexibility.
• Ignore MLC filter in PD-STT (MLC filter is only applicable to PD scanning modes).
• Tweaked TWS-A illumination weighting for more rapid movement towards launched targets. 
• Fixed TID lower readout target items being incorrectly shown while navgrid is displayed.
• Fixed IMU, AHRS, and INS drifting under active pause.
• Removed radar altimeter error over water. 
• Fixed Instant Action Missions AI Wingman not firing on targets (Thank you Captain Dalan!)
• Fixed Instant Action Missions Tacan for Case1 missions.
• Fixed Instant Action Missions cold start NTTR tanker not responding.
• Updated Normandy Case1 missions to use USS Forrestal.
• Updated Chinese Localization. 
• Updated VF-33 Starfighters AB201 livery by Yae Sakura
• Added LoD models for various Forrestal vehicles, improving performance:
  • MD3 Mule (Early)
  • NS60
  • Big Forklift

Thank you all for your kind feedback and continued support!

[Callsign JoNay]

Iceman seems more busted than usual.

-Absolute North and South seem fine, but his understanding of East and West is backwards.

-Absolute angels 10 and 15 seem bugged and non responsive.

-Can't swem to get any speed requests to work.

 

[unlikely_spider]

2 minutes ago, Callsign JoNay said:

Absolute North and South seem fine, but his understanding of East and West is backwards.

Meh, I've never really considered basic understanding of cardinal directions to be very crucial skill set for a pilot.

[Silvester.E]

Not sure why but seem to miss “jester” in his camera menu; empty seat.

Jester camera option is checked within settings. 

[Gun Jam]

Okay question on autopilot.

I get plane trimmed close nice and level but when I toggle up on attitude hold, alt hold, the switch returns to center immediately. I can toggle up on the autopilot sw and it stays.

I didnt see mention of this. This behavior is new.

Any suggestions?

Thanks

[IronMike]

1 hour ago, Gun Jam said:

Okay question on autopilot.

I get plane trimmed close nice and level but when I toggle up on attitude hold, alt hold, the switch returns to center immediately. I can toggle up on the autopilot sw and it stays.

I didnt see mention of this. This behavior is new.

Any suggestions?

Thanks

I am not sure I understand what you are saying. Which switch returns to center immediately? And under what conditions exactly?

EDIT: I just tested it, and it works as it should. AP switch to engaged. Fairly level. Alt hold switch engage. AP ref light comes on. AP ref button pressed ->alt hold is active.

Edited March 18, 2022 by IronMike

[IronMike]

SMALL PSA everyone:

Unfortunately the MP seat switching did not get included properly during the upload, which means it will not be available until the next hotfix/patch. Our apologies for that.

[Callsign JoNay]

Noticed this was the default position of my stabs when I cold hot started on the deck today.

Swiping the controls wouldn't reset it. Neither did cycling the three SAS switches. 

Cycling AP - Engage switch on/off before the cat shot reset the trim. Is this working as intended?

 

Edit: I meant to say hot started above.

Edited March 18, 2022 by Callsign JoNay

[Gun Jam]

In the way way past I could toggle up on sw 5 and 6 then toggle up on 7 and hit NWS to set ref and the plane would hold that heading and alt (this even worked rarely before today's patch)

Today I toggle up on 5 or 6 and they return to center the instant i click off of them

I can toggle up on 7 and it will stay if I then attempt to toggle up on 5 or 6 they again return to center.

Ive tested this once on instant action f14b cat vs eagle after the fight trimmed well level.

Since you seem surprised by my comment I suspect the issue is my MSFFB2 joystick as it is likley the only thing unique to my system that would likley not have been tested.

Thanks for looking into this.

-Gun

[Shadok]

5 hours ago, Gun Jam said:

Okay question on autopilot.

I get plane trimmed close nice and level but when I toggle up on attitude hold, alt hold, the switch returns to center immediately. I can toggle up on the autopilot sw and it stays.

I didnt see mention of this. This behavior is new.

Any suggestions?

Thanks

Same problem with my MSFFB2 joystick.

Also, with the plane well trimmed, engaging auto-throttle and auto carrier landing mode make the plane slowly trim left. And auto-throttle alway re-engage (even with gears up) if I shift autopilot mode. And autolanding mode is still capricious, CMD control rarely engage correctly.

Thanks

Edited March 18, 2022 by Shadok

[IronMike]

ACLS is not fixed yet, recommend not to use it.

There seems to be issues with FFB regarding the AP, we'll look into it.

[_DK_]

Could someone cross check for me; I believe the new IR rendering update from this patch may have inverted BHOT and WHOT for the LANTIRN pod.

BHOT - Area track as an Apache takes off from a FARP


WHOT - Point track on a column of tanks

[draconus]

6 hours ago, Callsign JoNay said:

Swiping the controls wouldn't reset it. Neither did cycling the three SAS switches. 

Cycling AP - Engage switch on/off before the cat shot reset the trim. Is this working as intended?

I too had experience of taking off hot, from carrier and land, A and B, AB or MIL, and every time it was rolling to one side uncommanded - only AP helped. There was no store or fuel unbalance, fully retracted gear and flaps, external view showed no flight control surfaces uneven setting. Up to using AP, the lateral trim could not be used to resolve the issue. Airstart was fine though.

...but then after restarting DCS I could not reproduce the problem again.

Edited March 18, 2022 by draconus

[Luka CMF]

After todays update F-14B became randomly unflyable regarding trim. 

I have created an empty Syria mission from Dier ez-Zor airbase cold start from parking and it always starts hot unless throttles are in cutoff

All this was happening over several flights and I had to reset mission few times

In many cases it starts with broken trim in either roll or pitch and it doesn't let to be trimmed to neutral and sometimes it is blocked in one direction.

Autopilot is also broken - when disengaged when supersonic it starts rolling and impossible to trim, need to reset all 3 SAS switches to stabilize 

Plane sometimes becomes unstable and starts rolling midflight

I have experienced torsional flutter which is VERY visible on F2 view

 

Edited March 18, 2022 by Luka CMF

[IronMike]

5 hours ago, Luka CMF said:

After todays update F-14B became randomly unflyable regarding trim. 

I have created an empty Syria mission from Dier ez-Zor airbase cold start from parking and it always starts hot unless throttles are in cutoff

All this was happening over several flights and I had to reset mission few times

In many cases it starts with broken trim in either roll or pitch and it doesn't let to be trimmed to neutral and sometimes it is blocked in one direction.

Autopilot is also broken - when disengaged when supersonic it starts rolling and impossible to trim, need to reset all 3 SAS switches to stabilize 

Plane sometimes becomes unstable and starts rolling midflight

I have experienced torsional flutter which is VERY visible on F2 view

 

 

Can you show a video of the torsional flutter?

AP in supersonic mode should not be engaged, so a strong phugoid will set in, the update rate cannot keep up there anymore, 450kts IAS max.

I could not reproduce the "starts rolling and impossible to trim" part when disengaging in supersonic flight. Phugoid sets it, I disengage, trim is back to normal, as is full ac control.

If this happened in a mission where you took off from the ground, then we already likely fixed the issue, there was a bug where AP would initiate on ground starts (as we do else in air starts to stabilize the aircraft on spawn - which is a needed workaround so you do not enter an immediate dive on spawning). This part is fixed.

[draconus]

5 minutes ago, IronMike said:

This part is fixed.

You mean internally, waiting for a hot fix DCS update?

[IronMike]

23 minutes ago, draconus said:

You mean internally, waiting for a hot fix DCS update?

Correct.

[draconus]

8 hours ago, Luka CMF said:

I have created an empty Syria mission from Dier ez-Zor airbase cold start from parking and it always starts hot unless throttles are in cutoff

What start option have you really choosen?

[DoorMouse]

Please do not shoot the messenger but I've encountered a number of issues which persist or are new in even the first half hour of flying today in this patch:

• Flipping the autopilot engage switch with no particular mode - Im not sure if this is intended behavior but if you flip the switch it can induce and hold extreme trim (50% aileron/roll) when you disengage it. This seems incredibly dangerous and I doubt the real behavior. Resetting trim once you disengage autopilot seems the most basic of functions... but I could be wrong.
• Autopilot Engage - Also does not damp oscillations as much as it used to - the previous autopilot would steady the aircraft and actually hold the vector. Now it oscillates and if you disengage it at any point unless you are dead level it will cause said trim issue.  Again, not sure if this is Intended but I doubt it.
• TWSA  Weighting - Is, I hate to say it.... almost worse.  It does now move the radar cone FASTER to the target but it seems even more confused about what the weighting is.  For what its worth - I have yet to have a TMA be inadvertently slewed outside of the radar cone by TWSA. 
• General TWS performance - Targets are still dropping when they are 30 miles away, non maneuvering, and hot (if only to illustrate that otherwise normal TWS conditions are still causing tracks to randomly drop) Especially if they are higher than you it anecdotally seems. 
• Hold Track performance is still broken - Aircraft which are DIRECTLY UNDER the hold track icon will not have a missile go pitbull.
• Missiles launched in TWS do not initiate a TWS Track sometimes - This persists and is random. have yet to track down how to repeat it but have many video examples

Ill work on continuing to compile videos and isolate causes of issues

Edited March 19, 2022 by DoorMouse

[IronMike]

5 minutes ago, DoorMouse said:

• Flipping the autopilot engage switch with no particular mode - Im not sure if this is intended behavior but if you flip the switch it can induce and hold extreme trim (50% aileron/roll) when you disengage it. This seems incredibly dangerous and I doubt the real behavior. Resetting trim once you disengage autopilot seems the most basic of functions... but I could be wrong.
• Autopilot Engage - Also does not damp oscillations as much as it used to - the previous autopilot would steady the aircraft and actually hold the vector. Now it oscillates and if you disengage it at any point unless you are dead level it will cause said trim issue.  Again, not sure if this is Intended but I doubt it.

Can you show me a video of these please? I cannot confirm any of that on my side, normal OB released build. Also second point: which mode? In ALT HLD certain oscillations are expected. in HDG HLD there is currently a drift issue. The AP has a limited update rate, so in ATT HLD you will have a tiny drop, but no oscillations.

Edited March 19, 2022 by IronMike

[DoorMouse]

7 minutes ago, IronMike said:

Can you show me a video of these please? I cannot confirm any of that on my side, normal OB released build. Also second point: which mode? In ALT HLD certain oscillations are expected. in HDG HLD there is currently a drift issue. The AP has a limited update rate, so in ATT HLD you will have a tiny drop, but no oscillations.

 

I have videos and seem to be able to reproduce it. Playing right now if you wanted to hop in Rio

If you just turn on Autopilot to ENGAGE, roll aileron, and then disengage at any point before the nose is 100% stable - your trim and controls are locked at whatever the aircraft was doing when you disengaged. 

[IronMike]

4 minutes ago, DoorMouse said:

If you just turn on Autopilot to ENGAGE, roll aileron, and then disengage at any point before the nose is 100% stable - your trim and controls are locked at whatever the aircraft was doing when you disengaged. 

So you are disengaging it while rolling? While control stick steering is engaged you mean? First of all why? Secondly, that sounds like a bug indeed, if that is the case.

[DoorMouse]

7 minutes ago, IronMike said:

So you are disengaging it while rolling? While control stick steering is engaged you mean? First of all why? Secondly, that sounds like a bug indeed, if that is the case.

I dunno man. you arent my real dad.

But yes. If you disengage it WHILE rolling or really JUST AFTER while the autopilot is trying to damp out your movement, then its worse. 

[IronMike]

13 minutes ago, DoorMouse said:

I dunno man. you arent my real dad.

But yes. If you disengage it WHILE rolling or really JUST AFTER while the autopilot is trying to damp out your movement, then its worse. 

And just to be clear: your trim is locked? Or your trim is off center? The latter is expected if you release AP in any steep state of the aircraft, you will have to trim back to neutral, however, only in pitch, not in roll. If locked, or say that weird bank/roll or pitch was taken as the new neutral trim position (so out of whack), then it is a clear bug.

Also, I somehow get that dad thing a lot...

Edited March 19, 2022 by IronMike

[DoorMouse]

1 hour ago, IronMike said:

And just to be clear: your trim is locked? Or your trim is off center? The latter is expected if you release AP in any steep state of the aircraft, you will have to trim back to neutral, however, only in pitch, not in roll. If locked, or say that weird bank/roll or pitch was taken as the new neutral trim position (so out of whack), then it is a clear bug.

Also, I somehow get that dad thing a lot...

 

Its really just noticeable in roll. Ill make some videos. Edit -On re-consideration I know what you are talking about with pitch.... its 100% not that. 

Im telling you- Spend 1 hour in the RIO seat while im flying. you're going to see some weird stuff


Double Edit - Also Autopilot on at mach 1.2+ causes bone shattering oscillations in roll. If you disengage it, it will be stuck in FULL roll but you cannot ever get stable again until you slow down, turn on autopilot, and then level out. 

 

Edited March 19, 2022 by DoorMouse