docehrenhoefer Posted January 9, 2009 Share Posted January 9, 2009 Hello! I just entered a hovering state that is rather scary and annoying (though I didn´t crash jet...) I initiated autohover, and just a few seconds later the helo started to turn around very fast and was becoming even faster though auto heading and auto-turn to target was activated. I was able to stop that process by applying a lot of counter rudder, but imagine hiding behind a ridge with some leopard waiting for their vikhrs, but the helo rotating furiously around its axis??? :megalol: It would be very nice if someone could explain me what I was doing wrong.... :huh: Thanx a lot, docehrenhoefer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d0ppler Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 get your chopper into hover manually by using the trimmer. Then initiate auto hover. This requires some skill, and the only way to get it is by practicing A-10C, AV-8B, Ka-50, F-14B, F-16C, F-5E, F/A-18C, L-39, Mi-8, MiG-21, MiG-29, SA34, Spitfire, Su-27, Su-33, UH-1H Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kula66 Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 When it has happened to me it is because the rudder has gone to the extreme of one side or the other, I think because of trimming/bug. Did you have <RCtrl><Enter> on? If so, you may be able to spot this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docehrenhoefer Posted January 10, 2009 Author Share Posted January 10, 2009 spasibo, guys... I´ll try that, Kula66, maybe I kicked rudder while trimming after initiating autohover... doce-hoefer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aphelion79 Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 Speaking of which, is there a way to DISABLE the rudder being trimmed when you hit the trim button? Its REALLY annoying! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slug88 Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 Speaking of which, is there a way to DISABLE the rudder being trimmed when you hit the trim button? Its REALLY annoying! Tell that to the Kamov engineers. AFAIK there's no way to disable it. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aphelion79 Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 engineers didnt have LUA files :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobcat Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 I think I experienced what you are talking about in a server last night i.e. a severe uncommanded rotation about the yaw axis while in a hover. After a while I decided (probably incorrect) that is was caused by the helo trying to get its nose around to a pre-designated heading or target. I cured it by switching the DH/DT swithch to neutral and then hitting the trim button. The HUD heading caret then aligned itself with my heading direction. That stopped any further rotations. BC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemises Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 just use ctrl-enter to see where your rudders are trimmed, and cancel out the trim manually when going into a hover. Easy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docehrenhoefer Posted January 10, 2009 Author Share Posted January 10, 2009 Speaking of which, is there a way to DISABLE the rudder being trimmed when you hit the trim button? Its REALLY annoying! That wouldn´t make sense, since helos always have a tendency to rotate, and the KA-50 has this tendency too though it has 2 rotors...this is because one of the rotors is slightly higher than the other one. And then there is that wind effect... So it makes sense to trim rudder, and I wouldn´t want not to have this feature. @bobcat: that was exactly what happened. I slowly stopped the fst movement by counter trims. @nemises: I´ll try this, thanks. docehrenhoefer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aphelion79 Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 Well I would like to disable it... I have yet to purposly trim my rudder while playing BS, the autopilot does its job quite well with heading hold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemises Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 It is not de-coupled in the real KA50, so it will not be decoupled in the Sim I expect, so unfotunately you will need o adjust your way of flying to allow for it, rather than hoping the airframe control system will be changed to suit yours ;) I must confes I don't (often) have this problem, because I fly with the Push-and-hold trim method, and so, I know to ALLWAYS recenter my rudder pedals before releasing the trim...in this way I have "no"* issues. *of course not true!..I stil get out of whack all the time, so need to use ctrl-enter to re-trim properly... ctrl-enter is a good substitute for the physical feedback we would get in the real thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aphelion79 Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 Well I've just gotten used to yawing to a new heading, slapping the stick back to neutral hitting trim and reyawing it back to the heading I want after the heading bug readjusts... its annoying but it works! lol And why is everyone getting defensive? I've already spent 200 bucks on this game, to have a better experience, however I have no room for rudder pedals, otherwise I would buy some of those, instead I would just like to know if its possible to de-couple the trim to the rudders without everyone getting all defensive! I *know* that's how it is in real life! However, in real life they dont twist their cyclic to use rudder! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphaOneSix Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 It seems like your problem would get worse if you took the trim away from the rudder. As it is now, you can twist the stick to input some yaw, hit the trimmer, and release the twist, and your yaw input will remain. If you took away the trim for the rudder, you would have to constantly hold a twist on your stick if you wanted to hold any pedal input. Unless I'm just misunderstanding what you want to do. Not that I'm a huge fan of realism, but I'm an even bigger fan of entertainment, and I think that people should know how the aircraft really behaves, but then should be able to do whatever they want (within the limitations of the game, of course) to make it fun for them. That being said, I don't think there is a way to do what you're describing through any sort of config file. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenan Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Getting into hover is so easy...Just pitch up in order to slow down to about 25kph, hit the Auto Hover button and manually stabilize the nose ie. the pitch..if you want you can even hit the trim just to keep it that way. The AP will take over and before you know it, the chopper will be at 0 airspeed. If you crashed after reading my post, all I have to say is... BUAHAHAHAHAAAA! :D [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Commanding Officer of: 2nd Company 1st financial guard battalion "Mrcine" See our squads here and our . Croatian radio chat for DCS World Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDski Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Just to set the record straight. The rudder itself doesn't have hardly any effect at all in a hover. You need to have forward movement to give airflow over the rudder to make it effective. What turns a co-axle helicopter in a hover is one rotor turns faster then the other. The rudder pedals contol both this feature and the actual rudder on the tail at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obiwan Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 What turns a co-axle helicopter in a hover is one rotor turns faster then the other. Uhm... no. Both turn at the same speed. Same gearbox. What changes is the pitch angle. It gets lowered on one set of blades by the same amount it gets raised on the lower blades. The total lift produced remains the same, but the difference in torque caused by the increase/decrease of wind resistance turns the airframe. Feel free to browse the Internet for a more thourough explaination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aphelion79 Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Actually I want it to do the opposite of what you were saying, the heading hold does a MUCH better job of "trimming" the rudder (e.g. keeping a heading) whilst flying around than I ever could with a twist handle on my joystick... and trying to find that sweet spot of rudder trim manually is waaaay to complicated ... so I'd just like to disable rudder trim all together if I could! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slayer Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Trim reset always fixes this problem for me. Keep in mind you will have to trim again quickly because your nose will pitch up (default trim) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] System Specs Intel I7-3930K, Asrock EXTREME9, EVGA TITAN, Mushkin Chronos SSD, 16GB G.SKILL Ripjaws Z series 2133, TM Warthog and MFD's, Saitek Proflight Combat pedals, TrackIR 5 + TrackClip PRO, Windows 7 x64, 3-Asus VS2248H-P monitors, Thermaltake Level 10 GT, Obutto cockpit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aphelion79 Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Ah that may help! I guess I can try that in the meantime... Otherwise my flying looks like this: :joystick: lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docehrenhoefer Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 Problem-solved. Easy. Guys, I think I solved the problem. the trick is, to enter hover with stabilzed heading and with an airspeed lower 8 km/h. Avoid fast changes of the altitude. Then the helo will find a stabile position rather fast. When the helo has stabilzed, press trim and the collective brake. My mistake was, to trim the helo when it still did corrections to stabilze itself, so the small rudder inputs from the autopilot were trimmed.... an this made the helo rotate. No need for .lua tweaks... @aphelion: I used the rudder by turning the joystick grip for a long time (in FSX). But think about it, having rudder pedals is much easier und more decent to use... fine tuning works much better. Greetings Uwe aka docehrenhoefer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mckee14 Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 you can even use the auto-hover for braking :) just hit "autohover" mode when you are still flying forward with around 100km/h, and the shark pulls the nose up like nothing. then, QUICKLY deactivate it, wait 2 seconds, repeat untill your in a stable hover. but you have to get used to it, because you need to either be very reactive with the collective, or VERY QUICKLY deactivate the altitude hold after activating the heading hold. otherwise, your shark gets confused when trying to slow down, back up to the old position to hover, and holding the altitude at the same time... Democracy is choice, not freedom... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDski Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Uhm... no. Both turn at the same speed. Same gearbox. What changes is the pitch angle. It gets lowered on one set of blades by the same amount it gets raised on the lower blades. The total lift produced remains the same, but the difference in torque caused by the increase/decrease of wind resistance turns the airframe. Feel free to browse the Internet for a more thourough explaination. Thanks for setting me straight. Makes sense. At least the speed difference is what makes my model coaxle helo turn. But your explanation sounds more logical and more responsive. At least I was right about the rudder though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aphelion79 Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 Guys, @aphelion: I used the rudder by turning the joystick grip for a long time (in FSX). But think about it, having rudder pedals is much easier und more decent to use... fine tuning works much better. Greetings Uwe aka docehrenhoefer Yes! I would LOVE to have pedals, but my current setup doesn't allow for me to move very far away from my pc, thus no room for pedals! Sucks :( :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphaOneSix Posted January 13, 2009 Share Posted January 13, 2009 At least I was right about the rudder though. When I say "rudder" I mean what happens when you push the pedals. I don't specifically mean the actual rudders on the tail, since very few helicopters have them, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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