A10 warthog problem

[HiJack]

Fixing a mission planning problem by altering the weapons of the atacking aircraft is not a good idea. And specialy when doing this only on the A-10 and not the Su-25T, the Ka-50 and the list goes on. This make me want to scream! ED have had some BAD advice in desiding this!

[ralfidude]

Yeah, the su 25T is my choice. I loved the a10 but i gave up. There is no point in flying it anymore. The Su-25T seems to have absolutely NO problem lockign onto any target i point at, only thing that lags a lock is distance from target.

 

A10.... well in the video i posted, one thing keeps happening over and over, at 0:30, that aa vehicle, is a Bizniatch to lock on to. BUT. You will get a lock ONCE it fires, or just before, or just after. But never otherwise. Sometimes even if it fires you wont get a lock, lol. And these are vehicles that are part of missions that we are supposed to take care of, i cant just ignore them...

 

Sometimes i get so close that im TOO close, and have to just go for a gun run instead, and get chewed up by something else in the area, OR the damn thing fires on me as im abotu to gun run it and i have to bugger off...

 

Ehh. So i decided to quit the a10 untill DCS a10 comes out. But i do however see the point that they wanted to make it more realistic or challenging in a way. Otherwise the a10 would not have a single ground threat against it, you just dominate everything. But that could have been easily solved by simply shortening the lock range, within the AAs fire range capability, giving you a 50/50% chance of survival. But the stupidity of the lack of lock on absolutely COLD buildings on my very last clip was the final straw for me, lol. I pulled up form that attack, and exited the game out of anger and frustration.

[159th_Viper]

.... well in the video i posted, one thing keeps happening over and over, at 0:30, that aa vehicle, is a Bizniatch to lock on to.....Sometimes even if it fires you wont get a lock, lol

 

Try 6 x magnification next time as opposed to the 3 x magnification.....;)

[Moa]

Try 6 x magnification next time as opposed to the 3 x magnification.....;)

 

Thanks for the tip Viper. For me, lock problem is at both magnifications - but it might work for someone else.

[Speed]

Wow, and now I understand why my squad mates do not want to fly the A-10A in LOFC2. As someone who worked with actual IR sensors, I can tell you that the lock behavior shown in Ralfidude's video is NOT realistic at all. Let's hope to GOD that ED has fixed this crap in DCS A-10!!!

 

Oh and another note, I just noticed this thread. You go Moa!! + rep inbound

[nomdeplume]

My main gripes with the Maverick seeker lock range is that it feels very gamey. The patch reduced the range specifically for SHORAD platforms, presumably in an attempt at improving game balance or somesuch. I feel like it's unrealistically low, and results in the A-10's only stand-off weapon being virtually useless against the only threats it really needs to use stand-off weapons in order to destroy safely.

 

However, I can't comment as to whether the ranges are realistic or not, so I'll just take ED's word and adjust accordingly.

 

What does bug me is that it's inconsistent. Put an Avenger and a regular Humvee out on a field, and the regular Humvee will be lockable well before the Avenger. Apparently putting a missile turret on top of the vehicle makes it much harder for the IR tracker to lock it??? Then put a single soldier out in the field. Apparently it's much easier for the Maverick to lock up a person than a large vehicle?

 

I think it would bug me a lot less if the lock ranges were more consistent amongst vehicles of similar sizes. But as it is now, it feels gamey.

[Moa]

If it was only the ranges that were reduced then we wouldn't gripe so much (as yes, we are griping a lot). It is the fact that when you finally guide the seeker to the target of interest (wrestling with the acknowledged 'dog-leg' slew bug) the seeker will decide to jump some where else - like to a cool patch of ground nearby. That's the real problem that has not yet been acknowledged.

 

So, to clarify the situation, the Maverick D seeker seems affected by the following things:

 

1) Slewing bug. The seeker does not always slew in the commanded direction. Acknowledged as a bug. Hopefully fixed one day if the decision is ever made to patch FC2 (not decided at present, although there are several factors against it happening). Please do not re-report this bug as it has been acknowledged by the ED team.

 

2) Range restrictions. Made to make seeker lock ranges more 'realistic'. Only affects some targets and not others (eg. can lock HMMWV but not Avenger despite them having similar IR profiles) and does not appear to affect the Mercury pod - so of dubious benefit to realism considering the ranges would be more affected by meteorological conditions (eg. haze, low cloud) than anything else.

 

3) Seeker lock bug. Seeker jumps to random location (sometimes another object, sometimes not) and not the target in the cross-hairs. Not acknowledged as a bug as it doesn't appear to affect the ED testers (at least according to their reports) but affects us badly as shown in the submitted videos. This is the most critical bug IMHO but is not yet acknowledged by ED developers or testers as existing. Unfortunately, it appears the only way we can get such acknowledgment is continual griping on this forum - which is something I didn't really want to do, but I would like the problem to be at least acknowledged (then we'll shut up).

Edited September 17, 2010 by Moa

[GGTharos]

I have a feeling that what happened with the mavs was not entirely intentional; unfortunate, but there was no intention to gamify things.

[Moa]

Thank GGTharos. Yes, I've already recanted my original conclusion - although the shorting of range was intentional it seems, but probably not the other two issues. Would be a great thing if this was addressed (if the decision is made to patch FC2 - although we understand such a patch may never eventuate).

Edited September 18, 2010 by Moa

[Pilotasso]

This mav thing would be nice to fix along with HOJ for F-15. Right now they are useless.

[Lange_666]

3) Seeker lock bug. Seeker jumps to random location (sometimes another object, sometimes not) and not the target in the cross-hairs. Not acknowledged as a bug as it doesn't appear to affect the ED testers (at least according to their reports) but affects us badly as shown in the submitted videos. This is the most critical bug IMHO but is not yet acknowledged by ED developers or testers as existing. Unfortunately, it appears the only way we can get such acknowledgment is continual griping on this forum - which is something I didn't really want to do, but I would like the problem to be at least acknowledged (then we'll shut up).

 

Been away for a while so i didn't follow this forum/thread until now.

I can only say that you guys are 100% correct that this is a bug although others (Viper etc) say otherwise. The last part of the video shows exactly what the problem is. You don't need a track for that. It's not a slewing bug but a seeker lock bug.

 

Why:

- You can slew to wherever target you want, the moment you lock it, it "jumps" to an entirely different location, in 95% of the cases, not a real target. It should "lock" on the position you did slew it on.

- If you fly in a low detail environment (no trees, no buildings etc..), the problem is reduced because the seeker will only jump to what is on the terrain, in this case only targets. But it's no garantee that the seeker stays on the target you slewed it on the moment you pressed "lock". It will still jump to the target it likes.

- If you fly in a high detail environment (trees, buildings etc...), the problem is immediatly there. The seeker will jump and lock on anything but the target you slewed it on, mostly cold buildings or other colder surroundings. If you remove trees and building but keep high detail on, it will lock onto the surrounding grass instead of any clearly vissible target. And you can not make the seeker to lock onto a target other then by flying around, reposition and do this over and over again until you are lucky and the seeker stays on a target. And even then, it still might jump (so it's a seeker lock bug, not a slew bug because you don't slew anymore, you are already locked) when you get closer.

 

My squadmate called this: "Feck, i'm shooting grass again".

 

It happened in FC1 and is still there in FC2. The only difference compared to FC1 is that the target are not black dots anymore (which was far from real) and are therefore harder to spot (which is real) in FC2. But that "bug" from FC1 still persist in FC2 and imo destroys gameplay in the A-10.

 

If there was one bug i hoped would have been fixed for the A-10, then it was this one. But unfortunatly, it didn't happen...

Edited September 21, 2010 by Lange_666

[ralfidude]

Lol, i love that quote.

 

Yeah the lock problem in no detail enviroments is interesting.

 

I flew a mission where a AA was sitting in a deserted patch with literally NOTHING around it. I thought, hey, my mav should be able to lock on to the only heat source in that entire area right?

 

Well.... All that happened was me flying in a straight line at it, and had the mav pointed at the damn AA, and pressed lock, which upon it locked the ground near it, but not the damn target itself. I was within gun range almost when the AA fired on me, and THATS when i got the lock on target, a lil too late....

 

It does this constantly. My mates that just got into this game from FC2 figured that one out before me. That when engaging an AA, dont bother. Wait till he engages you first, then you MIGHT have a "shot" at it. Lol. Then run like hell and scream like a little girl for your mommy while flapping your hands widely. In hopes that the missile will miss you.

[ΗΟLΙDΛΥ]

Many many complaints on the mavericks from a few people including myself.

 

What has happened since FC1?

 

Are you trying to use the maverick's in DCS:A-10?

 

If so DCS is an actual simulator not an arcade game and they have incorporated many intricate and more realistic weapon deployment systems.

 

Solution to your problem, read the manual. Your one button away from success. When you have your maverick's powered on and your maverick aligned your targeting pod screen will come on. From there you may scan in your hud reticle a small SOI box. Once you have that where you want it. Hit the MAV button one more time and it will align your target camera with the reticle on the hud and you may then slew the camera to your target. Once you find what you want to mutilate, hit TWS Up and release the weapon my friend!!! Happy hunting :)

[CaptHawk]

I think they are talking about "Flaming Cliffs 2" A10 warthog....nothing to do with DCS a10warthog:D

[ralfidude]

yeah, wth are you talking about Holiday? Lol This is a flaming cliffs 2.0 section debate. I even posted video of it a page ago, lol.

[HiJack]

Lol, i love that quote.

 

Yeah the lock problem in no detail enviroments is interesting.

 

I flew a mission where a AA was sitting in a deserted patch with literally NOTHING around it. I thought, hey, my mav should be able to lock on to the only heat source in that entire area right?

 

Well.... All that happened was me flying in a straight line at it, and had the mav pointed at the damn AA, and pressed lock, which upon it locked the ground near it, but not the damn target itself. I was within gun range almost when the AA fired on me, and THATS when i got the lock on target, a lil too late....

 

It does this constantly. My mates that just got into this game from FC2 figured that one out before me. That when engaging an AA, dont bother. Wait till he engages you first, then you MIGHT have a "shot" at it. Lol. Then run like hell and scream like a little girl for your mommy while flapping your hands widely. In hopes that the missile will miss you.

 

LOL I guess you forgot to ask JTAC before engaging the AAA :P Or was that not FC2?

 

Seriously:

I sure hope ED fix this even if they now are working fulltime on DCS A-10C. They can not just "forget" about FC2 IMO.

[Nerdwing]

Agreed totally. I intend to buy A10C in the eventual future, but it'd still be great to have these issues fixed if possible before then.

[BuzyBat]

159th_Viper

 

Originally Posted by HiJack

...The slew problem is more visible if you zoom in on the targets.

 

Then don't zoom.

159th_Viper

Originally Posted by ralfidude

.... well in the video i posted, one thing keeps happening over and over, at 0:30, that aa vehicle, is a Bizniatch to lock on to.....Sometimes even if it fires you wont get a lock, lol

Try 6 x magnification next time as opposed to the 3 x magnification.....;)

I don't get this, first you say one thing, next you say different?

 

To me it's very clear there is 2 bugs here, first the slew bug.

The second bug is if I got this right ,the SAM vehicles are too bright on display, and thats why we all think it should not be that hard to lock.

Because if SAM's are harder to lock, then it should be reflected in IR display too.

 

All in all, this problem and the slew problem making it extra hard to target something, is beyond my understanding, you actually deliberatly want to ruin a possible good game? (at least the maveric use)

 

And to the no patch in future decision. Doesn't this qualify it to abandonware? Edit; Hey, it's FC2 I'm talking about, not DCS series, so stop the negative reputation! :) (lol, down 265 in last 12 hours)

Edited October 27, 2010 by BuzyBat

[BuzyBat]

159th_Viper, on my cp I only see one giving me Reputation, did you alone manage to give me all those??????

Edited October 27, 2010 by BuzyBat

[159th_Viper]

BuzyBat, on my cp I see one giving me negative reputation (including unnecessary insult), did you alone manage to do that??????

 

Apol's for OT - Let's get Back on Topic, shall we ;)

Edited October 27, 2010 by 159th_Viper

[BuzyBat]

BuzyBat, on my cp I see one giving me negative reputation (including unnecessary insult), did you alone manage to do that??????

 

You still avoid to answer, so my insult seem to be correct, because you still acting like one :)

I just wanted to know if you only gave me -1 point, thats all, and I would forget it.:helpsmilie:

 

Edit; I guess I have to make it more understandable, I only see one posting me reputation, could be that it only show there if there is a comment, I don't know for sure.

So the fact that my reputation decreased to -261, and I have doubt that 261 persons did that in just a few hours that morning. I just want to know if I can rule you out,

so I can know sombody else did that, understand?

Edited October 27, 2010 by BuzyBat

[BuzyBat]

Nobody answers?

Edited October 28, 2010 by 159th_Viper
Edited for language.

[AlphaOneSix]

The person who gave you negative rep shows up in your User CP. If you only have one negative rep, and it's from 159th_Viper, then that means he has a lot of rep power. In other words, because Viper has so many posts, and such a high reputation, and joined a long time ago, whenever he gives good or bad rep to someone, it's adds or subtracts a lot more points to/from your rep level than if a newly registered person, with little rep, and few posts did it.

[BuzyBat]

OK, thanks, I didn't know that, will give me a hard time to give him back all those rep's then :)

( This works both ways, or just negative?)

Edited October 28, 2010 by BuzyBat

[RIPTIDE]

I tested out a Strela 10M. Dived from 30k feet (set the mission to start me at that height lol). At about 5km slant range on a 45 degree nose down, you get the lock and fire permission before the Strela fires. But you HAVE to immediately start pulling the nose up and egressing or else it'll fire back within a few seconds. From previous experience any other strategy that is less extreme will have the strela certainly firing as you gain lock.

 

Just wondering what range works in DCS: A-10C on a Strela with a Mav-D?

 

As for FC2 A-10A. You know what do to boys. IN cases where the seeker is locking everything around these units... the answer is simple. Let them lock onto whatever. And only when the Strela fires back do you flick the seeker back in the direction of the Strela, because NOW you know that you can get that lock without the struggle.

Edited October 29, 2010 by RIPTIDE