What's the Point of Moving Threads?

[ericinexile]

(Before I continue, may I recommend that this thread be moved to the Forum Administration Complaints Channel)

 

I know this has been brought up before but thus far I haven't heard an answer that doesn't leave me more puzzled than I was before I asked. So I will ask again: Why take active threads and move them to the dozen little obscure subsections of the forum? I mean its not like this forum gets 10,000 posts a day. If it did then I could understand the need for heavy administration. But this forum is lucky to get 200 posts in a day and usually most of those posts are lumped into a single popular thread. So why not just let threads exist, thrive, or die on the General Discussion channel and users can use the search function to find particular topics of interest but still see what is most popular and pressing among other users. Moving an interesting thread almost always kills it because most people (me anyway) usually won't bother jumping over to continue the discussion. Look, I'm not asking for a change in the way moderators address inappropriate content--you guys do a fair job in that regard. And I know this isn't my forum and I know I have little if any right to make demands. I just ask that you consider the utility of such aggressive house cleaning.

[joey45]

Everything has its place...

[159th_Falcon]

Simple, if im curious if there are any new MP missions out, i check the campaigns sections.

If i got a bug i report it in bug section, also easier for ED to see what bugs are out there.

Really, this house cleaning is very useful if you want certain info.

For example i want info about building my own pit, if i do a search for it i get i don't know how many irrelevant topics/posts.

If i just go straight to the game controllers / home cockpits section i got all threads there and see in the blink of an eye which are still active and there are probably also some useful sticky's to be found there.

 

Also if you want a modd for the the cockpit glass you can do two things

1 search the whole forum for cockpit glass modd (i wish you luck, lots of it)

2 search the mods / add-ons section for cockpit glass, this will yield much more relevant topics/post.

 

Don't forget that even though this forum may not get many posts a day, even posts of 2 or more years old can still be relevant, thus having things organized is very useful and im grateful to the moderators taking there time to keep things tidy.

 

Everything has its place...

dang, to late

[Grimes]

I agree threads need to be organized in a specific way, but there are times when it feels justified to post in the general section vs the other sections...

 

Case in point, I posted my poll on Black Shark and what people expect from it online with FC2 in the general section rather than the multiplayer section BECAUSE of the total number of replies that section has over the other. I didn't do it out of spite to the mods or ignorance of where it "by rule" should go. I did it because it would generate more traffic, thus fielding more replies, thus giving me and those interested in the results of the pole a better idea of what the player base is thinking.

 

Black Shark General: 69,000 (if you take out the other sections and look at just general)

Multiplayer (includes general MP, LO MP, and BS MP): 2,000

[joey45]

Also IF or WHEN the post is moved it is still in the origanal place for a short time.

[ericinexile]

I agree threads need to be organized in a specific way, but there are times when it feels justified to post in the general section vs the other sections...

 

Case in point, I posted my poll on Black Shark and what people expect from it online with FC2 in the general section rather than the multiplayer section BECAUSE of the total number of replies that section has over the other. I didn't do it out of spite to the mods or ignorance of where it "by rule" should go. I did it because it would generate more traffic, thus fielding more replies, thus giving me and those interested in the results of the pole a better idea of what the player base is thinking.

 

Black Shark General: 69,000 (if you take out the other sections and look at just general)

Multiplayer (includes general MP, LO MP, and BS MP): 2,000

 

 

That's the post that "inspired" this thread. It was very informative to get people's opinion about their expectations. But now only a small population of forum users will ever know of the thread's existence. And that will kill the thread.

 

For those who treat the the forum as an encyclopedia, the separation is useful. For instance, "How Do I Trim?". Search "Trim" and you will learn. But you still won't care what subforum the hits reside in.

 

But I rarely use the forum that way. I want to know what others are talking about. What are they interested in? And separating popular threads simply because they touch an arbitrary subject area immediately cuts their popularity by 90%. It is arbitrary and stupid.

[EvilBivol-1]

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=709335#post709335

[EvilBivol-1]

What I meant to say was that I don't think it's necessary to start a new thread about the same topic, especially by the same poster. ;)

[CyBerkut]

If people want to see the new posts on various subjects, they should be taking on the responsibility to go look in the appropriate areas, rather than expecting the posts to appear where they prefer to look. The forum organization is well laid out, and that system is reasonable and useful.

 

I think from a human factors aspect, the biggest obstacle to people using the intended tool for checking new posts (ie. the "New Posts" button at the top of the page), is that it results in getting all of the new messages in all of the languages. That is fine for the multi-lingual folks who want to read all of the postings. However a lot of folks are fluent/functional in only a single language, and the new posts button is giving them a lot of postings to wade through that they don't want. I suspect that is leading to some people not using it, which would lead to them possibly missing new postings in the low traffic areas.

 

It would be nice if the forum code for th new posts button could accomodate filtering the forums by language(s)... but that is not the case.

 

Fortunately, there is a work around of sorts, which Alpha One Six was nice enough to posts some time ago:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=647780&postcount=8

 

Making a shortcut icon for one's desktop, as described, makes it easier to avoid missing out on new postings in all of the desired areas.

[ericinexile]

What I meant to say was that I don't think it's necessary to start a new thread about the same topic, especially by the same poster. ;)

 

Which I noted in my OP by saying:

 

I know this has been brought up before but thus far I haven't heard an answer that doesn't leave me more puzzled than I was before I asked. So I will ask again...

 

I get it. I'm am alone on this so I will shut up. I've always taken the General Discussion subforum as a poll of what subjects interest users. As an example there is currently a fairly active thread on Audigy (probably should be moved to Hardware). If you have an X-FI sound card you might never know of the existence of the software which corrects EAX sound issues with that card. Very helpful and precisely the reason the forum exists. Others don't see it that way so I will use the forum as the owners intend. Well almost. I will still continue to post on GD and let Admins decide where it belongs because most topics cannot not be pigeon-holed into a single subject. How does one decide where it belongs...

[MBot]

Frankly I too think that the separation of the forum section is too strict. While I appreciate that for example threads about people searching a squad are concentarted in the Multiplayer forum, I think that a good discussion about MP has its place in the General Discussion section with the amount of traffic it brings.

 

Like it or not, but topics outside the General Discussion get less views, less thought and less participation.

[Boberro]

Every thread should have their own place.

 

I think mods here are really friendly and they are too much friendly. Even when next again 10x same questions they won't delete them or add warnings.

 

In my opinion it is one of the bests forum staff, but sometimes they aren't too resolute and by this we have many doubled threads and few other things which I noticed ;)

[EtherealN]

I will still continue to post on GD and let Admins decide where it belongs because most topics cannot not be pigeon-holed into a single subject. How does one decide where it belongs...

 

Ahem...

 

Dear users,

 

As forum moderators, we are having to constantly move threads out of the DCS General Discussion area into more appropriate sections of the forum. Before creating a new thread, please consider where it would belong best.

 

Please note that posting OT threads is against the forum rules. Although we have not been very strict in enforcing this rule so far, the traffic carried by the DCS General Discussion area has reached a level where we feel it has become necessary to do so. Going forward, failure to adhere to this rule will result in official warnings.

 

The forum is there for the convenience of the community. I'm sure that your individual help in keeping it well organized and functional would be appreciated by all.

 

Thank you.

 

Getting extra work because you want me to decide for you where your thread belongs makes me a sad panda. :(

 

As for how one decides... Well, if it's hardware, post in hardware. If it's DCS multiplayer, post in DCS multiplayer. If it's an LO bug/problem, post in the LO Helpdesk. Simple, no?

 

Now, when I see cases where I can see that it's ambiguous where it should fit I don't get angry about it, but a lot of the workload we get in that department is blatantly obvious, which is the reason for the quoted part. But please at least try - don't just decide that you can't make a decision about your own thread.

Edited January 7, 2010 by EtherealN

[159th_Viper]

.....makes me a sad panda. :(....

 

Here we Go - Nibble on Forth.......

 

 

 

 

I Meant the Bamboo, You........:P

[EtherealN]

I'm a happy panda now. :D

[ericinexile]

"So I was flying Multiplayer on the 3rd Sqdn server yesterday and suddenly my Trackir stopped working. This was REALLY bad timing because I was 20 minutes into the mission and almost at target. I logged off, reset my TrackIr, and tried to log back on but the TIR got stuck again. This never happens in single player missions. Another odd tidbit is that other players on Teamspeak also said that they've occasionally encountered this problem...BUT ONLY ON THAT SERVER..."

 

Completely made up but where shoult that thread go????

[CyBerkut]

"So I was flying Multiplayer on the 3rd Sqdn server yesterday and suddenly my Trackir stopped working. This was REALLY bad timing because I was 20 minutes into the mission and almost at target. I logged off, reset my TrackIr, and tried to log back on but the TIR got stuck again. This never happens in single player missions. Another odd tidbit is that other players on Teamspeak also said that they've occasionally encountered this problem...BUT ONLY ON THAT SERVER..."

 

Completely made up but where shoult that thread go????

 

Probably over in 3rd Sqdn's forums/website, since it only happens on their server... ;)

[159th_Viper]

......where shoult that thread go????

 

That's the Beauty of the System.......You don't need to know where it Should Go!

 

The Relevant Moderator/Admin will decide for you if you happen to get it Wrong - No Mess No Fuss ;)

[topol-m]

^^^ What 159th Viper said. But that freedom should not be abused. For instance if you have started like 30 threads and all of them are moved by the admins in different sections of the forums than you must be: 1. retarded, 2. you don`t speak english, 3. you don`t give a sh!t about rules. And yes there is such rule: "1.5. - Threads and posts are to be on topic according to the forum section and thread title."

I actually like the threads to be in order, nice and clean. Whatever you need you know where it is. I wouldn`t like chaotic browsing through a section looking like that: "Intel C2Duo vs AMD Phenom", "DCS: Mi-24", "Big boobs", "BS made my PC explode", "Why Ka-50 doesn`t have AA missiles?", "My new tie fighter cockpit", "Why do i keep crashing...", etc., to find the thread I need.

 

Edit: Oh and 5 posts above... Niiice bamboo ;)

Edited January 8, 2010 by topol-m

[EvilBivol-1]

I agree that the GD section gets more views and one is tempted to post there exactly for that reason - to maximize the exposure of their thread. But you have to consider that you are not the only one posting. There are hundreds of active members and everyone wants their thread to recieve maximum exposure no less than you do. If we allow everyone to post in the GD section freely, your thread is quickly bump down onto page 2 or 3 of the section, which in turn means less exposure, because just as members aren't very good about checking other sub-sections, they aren't very good about checking past the first page or two of an active section.

 

IMHO, while the desire to post in the GD section is understandable, it's a collective bad habit and does not ultimately make best use of the forum for the community at large. I believe a good forum structure can slowly turn this around. At least, this is my hope.

 

It doesn't mean that our structure and practices are perfect. We did open a suggestion box and look forward to suggestions on how to improve them. Certinaly we have some of our own ideas. But in general, as I had indicated in the previous thread about this, all of our sections carry more or less daily traffic, which is indication enough IMO that the structure is functional.

I get it. I'm am alone on this so I will shut up. I've always taken the General Discussion subforum as a poll of what subjects interest users. As an example there is currently a fairly active thread on Audigy (probably should be moved to Hardware). If you have an X-FI sound card you might never know of the existence of the software which corrects EAX sound issues with that card. Very helpful and precisely the reason the forum exists. Others don't see it that way so I will use the forum as the owners intend. Well almost. I will still continue to post on GD and let Admins decide where it belongs because most topics cannot not be pigeon-holed into a single subject. How does one decide where it belongs...

Taking the attitude that you will post in the GD area despite our repeated warnings against this and furthermore making this a public statement looks to me like taking a careless and hostile attitude toward the rules of the forum and its staff. It's probably not the best approach to take and I would encourage you to reconsider. Nobody is asking you to "shut up", but there are more constructive ways to make your point than intentionally ignoring forum rules and reposting threads which had been previously discussed and acknowledged by the forum staff.

Edited January 9, 2010 by EvilBivol-1

[Boberro]

I have an example what I wrote before:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=814073

 

Soory but this IIRC has been discussed and there are still threads about it. Then there are 10 threads about same with 2 post inside. :)

[ericinexile]

...Taking the attitude that you will post in the GD area despite our repeated warnings against this and furthermore making this a public statement looks to me like taking a careless and hostile attitude toward the rules of the forum and its staff. It's probably not the best approach to take and I would encourage you to reconsider. Nobody is asking you to "shut up", but there are more constructive ways to make your point than intentionally ignoring forum rules and reposting threads which had been previously discussed and acknowledged by the forum staff.

 

Relax EB,

 

I have no intent to hijack the forum or otherwise make myself unwelcome. Its your home to clean as you please I am just a guest with no rights other than to leave when I feel unwelcome. And I feel very welcome. I made my point which you understandably took to be blatant resistance to forum rules. It was not. Rather it is my recognition that the GD/Not GD distinction is arbitrary. This is why I still intend to post there when I am unclear as to where the thread belongs. In the two examples given, I think I've been clear that one doesn't always know. Topics, as in all things in life, rarely fit neatly into someone else's devisions. The "ALchemy" thread is still in the GD section even though it is obviously hardware related. It is still there because even Admins are not sure where it should be placed. AND I am glad it is as I would never have known to go to the Hardware subforum to learn about a problem I didn't know I had. (Well actually I learned about it a year ago but the point is the same). There is another thread in the GD section in which the poster complains about his GPU overheating with DCS. Again, obviously a Hardware issue ...but then again, maybe not. He doesn't know as he thinks it may be unique to DCS. But I digress. It's not like I am a spamming "thread starter" overwhelming the Admins. I doubt I have started more than a dozen threads since DCS was released. I just thought there was a freer way to do things that would provide the thread starter a better chance of getting numerous useful responses to his/her thread. I was apparently wrong. Carry on...

Edited January 9, 2010 by ericinexile

[EvilBivol-1]

The admins, like the users, are people with varying opinions, faults and time limitations. I for one sometimes don't even realize that a thread I am busy reading actually belongs in a different section. We don't have moderator meetings for each and every thread to be moved. We simply expect our moderators, like our users, to make an effort to conform to the forum structure, which, again speaking personally, is under constant evaluation.

 

Your original point - already made and acknowledged in your previous thread - was taken and your opinion that thread moving on this forum may be too aggressive was noted. It is an opinion that is not universal, with some forum members supporting it and some not. I feel our obligation is to consider your input, whether we agree with it or not. Having considered it, we will continue to make an effort to keep threads in the sections we feel they belong best, but I sincerely mean that suggestions on how to improve the forum structure are welcome, including less divisions if you think so. I, too am not completely satisfied with the structure as is. My own tendency is to increase organization and sub-sections, but I am learning that this is not always the best approach, either. Hence the suggestion box.

Edited January 10, 2010 by EvilBivol-1

[ericinexile]

I get it now. I agree with a previous poster that the "New Posts" link should either be language specific or that the user should be able to filter out threads that are not in his chosen language. As always, thanks for the discussion.