Intel hybrid CPU Getting stutter? Please try this in multithreading DCS

[BIGNEWY]

7 minutes ago, Buzz313th said:

Question to @BIGNEWY.

Considering that some users have reported inconsistent performance results across different sessions under the same settings.  Is it possible that the team is using some sort of AI learning to manage the CPU cores and other system resources for best performance?

The team are looking at lots of feedback, so many different hardware setups out there with different drivers and settings, it is a minefield for sure. I would need to ask the team for specifics, but I also dont want to distract them as they are very busy currently. 

The feedback in this thread about the mt.lua tweak is helpful so keep it coming. thank you all

[DerKlausi]

Still seeing stuttering, so for me neither better nor worse. Though generally a good idea unleashing the render thread IMHO so maybe make it an option for those who benefit.

Scenario: F16 free flight over Dubai at 1000..1500ft, seeing irregular FPS drops from 80..90 to 50..60 for less than a second, causing severe stuttering.
System: 13900K, 32GB DDR5-6400, RTX4090, Varjo Aero; Win10

 

Edited November 14, 2023 by DerKlausi

[Buzz313th]

37 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

The team are looking at lots of feedback, so many different hardware setups out there with different drivers and settings, it is a minefield for sure. I would need to ask the team for specifics, but I also dont want to distract them as they are very busy currently. 

The feedback in this thread about the mt.lua tweak is helpful so keep it coming. thank you all

Maybe a few more notes from my end might help, or not, but I'll share.

For the most part, just by disabling core#8 for DCS via task manager I get a pretty reasonable experience in the quest3 at almost max link resolution and at roughly 85% max systems settings.  The experience is buttery smooth at 72 frames when generally looking forward.  The micro stutters that I experience are only present when I turn my head roughly more than 90 degrees (Looking out the right or left of the canopy) and roll the jet at a fast rate.  I will get a few stutters and then if I keep my POV in the same direction the stuttering will stop after what feels like some sort of data transfer in my system has found an equilibrium.  It feels like there is a desync of data during the few stutters then the system catches up and settles, whether it be loading graphics, models, or terain mesh, it feels like it takes a second or two and then system completely smooths out and the experience is pristine.  I can increase the probability and intensity of the few micro stutters if I create a larger rendering load on the system by turning on the TGP, the Maverick WPN display or simply just increase the system settings.  

 

One more note I forgot to add..    In flat screen mode, on my Sony 52" tv running at 2556x1440 I have never seen a micro stutter and when I run on my flat screen my DCS system settings are on max.  Only in VR do I see stutters and mostly just during the situation I mentioned above.

I hope these few notes on my experience can help.

Edited November 14, 2023 by Buzz313th

[Joghurt]

Since I enhanced my memory from 32GB to 64GB I sometimes have the problem that my system heavily stutters in the menu (something with the map loading, freezes everything up to and including mouse movement) and it looks like with this it gets better.

i7-13700KF @3.40 GHz

[Buzz313th]

2 minutes ago, Joghurt said:

Since I enhanced my memory from 32GB to 64GB I sometimes have the problem that my system heavily stutters in the menu (something with the map loading, freezes everything up to and including mouse movement) and it looks like with this it gets better.

i7-13700KF @3.40 GHz

When you upgraded your memory, did you buy a matched 64gig set of ram or simply add 32gigs of the same model ram to your motherboard?

[Joghurt]

1 minute ago, Buzz313th said:

When you upgraded your memory, did you buy a matched 64gig set of ram or simply add 32gigs of the same model ram to your motherboard?

Added 32 Gig of the exact same model.

[darkman222]

Even worse now. The CPU graph even shows nothing for almost an entire second here.

Also on single core is now really stuck at 100%.

 

System Specs, W11, Varjo Aero, RTX 4090. Core Parking was off.

Deleting the MT.LUA now.

 

EDIT: RTX 4090

Edited November 15, 2023 by darkman222

[BigNose]

Makes a world of difference for me, no more stutters in singleplayer and multiplayer now. Amazing! It was terrible before, consistent stutters, especially noticable on LODs loading in.

Specs: i9-13900K, 64GB DDR4, RTX4080, DCS on Samsung 990 PRO 2TB

Edited November 14, 2023 by BigNose

[Buzz313th]

4 minutes ago, Joghurt said:

Added 32 Gig of the exact same model.

I personally have messed around with different overclock settings and DRAM Freq on my system, using DCS as a benchmark.  I have found that too aggressive of an OC and too aggressive memory timing and freq will cause more stutters in DCS.  Through trial and error, I have slowed down both my CPU, DRAM Freq and Mem timing to get a better, smoother experience in regards to DCS Micro Stutters.  

Maybe, your addition of another few sticks of memory that aren't part of a matched set could be causing your issues.  

[Gordy]

not better for me, maybe marginally worse, but not definitively.   My fps is generally 80-90 fps in VR anyway though

13900k, 4090, 64 GB of DDR5-6600, varjo aero.

25 minutes ago, Joghurt said:

Added 32 Gig of the exact same model.

A second set of DIMMs may force your motherboard to run them all at a lower speed - check that.   I was really disappointed when I figured that out.   Downgrading back to a single bank of 32 GB of ram improved my performance, because I was able to run them at the rated speed. 

Edited November 14, 2023 by Gordy

[Buzz313th]

16 minutes ago, Gordy said:

not better for me, maybe marginally worse, but not definitively.   My fps is generally 80-90 fps in VR anyway though

13900k, 4090, 64 GB of DDR5-6600, varjo aero.

A second set of DIMMs may force your motherboard to run them all at a lower speed - check that.   I was really disappointed when I figured that out.   Downgrading back to a single bank of 32 GB of ram improved my performance, because I was able to run them at the rated speed. 

 

Your sig shows 64 gigs.   Did you remedy the slower speed of two sets by just getting a matched 64gig set?  Or is your sig outa date?

On my current rig, I made the mistake of buying two different sets of the same memory thinking it would be ok..  But after some testing I realized that one set was faster and that when both were in the system, the MB ran both sets at the best freq and timing of the slower set.  I plan on buying a matched 64 gig set, just haven't got around to it as performance in DCS is as I said pretty good. 

Edited November 14, 2023 by Buzz313th

[splash]

I have no stuttering but wanted to try it. For me there were no difference at all. I performed some tests by flying over Normandy and Marianas at low level and fps were absolutely stable at 60. My specs are: AMD 5900X, 64 Gb of DDR4-3200, RTX 4090.

[Buzz313th]

3 minutes ago, splash said:

I have no stuttering but wanted to try it. For me there were no difference at all. I performed some tests by flying over Normandy and Marianas at low level and fps were absolutely stable at 60. My specs are: AMD 5900X, 64 Gb of DDR4-3200, RTX 4090.

VR or flatscreen?

[splash]

Flat screen, 43 inches 4K.

[DerKlausi]

1 hour ago, darkman222 said:

Even worse now. The CPU graph even shows nothing for almost an entire second here.

Also on single core is now really stuck at 100%.

null

nullSystem Specs, W11, Varjo Aero. Core Parking was off.

Deleting the MT.LUA now.

 

What GPU?

[festr]

13900k overclocked all pcores to 5.7, 64GB RAM (4 sticks) DDR 3200 overclocked timings, 4090, VR-3 varjo with foveated rendering

Hyper threading OFF

affinity for DCS set to 0-7 CPU (all pcores) 
varjo processes set to 8-12 (4 ecores)
all other processes in windows 11 set to 13-23 (rest of ecores) 

testing - F18 cold and dark and apache hot start on runway. 

with MT.lua and without MT.lua I'm not able to percieve any change. When I monitored what CPU was utilised with MT.lua it jumped to core 3, without MT.lua it sticks on other core. 

90FPS steady - fluctuates between 85-90, no major drops. 

for others - make sure that you have closed everything - like really everything in your system and do NOT run any performance monitoring like task manager or anything in the backround to not influence FPS fluctuations (I get -10fps variability when task manager is leaved on) 

[Gordy]

1 hour ago, Buzz313th said:

Your sig shows 64 gigs.   Did you remedy the slower speed of two sets by just getting a matched 64gig set?  Or is your sig outa date?

On my current rig, I made the mistake of buying two different sets of the same memory thinking it would be ok..  But after some testing I realized that one set was faster and that when both were in the system, the MB ran both sets at the best freq and timing of the slower set.  I plan on buying a matched 64 gig set, just haven't got around to it as performance in DCS is as I said pretty good. 

 

I now have a single pair of 2x 32 GB DDR5-6600

[MasterDTM]

Lua did not help in my case. Still experiencing high frequency stutters, even in main menu. Running a 5600x.  

[peachmonkey]

1 minute ago, MasterDTM said:

Lua did not help in my case. Still experiencing high frequency stutters, even in main menu. Running a 5600x.  

the 2.9 hotfix introduced a bunch of stutters on my 5800x3D + 4090. I've changed drivers, repaired the install, modified Nvidia settings, etc etc.. same stutters.

What ultimately helped me was:

- turn every single graphics option (in DCS Options) to Low, disabled all Shadows (cockpit/ground), etc, flew a mission, then exited the game.

- restarted the game, turned up the textures, flew a mission, exited the game

- restarted the game, added low shadows, flew a missions, exited the game

- added more settings, etc .. rinse repeat

 

after this laborious 'fix' I got all of my graphical options back without any stutters. This was akin to 2.7/2.8 times when during graphical updates MSAA woulds stop working so it had to be disabled/re-enabled in order to kick in. It seems with the new graphics options this issue of out-of-sync settings (my arbitrary term) is even more prominent, something doesn't get reset/set properly and it causes the stutter galore.

[MasterDTM]

Just now, peachmonkey said:

the 2.9 hotfix introduced a bunch of stutters on my 5800x3D + 4090. I've changed drivers, repaired the install, modified Nvidia settings, etc etc.. same stutters.

What ultimately helped me was:

- turn every single graphics option (in DCS Options) to Low, disabled all Shadows (cockpit/ground), etc, flew a mission, then exited the game.

- restarted the game, turned up the textures, flew a mission, exited the game

- restarted the game, added low shadows, flew a missions, exited the game

- added more settings, etc .. rinse repeat

 

after this laborious 'fix' I got all of my graphical options back without any stutters. This was akin to 2.7/2.8 times when during graphical updates MSAA woulds stop working so it had to be disabled/re-enabled in order to kick in. It seems with the new graphics options this issue of out-of-sync settings (my arbitrary term) is even more prominent, something doesn't get reset/set properly and it causes the stutter galore.

Thanks for the insight.  Were you also experiencing stutters in the main menu as well?

[peachmonkey]

Just now, MasterDTM said:

Thanks for the insight.  Were you also experiencing stutters in the main menu as well?

yupps...

[MasterDTM]

Just tried this, no luck sadly.

[peachmonkey]

4 minutes ago, MasterDTM said:

Just tried this, no luck sadly.

sad indeed, maybe/hopefully it'll be helpful for someone. To add, my DCS starting procedure is as follows:
- launch Steam

- launch DCS

- switch back to desktop, go to Task Manager, and modify the CPU affinity for dcs.exe to remove cpu 0 and cpu 1 (leaving all others on)

- launch all other ancillary apps:  simshaker, telemetry, joystick control apps, etc etc..

- switch back to DCS

Edited November 14, 2023 by peachmonkey

[II.JG1_Vonrd]

I see that some people with AMD CPUs have tried this with mixed results. Since it seems that it's safe to use with AMD, I will give it a shot. 

@BIGNEWY If it is actually the case that it might work with AMD you might consider changing the title of the thread since it seems to imply that it's Intel only. If in fact, it doesn't work for AMD that should be noted in the lead post.

Thanks for working on the issue though!

[P3Ci]

What I cannot say 100% sure, If it was better for me earlier when no hotfix was done, I believe I did not got stutters/lags at all

So till today, for lags I have been using 90fps limit in graphics.lua in combination with core unparking
- the result was kind of like if vsync was turned on all the time/ it was good playable without lags, but more on slugish speed - mainly in apache

I turned that all off now and tested mt.lua 
- seems it works well and flawless for me
- FPS line is more flawless now, previously squares and resulting spikes
- I can also see frame timing is much faster all the time now, no more spikes there either

I7 13700K clocked at 5,4ghz 1-2 threads / 5,2ghz 3-4 threads / ~4,9 ghz all threads
2x DDR4 16GB samsung b-dye
Win11
4080
(4k DLAA else maxed out too)

So good to me !! Thanks & hope it helps
 

Before

After

Edited November 14, 2023 by P3Ci