Pilotasso Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Right. Supersonic aircraf ducts cant be convergent at the intakes. The plane would never go supersonic that way. [sigpic]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic4448_29.gif[/sigpic] My PC specs below:Case: Corsair 400C PSU: SEASONIC SS-760XP2 760W Platinum CPU: AMD RYZEN 3900X (12C/24T) RAM: 32 GB 4266Mhz (two 2x8 kits) of trident Z RGB @3600Mhz CL 14 CR=1T MOBO: ASUS CROSSHAIR HERO VI AM4 GFX: GTX 1080Ti MSI Gaming X Cooler: NXZT Kraken X62 280mm AIO Storage: Samsung 960 EVO 1TB M.2+6GB WD 6Gb red HOTAS: Thrustmaster Warthog + CH pro pedals Monitor: Gigabyte AORUS AD27QD Freesync HDR400 1440P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Right. Supersonic aircraf ducts cant be convergent at the intakes. The plane would never go supersonic that way. Engines are not my major but I dare to say with such ducts engines would barely run. https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilotasso Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Can someone translate what the engineer is explaining at 1:54? (pelican tail?) [sigpic]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic4448_29.gif[/sigpic] My PC specs below:Case: Corsair 400C PSU: SEASONIC SS-760XP2 760W Platinum CPU: AMD RYZEN 3900X (12C/24T) RAM: 32 GB 4266Mhz (two 2x8 kits) of trident Z RGB @3600Mhz CL 14 CR=1T MOBO: ASUS CROSSHAIR HERO VI AM4 GFX: GTX 1080Ti MSI Gaming X Cooler: NXZT Kraken X62 280mm AIO Storage: Samsung 960 EVO 1TB M.2+6GB WD 6Gb red HOTAS: Thrustmaster Warthog + CH pro pedals Monitor: Gigabyte AORUS AD27QD Freesync HDR400 1440P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffin Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Yeah, he's explaining that the whole vertical fin is moving. By the way, what would be the correct term for fully moving vertical fin? As fully moving horizontal surface is stabilator, then this is...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 (edited) "all-flying tail surfaces" so it would by all-flying rudder surface maybe. http://oea.larc.nasa.gov/PAIS/Supersonic.html Edit: Right. Supersonic aircraf ducts cant be convergent at the intakes. The plane would never go supersonic that way. I think they can and maybe even they should ;) http://www.concordesst.com/powerplant.html Edited January 31, 2010 by Bucic https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilotasso Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 (edited) "all-flying tail surfaces" so it would by all-flying rudder surface maybe. http://oea.larc.nasa.gov/PAIS/Supersonic.html Edit: I think they can and maybe even they should ;) http://www.concordesst.com/powerplant.html Nope, thats not a convergent duct. It has a shockwave ramp wich then lead into a divergent duct. Its different ;) That happens because at subsonic speeds, convergent ducts lead to acceleration of the air, but at supersonic speeds its the opposite, it becomes clogged with trapped air. So the trick is to create a shockwave precisely in 1 spot (only at the ramp, nowhere else) so the remaining flow downards the duct is subsonic, but with higher density. Then it is further reduced as it travels torwards the engine (the divergent part of the duct), the engine further reduces air speed as it proceeds through the compressor. So in short, the rule of thumb is to deccelerate air ever before its fed to the engine. Gases only accelerate aft of the combustion chamber. This brings numerous advantages: Air is slower, so less engine RPM's, and you avoid a fuel flamout. Its denser so it gives more thrust, and you get to avoid supersonic flow and shockwaves inside the engine wich, believe me would be very very very BAD :) EDIT: typos Edited January 31, 2010 by Pilotasso [sigpic]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic4448_29.gif[/sigpic] My PC specs below:Case: Corsair 400C PSU: SEASONIC SS-760XP2 760W Platinum CPU: AMD RYZEN 3900X (12C/24T) RAM: 32 GB 4266Mhz (two 2x8 kits) of trident Z RGB @3600Mhz CL 14 CR=1T MOBO: ASUS CROSSHAIR HERO VI AM4 GFX: GTX 1080Ti MSI Gaming X Cooler: NXZT Kraken X62 280mm AIO Storage: Samsung 960 EVO 1TB M.2+6GB WD 6Gb red HOTAS: Thrustmaster Warthog + CH pro pedals Monitor: Gigabyte AORUS AD27QD Freesync HDR400 1440P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Nope, thats not a convergent duct. It has a shockwave ramp wich then lead into a divergent duct. Its different ;) That happens because at subsonic speeds, convergent ducts leads to acceleration of the air, but at supersonic speeds its the opossite, it becomes clogged with trapped air. So the trick is to create a shockwave precisely in 1 spot (only at the ramp, nowhere else) so the remaining flow dowards the duck is subsonic, but with higher density. Then it is further reduced as it travels torwards the engine (the divergent part of the duct), the engine further reduces air speed of the air as it proceeds through the compressor. So in short, the rule of thumb is to deccelerate air ever before its fed to the engine. Gases only accelerate aft of the combustion chamber. This brings numerous advantages: Air is slower, so less engine RPM's. Its denser so it gives more thrust, and you get to avoid supersonic flow and shockwaves inside the engine wich, believe me would be very very very BAD :) Oh :) https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffin Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 "all-flying tail surfaces" so it would by all-flying rudder surface maybe. I was hoping to see something like "rudderator" or "yawfins". :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boneski Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 (edited) Video For the guys looking for more info Not sure if this was posted... maybe its old news...? http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8486812.stm http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article7007913.ece Edited January 31, 2010 by Boneski My mission is to fly, fight, and win. o-:|:-o What I do is sometimes get a tin of soup, heat it up, poach an egg in it, serve that with a pork pie sausage roll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffin Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 (edited) I don't want to take part (or start it) on the debate about which one is better. Just came across this on mp.net and it's just another way to look at their features: http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-NOTAM-081109-1.html Edited January 31, 2010 by Griffin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilotasso Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 the board is VERY WRONG on many accounts. nuff said [sigpic]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic4448_29.gif[/sigpic] My PC specs below:Case: Corsair 400C PSU: SEASONIC SS-760XP2 760W Platinum CPU: AMD RYZEN 3900X (12C/24T) RAM: 32 GB 4266Mhz (two 2x8 kits) of trident Z RGB @3600Mhz CL 14 CR=1T MOBO: ASUS CROSSHAIR HERO VI AM4 GFX: GTX 1080Ti MSI Gaming X Cooler: NXZT Kraken X62 280mm AIO Storage: Samsung 960 EVO 1TB M.2+6GB WD 6Gb red HOTAS: Thrustmaster Warthog + CH pro pedals Monitor: Gigabyte AORUS AD27QD Freesync HDR400 1440P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Wow, I guess Peter Goon needs to find a new job, 'cause analysis isn't something he's good at. I mean, to start with - who said the F-35 cannot accomplish supersonic weapon delivery? Secondly, how come the F-35's EXTREME SA capability not get a +1? And what's up with the TWR thing? The F-35's engine is pretty tuned up. And how it is that the T-50 has 'extreme agility' compared to a raptor? He's one of Kopp's friends, isn't he? Aka clue-free. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilotasso Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 JSF cant fly above 45000 feet buhahahaha [sigpic]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic4448_29.gif[/sigpic] My PC specs below:Case: Corsair 400C PSU: SEASONIC SS-760XP2 760W Platinum CPU: AMD RYZEN 3900X (12C/24T) RAM: 32 GB 4266Mhz (two 2x8 kits) of trident Z RGB @3600Mhz CL 14 CR=1T MOBO: ASUS CROSSHAIR HERO VI AM4 GFX: GTX 1080Ti MSI Gaming X Cooler: NXZT Kraken X62 280mm AIO Storage: Samsung 960 EVO 1TB M.2+6GB WD 6Gb red HOTAS: Thrustmaster Warthog + CH pro pedals Monitor: Gigabyte AORUS AD27QD Freesync HDR400 1440P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffin Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Seems the debate on F-35 in Australia is so hot that some are even ready to claim a Russian plane superior to oppose JSF. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 It isn't hot at all. The RAAF isn't listening to him, and I'd say they know better. Basically as far as RAAF is concerned, there's no debate, and Kopp is clue-free. ;) Seems the debate on F-35 in Australia is so hot that some are even ready to claim a Russian plane superior to oppose JSF. :D [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsoul2k Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Another sugestions: Dont know... but im sure i can see 4 bay doors on that picture 2 in the front part and other 2 in the rear..... all of then between the engines Rodrigo Monteiro LOCKON 1.12 AMD 3.8 X2 64 2G DDR ATI X1800XT 512 SAITEK X-36 AND VERY SOON TRACKIR-4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A.S Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 I don't want to take part (or start it) on the debate about which one is better. Just came across this on mp.net and it's just another way to look at their features: http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-NOTAM-081109-1.html nice post ! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krippz Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 I don't want to take part (or start it) on the debate about which one is better. Just came across this on mp.net and it's just another way to look at their features: http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-NOTAM-081109-1.html That chart is very partisan. How can they score the T-50 on anything when little is known about it's radar, the data link that it will incorporate, the EWS it will use, etc. I mean as far as I am concerned this is merely a tech demonstrator, the Russians have to develop the following: - AESA radar with LPI and possibly multi-antenna suite - brand-new jet engines enabling supercruise - integrated electro-optical IRST/EW suite (DAS + EOTS) - integrated self-protection and jamming system (Barracuda, SPECTRE) - advanced RAM materials - net-centric technology - advanced methods of integration and quality control for all above And keep it at a reasonable cost i.e. <100 million US Dollars. Sukhoi has a huge task in front of them and almost everything is contingent upon the Indians following through with money. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 64th "Scorpions" Aggressor Squadron Discord: 64th Aggressor Squadron TS: 195.201.110.22 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 F-22 agility yes(0) / PAK-FA (+1) , final score 2 to 5 for PAK-FA... Was this table posted on HAWX forums? https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Griffin Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Was this table posted on HAWX forums? Militaryphotos.net. It was squashed pretty soon there too. nice post ! I regret it already. :D Or should have said "not to be taken seriously". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A.S Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 i found it interesting at least.....i mean ..erm..is it "unpatriotic" not to be a F-22ski fan? .....im unbiased anyways :D [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucas_From_Hell Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Bucic, forget the F-22. The table is just to bash the F-35, the rest is irrelevant :music_whistling: Although the table isn't exactly impartial, and exaggerates in some aspects, it's true that, in some fields (such as CAC), the F-35 is a bit behind its proposed opponents. Putting this "J-XX" thing in the middle was a bit ridiculous. You don't have many info around it, so these can be called educated guesses. If someone wants to take this table seriously, we need to ignore all unknown factors from all aircraft. Maybe we should revisit this table after other PAK-FA flight tests, because now it isn't really complete, making any comparison unfair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 i found it interesting at least Really? .im unbiased anyways :D Then you would have rolled your eyes at that chart ;) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team Groove Posted January 31, 2010 ED Team Share Posted January 31, 2010 How did i know that this chart is from http://www.ausairpower.com BEFORE actually reading the link below ! :D 1 Our Forum Rules: http://forums.eagle.ru/rules.php#en Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilotasso Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 BUMP this thread, cmon guys dont let it die... :) [sigpic]http://forums.eagle.ru/signaturepics/sigpic4448_29.gif[/sigpic] My PC specs below:Case: Corsair 400C PSU: SEASONIC SS-760XP2 760W Platinum CPU: AMD RYZEN 3900X (12C/24T) RAM: 32 GB 4266Mhz (two 2x8 kits) of trident Z RGB @3600Mhz CL 14 CR=1T MOBO: ASUS CROSSHAIR HERO VI AM4 GFX: GTX 1080Ti MSI Gaming X Cooler: NXZT Kraken X62 280mm AIO Storage: Samsung 960 EVO 1TB M.2+6GB WD 6Gb red HOTAS: Thrustmaster Warthog + CH pro pedals Monitor: Gigabyte AORUS AD27QD Freesync HDR400 1440P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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