AMD rDNA 3 PRESS CONFERENCE

[exil]

4 hours ago, Thinder said:

That's the first thing I check on with Power supply...

Good info, I just checked the dimentions and all I need to upgrade is the PSU for a 850W, I might just got for this one but I'll have a larger CPU bottleneck, although perhaps not much of an issue because my CPU can cope wiuth a 3090 and still not be the bottleneck...

In the case it is a real issue, I'll have to upgrade motherboard, CPU and its fan well.

Wait and see.

 

Just as a side note: I am running my system with a 750w PSU. 

Not saying that it comes without any risk. But it's really system dependent. As long as you don't have a water cooler, lots or RGB and a ton of hard drives, you'll be fine. 

In DCS maximum wattage I've seen so far was 320w from the gpu and about peaks of 80w from the 5800X3D. On average gpu wattage stayed around 200 - 250w depending on where and which model I fly. 

That's for DCS only. I haven't tested with other games except for MSFS (with similar results). So be advised, it could be a total different story with something like Cyberpunk or other games. 

But I'm going pretty much off topic here... Sorry! 

Edited November 4, 2022 by exil
Sorry, not meant to hijack this topic

[LucShep]

13 hours ago, Mars Exulte said:

I paid $1000 for a watercooled R9-295x2 ages ago. And the original Titan card was $2-3k. Dunno where you've been, but the high end cards have been hitting $800-1000 for a really long time, way before crypto and this other stuff came up.

No, that's not same category. 
The R9 295X2 (which were actually two cards in one PCB, like the GTX690 had been before it) was, like the original Titan, the top of the spear, a halo product.
None of those was ever meant to sell in numbers, and are definitely not high-end, they're above that on a class of their own. They're the so called "enthusiast-class".
A bit like the RTX4090 may be considered right now, or previously the RTX3090Ti, or RX6950XT, or RTX2080Ti.

High-end GPU is something like an Nvidia GTX980, or RTX 2080, or RTX 3080. And the AMD HD7950, or R9 290, or RX 6800XT.
None high end GPU had historically and categorically passed the $650 MSRP before the pandemic. 
 

13 hours ago, Mars Exulte said:

And really? PC GaMiNg is dOoMeD!!1!! Jesus @@ Guns as a hobby are way more expensive than PC gaming ever was or will be, yet every dollar store redneck I know has a rack full of AR-15s and hunting rifles and routinely blows off a couple hundred dollars of ammo. People have money for the things they want to have it for.

 "We're all living in Amerika"

 

Edited November 5, 2022 by LucShep

[SkateZilla]

1st, R295x2 is not 2 Cards on one PCB, it's 2 GPU Substrates on one PCB with dual memory controllers and memory banks, the VRM Array and PCIe Interconnect are all shared.

2nd, the 8K Slides, aren't really AMD misleading anyone, they are not the manufacturer of the Screen, the only screen in the press conference was an 8K Ultrawide from Samsung, 
I think you mis-undertand the Market Definitions of 8K, 4K, 2K,

2K, 4K, 8K is the Horizontal resolution, no where in VESA does it say they have to be 16:9 to make them 3840x2160, which also technically isnt 4K, it's 3.8K But you ge tthe idea,

2K = 1920 x <aspect ratio height>
4K = 3840 x <aspect ratio height>
8K = 7680 x <aspect ratio height>

From there, Vertical Resolution is calculated using the Aspect Ratio, which is obviously 32:9
Now if they Said 8K 16:9 I'd expect nothing less than 7680x4320
Also there are 4K 4:3 Screens, running 3840x2880


3rd As for Prices, don't know where you are getting your GFX Cards from, but Top Tier has always been at least 1,000USD, except for the 6-8 Years under the Bulldozer and Polaris reign, where the architectures simply couldnt compete with anything, so they had no choice but to sell it less than $500.

My MSI R7970 Lightning Cost me $1200 New, and $800 / $675 for the 2nd and 3rd units I added later.

Prices are higher now due to production costs, TSMC has been pretty verbal about wafer costs, as is Samsung and SK Hynix

4th, The Stab at nVidia for ATX/PCIe 12VHPWER Connectors, it's honestly well deserved, everyone testing them expressed concern and no one cared, fast fwd from 2017 to 2022, none of the problems exposed in testing were fixed, there was a bandaid in the form of a heat gun sleeve added.
Ask yourself why Intel one of the co-founders of the ATX3.0 12VHPWR Connector doesnt even use it, it was not ready for 500+ watts

If that's what you want to be upset about, then you must've missed the 4 other stabs at nV, starting with not having to create an account to use the tuning software and be tracked.


But if we want a $1800 Behemoth, AMD can take the Navi31 GCD, and Put 2 of them puppies on the Infinity Fabric surrounded by 2x the MCDs, and use a nice 575 to 600w and get similar if not better numbers than the RTX4090

Edited November 5, 2022 by SkateZilla

[72Stu]

These new cards look fantastic on the face of it. 

Amazing price for the "specs" (wait for release ofc),SFF, not too power hungry for the next gen stuff, the upgrade to Display Port had me intrigued. Will that mean a nice improvement for WMR VR headsets? 

In any case, this announcement makes jumping on a 4090 seem premature, to be polite. 

[LucShep]

7 hours ago, SkateZilla said:

1st, R295x2 is not 2 Cards on one PCB, it's 2 GPU Substrates on one PCB with dual memory controllers and memory banks, the VRM Array and PCIe Interconnect are all shared.

 

Semantics, and irrelevant for the topic.
AMD R295X2 combined two R9 290X graphics processors. It was two of their fastest GPU chip at the time slapped on same PCB. Tomato, tomato.
 

7 hours ago, SkateZilla said:

2nd, the 8K Slides, aren't really AMD misleading anyone, they are not the manufacturer of the Screen, the only screen in the press conference was an 8K Ultrawide from Samsung, 
I think you mis-undertand the Market Definitions of 8K, 4K, 2K,

2K, 4K, 8K is the Horizontal resolution, no where in VESA does it say they have to be 16:9 to make them 3840x2160, which also technically isnt 4K, it's 3.8K But you ge tthe idea,

2K = 1920 x <aspect ratio height>
4K = 3840 x <aspect ratio height>
8K = 7680 x <aspect ratio height>

From there, Vertical Resolution is calculated using the Aspect Ratio, which is obviously 32:9
Now if they Said 8K 16:9 I'd expect nothing less than 7680x4320
Also there are 4K 4:3 Screens, running 3840x2880

The thing is, you seem to conveniently miss that there's a very important thing called a "standard", for global market.

Each of those horizontal resolution terms (8K, 4K, 2K) has a dominant resolution "standard", which is what the general public perceives for the matter, and manufacturers base on.
AMD and Nvidia knows it. You know it. I know it.

The dominant standard for 2K is 1920x1080, it's not 1920x720.
The dominant standard for 4K is 3840x2160, it's not 3840x1440.
The dominant standard for 8K is 7680×4320, it's not 7680x2160.*

*Notice how the ultrawide vertical resolution here is 1/2 of the wide one, and this is what AMD used for their "8K" performance charts and argument (cheeky eh?).
Maybe because 16588800 total pixels versus 33177600 total pixels is quite a big difference (it's double the pixel count!) .............  

FWIW, Steve's video at 6:05...

 

7 hours ago, SkateZilla said:

3rd As for Prices, don't know where you are getting your GFX Cards from, but Top Tier has always been at least 1,000USD, except for the 6-8 Years under the Bulldozer and Polaris reign, where the architectures simply couldnt compete with anything, so they had no choice but to sell it less than $500.

My MSI R7970 Lightning Cost me $1200 New, and $800 / $675 for the 2nd and 3rd units I added later.

Huh?   
No, it's me who doesn't know where and how you got those prices(??).
The MSI R7970 LIGHTNING MSRP was $599 on launch, and that one was $50 more than the reference AMD R7970 model MSRP ($549) on launch...
 

7 hours ago, SkateZilla said:

If that's what you want to be upset about, then you must've missed the 4 other stabs at nV, starting with not having to create an account to use the tuning software and be tracked.
 

Oh I did see that, a good stab from AMD towards Geforce Experience... if a bit unfortunate because noone seems to be using that optional POS anyway?   

I've used Nvidia (intercalated with the odd ATi/AMD) for some 25 years (Riva TNT) and, to this day, I've never had to create an account, or be tracked, to access and tune all my Nvidia GPU driver settings?

Regular NV Panel is fine and reliable, and all one needs. But if so inclined, there's NV Profile Inspector (3rd party free app) which unlocks every single possible Nvidia graphics settings to be tuned (combined or not, general or specific) for the more advanced type users. And it's been like that for well over a decade.
Fun fact, to this day there's nothing like it for AMD, and yes it's badly needed (and no, Adrenaline doesn't even come close, not even the defunt A.T.T. or R.P. 3rd party apps).
And let's not even get into the headaches that fancy AMD Adrenaline drivers give at times (instability, green screens, CTD, BSoD, performance issues)... much less seeing even more stuff getting added now to it, likely presenting some trouble (even more) at some point. Hopefully they get it right, and it's all smooth sail for every new customer of these new AMD GPUs when they launch.

What I'm upset with is, 1) the messing about with the (re)nomenclature of GPUs, an evident price hike manipulation on the product line up below the top model -which we'll surely see across all subsequent models- and, 2) how desperate people seem to be that they eat this horse manure this easily.  

Nvidia withdrew the RTX 4080 12GB, and we all know it wasn't "because it was confusing" like they said (on the contrary, it was very clear what they did). It's because it became evident it was an outrageously overpriced "70 class" model (an RTX 4070 in reality) creating gargantous backlashes all around the web. For which also AMD could maybe present a more affordable alternative, and they sensed it.

AMD presented a similar trick as Nvidia with this (re)nomenclature and price trick.
In their case, and this time around, the AMD x900XT is now the x900XTX model, and the x800XT model is now the x900XT. 
But hey.............   *shrugs*

Edited November 5, 2022 by LucShep
*spelling and format

[SkateZilla]

1 hour ago, LucShep said:

Semantics, and irrelevant for the topic.
AMD R295X2 combined two R9 290X graphics processors. It was two of their fastest GPU chip at the time slapped on same PCB. Tomato, tomato.
 

The thing is, you seem to conveniently miss that there's a very important thing called a "standard", for global market.

Each of those horizontal resolution terms (8K, 4K, 2K) has a dominant resolution "standard", which is what the general public perceives for the matter, and manufacturers base on.
AMD and Nvidia knows it. You know it. I know it.

The dominant standard for 2K is 1920x1080, it's not 1920x720.
The dominant standard for 4K is 3840x2160, it's not 3840x1440.
The dominant standard for 8K is 7680 × 4320, it's not 7680x2160.*

*Notice how the ultrawide vertical resolution here is 1/2 of the wide one, and this is what AMD used for their argument (cheeky eh?).
Maybe because 16588800 total pixels versus 33177600 total pixels is (to put it mildly) quite a big difference.............  

 

Oh I did see that, a good stab from AMD towards Geforce Experience... if a bit unfortunate because noone seems to be using that optional POS anyway?   

I've used Nvidia (intercalated with the odd ATi/AMD) for some 25 years (Riva TNT) and, to this day, I've never had to create an account, or be tracked, to access and tune all my Nvidia GPU driver settings?
Regular NV Panel is fine and reliable, and all one needs. But if so inclined, there's NV Profile Inspector (3rd party free app) which unlocks every single possible Nvidia graphics settings to be tuned (combined or not, general or specific). And it's been like that for well over a decade.
Fun fact, to this day, there's nothing like it for AMD, and yes it's badly needed (and no, Adrenaline doesn't even come close, not even the defunt A.T.T. or R.P. 3rd party apps).
And let's not even get into the headaches that fancy Adrenaline drivers give at times (instability, green screens, CTD, BSoD, performance issues)... much less seeing even more stuff getting added now to it, likely presenting some trouble (even more) at some point. Hopefully they get it right, and it's all smooth sail for every new customer of these new GPUs when they launch.

What I'm upset with is, 1) the messing about with the (re)nomenclature of GPUs to relate to an evident price hike manipulation on the product line up below the top model -which we'll surely see across all subsequent models- and, 2) how desperate people seem to be that they eat this horse manure this easily.  

Nvidia withdrew the RTX 4080 12GB, and we all know it wasn't "because it was confusing" like they said (on the contrary, it was very clear what they did). It's because it became evident it was an outrageously overpriced "70 class" model (an RTX4070 in reality) creating gargantous backlashes all around the web. For which also AMD could maybe present a far more affordable alternative, and they sensed it.

AMD presented a similar trick as Nvidia with this nomenclature and price trick.
In their case, and this time around, the AMD x900XT is now the x900XTX model, and the x800XT model is now the x900XT. 
But hey.............   *shrugs*

 

6900XT and 6800XT used the same chip cut down regardless.

again no where in the VESA Standard does it say anything about Display Aspect Ratio having to be 16:9

[LucShep]

6 minutes ago, SkateZilla said:

6900XT and 6800XT used the same chip cut down regardless.

again no where in the VESA Standard does it say anything about Display Aspect Ratio having to be 16:9

Sure thing.
I'll agree to disagree.

[SkateZilla]

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-radeon-rx-7900-series-deep-dive

[Thinder]

On 11/14/2022 at 7:07 PM, SkateZilla said:

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-radeon-rx-7900-series-deep-dive

The RX 7900 XTX is my next GPU, considering how I've been preparing my rig in the CPU-RAM dpt it should make this PC flying at 4K in VR, can't wait to be able to order one.

[SkateZilla]

Same here, I've gone full circle from a HD7970 to a R7900 

I will likely wait a few months for drivers to stabilize, in mean time add back my 2nd dedicated GFX PSU to the case or upgrade my 850 to 1000w min.

[SkateZilla]

7900XTX Benchmarks are beating RTX4080 at lower TDP and Lower Price Points,

it's funning how someone is paying for Google to up list / sponsor the one article that's Mis-leadingly titled saying 7900XTX Loses to not only the 4080 but the RX6950XT.
This article was later corrected, because there were 2 reviewers that did not install the New Drivers for rDNA3 and go spoofed scores in benchmarks and games.

[EightyDuce]

https://videocardz.com/newz/first-amd-radeon-rx-7900-xtx-7900-xt-3dmark-timespy-firestrikes-scores-are-in

Given the source (they're wrong about as often as they are right) coupled with lack of info on setup (ie. drivers), would definitely take it with a healthy dose of skepticism, but interested to see how this shapes up. 

Patiently awaiting Dec 12 reviews. 

[EightyDuce]

 

Edited December 12, 2022 by EightyDuce

[SkateZilla]

 

[Pilotasso]

well, looks like the 7900XTX wins over the RTX4090 for me as much I was tempted for the latter. There is simply not enough performance to justify the price difference.

[EightyDuce]

If you don't care about DLSS or RT performance, it's hard to argue against the XTX at its price. 

[LucShep]

It seems the "upto 70% faster" was a bit of an exaggeration... The next fly in the ointment will be the true, real price in stores.
(inb4 another news episode of "scalpers purchasing batches at once, indirectly provoking price gouging", à la RTX4090 right after launch).

 

Edited December 13, 2022 by LucShep

[SkateZilla]

The 1.7x was against 6900XT's running drivers prior to their Driver improvements, 
Seeing as the 7900s still trade blows with 4080s sans DLSS/RT and with pre-alpha level driver support.

I'll give them 4 months to mature, that way I can update a few other system components while I wait.

[coldViPer]

Interesting to see how 7900XTX really performs with VR, tempting but better to wait and see.

[SkateZilla]

9 hours ago, coldViPer said:

Interesting to see how 7900XTX really performs with VR, tempting but better to wait and see.

^ This

[SkateZilla]

https://babeltechreviews.com/hellhound-rx-7900-xtx-vs-rtx-4080-50-games-vr/5/

[BitMaster]

The more I read about it the more I like Nvidia again.

Maybe when they've sorted out the chiplet latency, as they did from Zen2 to Zen3&4, and have parity in fps/watt.

I am glad my 1080ti still runs, none of the new cards excites me, none. Too expensive, too much power draw.

[LucShep]

...