check procedures Gunsight still WAY off after IHADSS Boresight

[brettt777]

I know how to do this. Like everyone else, I started doing it pretty much from the day I had the thing. It used to work. I'd set the manual range to 1000 yards, boresight the thing and the gun would be right on the money. Now, no matter what I do, it's way off. I try doing it with my TrackIR 5 off but that makes no difference. Has something changed? Is there a new procedure now? I read something about setting the range to AUTO. How would I do that and would it make any difference? One thing that has changed for me is that I now have a triple monitor setup, so my viewpoint it always zoomed way out. Could that be the issue? Where should I have my viewpoint initially to do a proper boresight?

[Floyd1212]

If you spawn in a hot-start aircraft, where the boresight is already done for you, is your gun accurate then?

If you set your MAN to Auto it will do its best to calculate the range to the target based on your altitude and look-down angle, but it assumes you are on level terrain, so it isn't so good in hilly areas.  I personally set mine to 500, and when I am in close to gun trucks and infantry, it is dead-on.  Setting it to 1000 should give you similar results.  I let George lase and "snipe" with the gun using the TADS if I want to engage something much further out.

Can you record a quick track of your boresight procedure and share?

[DmitriKozlowsky]

4 hours ago, brettt777 said:

I know how to do this. Like everyone else, I started doing it pretty much from the day I had the thing. It used to work. I'd set the manual range to 1000 yards, boresight the thing and the gun would be right on the money. Now, no matter what I do, it's way off. I try doing it with my TrackIR 5 off but that makes no difference. Has something changed? Is there a new procedure now? I read something about setting the range to AUTO. How would I do that and would it make any difference? One thing that has changed for me is that I now have a triple monitor setup, so my viewpoint it always zoomed way out. Could that be the issue? Where should I have my viewpoint initially to do a proper boresight?

I am not sure if it matters. But sight range is in meters.

3 hours ago, Floyd1212 said:

If you spawn in a hot-start aircraft, where the boresight is already done for you, is your gun accurate then?

If you set your MAN to Auto it will do its best to calculate the range to the target based on your altitude and look-down angle, but it assumes you are on level terrain, so it isn't so good in hilly areas.  I personally set mine to 500, and when I am in close to gun trucks and infantry, it is dead-on.  Setting it to 1000 should give you similar results.  I let George lase and "snipe" with the gun using the TADS if I want to engage something much further out.

Can you record a quick track of your boresight procedure and share?

On hot start , on runway, Quickstart missions, the boresight is not set. I have to boresight on every mission.

[Floyd1212]

6 hours ago, DmitriKozlowsky said:

On hot start , on runway, Quickstart missions, the boresight is not set. I have to boresight on every mission.

Will it let you boresight again if you want to? Yes.  Has it already been done for you? Yes.

On a cold-start aircraft you will see the "IHADSS B/S REQUIRED" message at the lower left of the High Action Display until you perform the boresight.

On a hot-start aircraft you should not be seeing this message.

 

[brettt777]

13 hours ago, Floyd1212 said:

Will it let you boresight again if you want to? Yes.  Has it already been done for you? Yes.

On a cold-start aircraft you will see the "IHADSS B/S REQUIRED" message at the lower left of the High Action Display until you perform the boresight.

On a hot-start aircraft you should not be seeing this message.

 

Well, I almost exclusively do a prestarted aircraft and I don't recall ever seeing the IHADSS B/S message. So you're saying that in that situation, it has already been boresighted and all I would need to do is maybe, set the range?

[Floyd1212]

51 minutes ago, brettt777 said:

Well, I almost exclusively do a prestarted aircraft and I don't recall ever seeing the IHADSS B/S message. So you're saying that in that situation, it has already been boresighted and all I would need to do is maybe, set the range?

Correct.  Set the MAN range and you're good to go.

[Mad Dog 762]

I have a difficult time with it too.  It seems no matter how careful I am boresighting it is still way off, but it has been that way since the beginning for me.  (I am in VR if it matters).  I do recall Casmo saying long ago the boresight reticle is not correct, the crosshair in the boresight display should not be moving all over the place like it does in the sim (at least in VR).  But, ED has never taken any action to correct it, in fact it does not seem they are doing much with the Apache these days at all.  I have been trying for ages to get an answer as to where our MPSM and flechette rockets we were supposed to get went.....yet now they say they are working on "another" helicopter!  

[Firebird1955]

Issues with cold start boresight as well.  I center the circles and finish the boresight process and when I fly, the gun is ALWAYS off.  I have set to different manual ranges (it does change the hit point of the projectile), as well as auto but never nearly as accurate as when you get in a running apache.  Since it has been a while since I flew the apache, not sure how much has changed/reverted/and changed again.  As I remember, it is better now, but still something I am missing for accurate gun shots.  You are not alone.............

[Floyd1212]

To check if your boresight has been performed accurately, set your ACQ to TADS and tell George to slave to your LOS and see how far off the cued reticle is from where you are looking.  If you have boresighted correctly, the dotted cross should alight with the solid cross exactly.

[HPLsCat]

I've found that if the monocle is set for the left eye, the reticle will always be off to the left; it boresight's off the right eye no matter which eye is set in options. Easy to reproduce, rounds will land to the right of the crosshairs every time in that setup.

It's not apparent in pancake, it's really a VR problem (and if you're left-eye dominant, it's a big problem).

[Draken35]

3 minutes ago, HPLsCat said:

I've found that if the monocle is set for the left eye, the reticle will always be off to the left; it boresight's off the right eye no matter which eye is set in options. Easy to reproduce, rounds will land to the right of the crosshairs every time in that setup.

It's not apparent in pancake, it's really a VR problem (and if you're left-eye dominant, it's a big problem).

Sorry... couldn't resist  Cheers!

[HPLsCat]

I've actually been thinking of doing the DCS equivalent, since it's such a hassle to deal with.

[bradmick]

We teach folks to close their left eye when boresighting the IHADSS to ensure they’re getting a good boresight. In the real aircraft you’re looking for the rings at the back of the BRU to be pink instead of white. The pink color ensures you’re using your right eye and is the result of looking through the combiner lens. Out of habit I close my left eye when boresighting in 2D. I don’t do vr, but it’s probably worth a shot. 
 

Obviously close the opposite eye if you’ve set the monocle to the left.

Also the whole eye dominance thing is overblown.

[HPLsCat]

DCS aligns to the right eye position, even if the monocle is on the left eye. This gives you a parallax offset, doesn't matter if the non-dominant eye is closed or not since the left eye alignment will be further to the left than the right eye physically is.

It can be very difficult to focus your eyes properly doing non-dominant, especially when using the PNVS. Harder to look through the reticle, not at it.

[Gizmo03]

I have to say i'm really fed up with this. I mean even though in the real aircraft the IHADSS is monted on the right side we have the option to use the IHADSS on either - left or right - or even both eyes which is great for everyone whose left eye is the dominant one or whose right eye has poorer vision and i really appreciate that but it doesn't help if it doesn't work.

I am using VR and the IHADSS on the left eye.
Starting in a cold and dark cockpit i can boresight the IHADSS in the pilost's seat according to the manual and when i'm aiming with the IHADSS  the gun hits almost perfectly on spot. 
On the CP/G position it's just a disaster. I had a nice little workaround which seems not to work anymore.
Now i always have to be offset while boresighting the IHADSS which is really annoying. I even don't fly very often with the Apache just because of this. And this makes the whole situation even worse because after one month not using the Apache i always forget how much offset i used the last time. So everytime i want to use the Apache i have to do one flight just to find out the offset again by boresighting - firing - observing the impacts - boresighting again ... until it works. 
I did that just now and noticed again how annoying it is. Then i decided to make a screenshot everytime i'm  boresighting and the final one - which worked goes to my AH-64 kneeboard now.

On the screenshot you can see how i "boresight" my IHADSS in order to get it work properly. But this can't be serious, can it?

Another question is: if "George" uses his IHADSS already properly during a flight, why do i have to boresight it again when i switch to the frontseat? Shouldn´t the IHADSS be aligned already?

Edited June 11 by Gizmo03

[Tholozor]

30 minutes ago, Gizmo03 said:

On the screenshot you can see how i "boresight" my IHADSS in order to get it work properly. But this can't be serious, can it?

You have to align the IHADSS crosshair with the center of the rings in addition to ensuring all rings are visible and centered in the unit.

Also keep in mind the CP/G's default Manual Range is set to 3000 meters.

Edited June 11 by Tholozor

[Floyd1212]

41 minutes ago, Gizmo03 said:

Another question is: if "George" uses his IHADSS already properly during a flight, why do i have to boresight it again when i switch to the frontseat? Shouldn´t the IHADSS be aligned already?

Yes, if you start the aircraft from the back seat, and let George get through his startup routine up front, you don’t need to boresight again when switching between seats. 

[Gizmo03]

vor 23 Minuten schrieb Tholozor:

You have to align the IHADSS crosshair with the center of the rings in addition to ensuring all rings are visible and centered in the unit.

I think you didn't understand the problem. If i do it as you said and as it is writen in the manual it just doesn't work at all. The impact point of the rounds is up to 50m to the left of the aimingpoint. Furthermore the PNVS and TADS are completely offset. The screenshot doesn't show the way i'm doing it while wondering why it's not working. The screenshot shows how i do the boresighting in order to get it working. Only if i do it like in the screenshot i have the canon precise as it shoud be and the PNVS picture fits exactly with what i see outside.

vor 23 Minuten schrieb Tholozor:

Also keep in mind the CP/G's default Manual Range is set to 3000 meters.

I always switch to the Auto mode after boresighting - otherwise it wouldn't make sense .

 

vor 7 Minuten schrieb Floyd1212:

Yes, if you start the aircraft from the back seat, and let George get through his startup routine up front, you don’t need to boresight again when switching between seats. 

That's interesting because if i did so in the past my IHADSS wass completely offset and useless. That's why i did it always again. Was there a change? Maybe i have to  give it another try - thanks.

 

Edited June 11 by Gizmo03

[Tholozor]

28 minutes ago, Gizmo03 said:

I always switch to the Auto mode after boresighting - otherwise it wouldn't make sense

Keep in mind that Auto ranging only uses the radar altimeter and helmet angle to determine slant range, so if the elevation of the ground below you and the target are different, the ballistic calculation will be off (Early Access Guide pg. 311). Utilizing the WAS on the CP/G's cyclic also automatically invokes MAN RNG; setting it Auto only applies after a weapon has been actioned, and isn't a permanent toggle.

[Hiob]

I can't exactly remember where I picked that up (maybe casmo mentioned it somewhere, but I'm not sure about that), but I always set the range manually to 800 and leave it there.
For usual attack altitiudes and ranges that works pretty well. Apart from that I just walk the impacts towards the desired target.

[Gizmo03]

No guys - it's not the range setting. It has nothing to do with the range. I know how the range is calculated in Auto Mode. 
Engaging a target at 12 o clock with the wrong range would lead to impacts in front of or behind the target - short or long. But that is not the problem. The problem is, the impacts are all way off to the left (same distance).
Also - as i said - the PNVS and the TADS are completely offset.

The boresight procedure according the manual works fine..... as long as you use the IHADSS on the right eye. But on the left eye it just doesn't work - at least at the CP/G station.

[Hiob]

4 minutes ago, Gizmo03 said:

No guys - it's not the range setting. It has nothing to do with the range. I know how the range is calculated in Auto Mode. 
Engaging a target at 12 o clock with the wrong range would lead to impacts in front of or behind the target - short or long. But that is not the problem. The problem is, the impacts are all way off to the left (same distance).
Also - as i said - the PNVS and the TADS are completely offset.

The boresight procedure according the manual works fine..... as long as you use the IHADSS on the right eye. But on the left eye it just doesn't work - at least at the CP/G station.

Ah ok, indeed a completely different issue than what I understood. Sry.

[Floyd1212]

1 hour ago, Gizmo03 said:

That's interesting because if i did so in the past my IHADSS wass completely offset and useless. That's why i did it always again. Was there a change?

This has always been the case.  I just checked it again now, and when I swapped to the front seat the "Boresight IHADSS" message is not there.

That's not to say that there isn't a problem with alignment when using the IHADSS in the left eye.  I could see George boresighting for the right eye, then when you swap seats and use your left eye, things are off.  I use TrackIR in 2D myself.

If you use the right eye, does everything work properly?

[Gizmo03]

vor 10 Minuten schrieb Hiob:

Ah ok, indeed a completely different issue than what I understood. Sry.

No problem at all  
I noticed that i might took the wrong thread for my question - there is another thread about this issue specifically for the use of the IHADSS in VR on the left eye and both eyes.

And it's not such a big deal - as long as i do the boresighting as in the screenshot everything is spot on. But it shouldn't be like this in one of the most complex ED modules in DCS  

vor 3 Minuten schrieb Floyd1212:

This has always been the case.  I just checked it again now, and when I swapped to the front seat the "Boresight IHADSS" message is not there.

That's not to say that there isn't a problem with alignment when using the IHADSS in the left eye.  I could see George boresighting for the right eye, then when you swap seats and use your left eye, things are off.  

I thought the same already. Maybe it was always off for me because George is not boresighting the IHADSS with the left but with the right eye.

 

vor 4 Minuten schrieb Floyd1212:

If you use the right eye, does everything work properly?

I never tried to use the IHADDS on the CP/G seat without boresighting it while using the right eye. Only while using the left eye.
When i use the right eye, the boresighting works perfectly. But i just prefer to use it on the left eye - that's why im struggeling  

[ShuRugal]

9 hours ago, Gizmo03 said:

I never tried to use the IHADDS on the CP/G seat without boresighting it while using the right eye. Only while using the left eye.
When i use the right eye, the boresighting works perfectly. But i just prefer to use it on the left eye - that's why im struggeling  

I know this doesn't achieve the solution you are looking for, but have you tried using the IHADDs on your right eye?

You may actually find that having the display on your non-dominant eye improves your "stick and pedals" flying, as it makes paying attention to the display a much more deliberate action, and getting over-focused on the display is something that gives a lot of people trouble (unconsciously trying to fly the HUD instead of the aircraft).

I overcome this problem myself by keeping the "hide HMD" binding on my HOTAS so i can kick it out of my vision when i'm not doing something that NEEDS it.

If you've already tried this, then feel free to tell me to eff off.