Shared Laser Code with A-10C

[bogusheadbox]

You would be surprised at how legit and useful achievements can be... even for a flight sim. For starters its implementation would require extra code to parse mission log information, thus paving the way for universal stats. They also hold a high value to developers who can look at the hard statistical data and learn more about their audiences gaming habits. Sales are one thing, but data on how players use the product is quite useful. I'm sure someone at ED has been curious of what percentage of players manually start up the aircraft vs using auto-start. The most powerful use is that they are mission independent goals for players to achieve. ED could use achievements to encourage players to learn new aspects of the sim, or to experience it differently.

 

If ED do care about such statistics, they can run a poll on the official websites to find out the necessary info.

 

Achievements are what they are by definition. Something you receive as a reward for completion of a certain task.

 

Therefore if you have a host of achievements, people will tend to move away from their way of play to earn this achievement.

 

Therefore the only purpose these serve is to give people a "look at what i can do" patch on their virtual log books which have no real value.

 

You could argue that virtual squads could use achievements for training purposes, however all squads i know have trainers in them that will manually sign you off when you have reached a level of competency anyway, so i don't see achievement being helpful to them as well.

 

As an example.

 

If buddy lasing works out to be very advantageous on the battlefield between 2 a-10's then people will work this out and start doing it. If its risky and time consuming then people may try it and then realise this and give it a miss.

 

Basically, its a sim. Therefore people will use whatever tactic and or teamplay they deem best for the situation weather it is or not. It is this factor of open play that will define the sim, not a list of "look at me sleeve patches"

 

What i am trying to say is,.......

 

People may try buddylasing, people may try to lone wolf it. Some people may wish to take out a Sam site with harsh words and hand gestures. In the end people will do WHAT THEY WANT, and achievements have nothing to do with this game play.

[ARM505]

Dunno on this one, I have mixed feelings....if it's 'achievements' like 'down a fighter in your A-10', then no thanks, thats lame. But if it's something akin to getting signed out on a particular system, and it was viewable online, or required for entry to a server...then maybe. You could then force a server full of people who you knew had a certain amount of systems knowledge, ie all online could reasonably be expected to know how to buddy lase, correctly use Mavs, or handoff/receive points via datalink for example. No excuses such as 'I don't know how', and no excuses not to be able to team up properly either. Something like that would have merit IMHO.

[bogusheadbox]

Dunno on this one, I have mixed feelings....if it's 'achievements' like 'down a fighter in your A-10', then no thanks, thats lame. But if it's something akin to getting signed out on a particular system, and it was viewable online, or required for entry to a server...then maybe. You could then force a server full of people who you knew had a certain amount of systems knowledge, ie all online could reasonably be expected to know how to buddy lase, correctly use Mavs, or handoff/receive points via datalink for example. No excuses such as 'I don't know how', and no excuses not to be able to team up properly either. Something like that would have merit IMHO.

 

I totally understand what you are saying. But in all honesty, you could have quite a lot of achievements for all the aspects of the A-10 in systems alone.

 

Do you think its fair for people who can do it, but have not done the achievement rating be denied access?

 

A single server may have requirements for lots of achievements and i can't help think that its wrong to make people drudge through all of the achievement getting (especially if they don't want to, but they know how to ) just to give them access to a certain server.

 

If you want people to abide by your certain SOP's, then you should start an online squad for like minded people who wish to have such SOP's

 

 

 

Now don't get me wrong. It does grind me when flying online (and i like to take it seriously) when other don't take it seriously. Especially in LOMAC where your Quake fighter jocks, take off from taxiways, lase or lock friendlies, drop flares over your head, attempt (quite often very poorly) acrobatics too close to your aircraft.

 

We can't really do much to stop them (and i am talking about the guys who get pleasure out of knowing they have ruined the experience for other people) and that is the unfortunate side to online gaming.

 

Achievements won't stop them either. Guaranteed they will have the achievement but what is to guarantee they will employ the method or tactics you want. They are individuals and will do what they like when they like regardless of their expertise, knowledge or achievements.

 

This is where online squads are a boon. If you want achievements, join an online squad who will check you out if you have the ability required, or train you to the ability required.

 

An online squad unlike an achievement system has the ability to control those in the game, by monitoring and punishing those that don't play with others nicely.

[Smokin Hole]

Actually, you are still making assumptions. ;)

 

True again. Actually forget the laser. Just give me the OH-58.

[26-J39]

C'mon ED already give Ka-50 to USA, and A-10C to Russia, why not to make shared laser as a separate option? :huh:

I think this is a great idea. The ability for rotary & fixed wing aircraft to have connectivity as suggested would be awesome, it would add so much more functionality to DCS and would only benefit ED and their customers.

This is a simulator after all...

Maybe replace the KA-50 skin with an AH-64D and then every1 is happy..:P

[Total]

On topic of shared lasers: I would like to see this. None of us knows if it would be actually possible due to the info being classified, but it could be used to great teamwork effectiveness in coop play.

 

Ont he topic of achievements:

 

I agree 100% on not having Qauke-airwars achievements. That would negate the prupose of the sim.

 

Let's take the KA-50. example: "Complete 10 successful manual start-up's of the Blackshark"

 

Now there's one that promotes learning the aircraft.

 

Let's bridge that over to the A-10C. example "Complete the campaign without ever getting show down."

 

OR

 

"Complete (mission name) 10 times without losing an aircraft in simulator server settings"

 

To get those achievements, players would have to fly smarter. I know I would feel a sense of accomplishment in getting ones liek those.

 

But those who think achievements will actually improve the teamwork atmosphere, I think that's a bit of a reach. It may for the period of the player getting that achievement, but alot of people either don't care about achievements or they revert to being a lone-wold smartass player once they get the achievement.

 

In the end, like all other flight sims (and ArmA), you either get lucky in a pub by having like-minded pilots in there with you, or you fly in a locked server with your buddies so nobody can screw it up.

[Grimes]

Within flight sims I've always thought achievements would be more used as an anecdotal form of stats. As a way to gauge how much relative time or what sort of actions a player ends up doing over a long period of time. Getting an achievement for 10,000 flight hours would be the sort of thing that fits into the genre. In terms of teamwork/weapons deployments... count the total times you have buddy lased or sent targeting data to a friendly human aircraft. Hell within the A-10C, setting your net group ID to some random number and having other players join it is a sign that you are trying to work together.

[Shaman]

There's no capability in RL to share laser between Ka-50 and A-10C! <snipped comment>

Edited November 7, 2010 by Panzertard

[Panzertard]

Allright, time to chill.

Back on topic - in a mature manner. You all have been warned.

[robmlufc]

I dont see an issue with wh and bs sharing codes in this sim, if the uk can fly a10s and sharks in this hyperthetical battlefield i imagine they would put an urgent upgrade in to make laser codes from both of their new types of aircraft to be compatible. :)

[Smokin Hole]

Well I fired up the Ka50 for the first time in a month. I wanted to see how fast I could designate a target, cover, and ERBL the location for a Lat/Long. It takes about a minute. This has the added benefit of not exposing the Ka50 during lasing. In other words I think our two worlds will exist happily (if unrealistically) laser or no laser.

 

I still think it's a cool idea. But now realize that life as we know it will continue without networked sharks and hogs.

[EtherealN]

For shared lasers, you really need to remember one thing: the A10C and the Ka-50 use way different methods of laser guidance. It's not just a question of wavelength, it goes as deep as the only common denominator being "it's monofrequency directed light emissions".

 

Ka-52 or Mi-28 might be another thing, but that's not the aircraft we are talking about.

 

As for giving aircraft to the "wrong" side for playability, that is one thing. That's the hypothetical scenario of "what if they had X too", with X being the simulated platform, but that does only take away from a sort of geopolitical simulation. Doing the lasing together would contradict the simulation of the actual platforms themselves, which makes it a lot more touchy (even barring programming constraints).

[robmlufc]

I agree it would be more of a multi player Easter egg. Could even let us strap a litening or sniper pod onto our sharks! :)

[GGTharos]

Uh, no.

[STP Dragon]

I think shared laser of Ka-50 and A-10C would be very good feature as an option. Some servers can turn it on, some - off.

But this would definitely connect both aircrafts together on one battlefield.

 

C'mon ED already give Ka-50 to USA, and A-10C to Russia, why not to make shared laser as a separate option? :huh:

:thumbup:

[EtherealN]

I agree it would be more of a multi player Easter egg. Could even let us strap a litening or sniper pod onto our sharks! :)

 

Strap it on? Sure. You can do that through a mod already.

...but just like in reality, it's role would be "rediculously expensive ballast".

 

Easter eggs are something else, as well - they're jokes hidden by individual programmers. If it is requested or implemented by design it is by definition NOT an easter egg. Eggs are what programmers do to retaliate on their bosses and designers for giving them unrealistic schedules. (Or just to have a laugh during a dreary day at the office.) ;)

 

For example:

Having the Holy Hand Grenade in Worms: not an egg. There by design.

Some contrived hidden way of getting a Holy Hand Grenade in Fallout: New Vegas: an egg.

Edited November 9, 2010 by EtherealN

[159th_Viper]

 

 

.......Guess work is not an option. While no synthetic simulation will ever be 100% accurate given the constraints of the PC platform, we strive to be as close to that as we can. Knowingly making educated guesses is again not an option. This level of detail is one of the primary hallmarks of the new DCS line of products and just one thing that separates it from the......

 

^^^^^^

Thankfully

 

 

The Ka-50 can definitely be utilized in an ABFAC role, ex Recon and plotting targets and then transmitting LAT/LONG co-ords to A10's for prosecution/Smoking the KZ etc etc, all the while keeping it real.

 

That's sufficient for me - no need for shared lasers......Might just end at Photon Torpedos if we're not careful :spam_laser:

[robmlufc]

Strap it on? Sure. You can do that through a mod already.

...but just like in reality, it's role would be "rediculously expensive ballast".

 

 

No ones asking for or expecting anything uber realistic with the laser codes. Just something to play with in multiplayer, clearly fighing a lost cause though! Smoke markers and coordinates over TS for spi's will be just as cool though.

[EtherealN]

No ones asking for or expecting anything uber realistic with the laser codes. Just something to play with in multiplayer, clearly fighing a lost cause though! Smoke markers and coordinates over TS for spi's will be just as cool though.

 

The problem is that you are asking for something that does two things:

 

1) Requires a lot of coding, meaning a lot of time and a lot of testing, meaning a lot of money.

2) Goes counter to the realism aspect.

 

The thing with airframes being available for the "wrong countries" did not need a lot of coding, and it was also very easy to "regulate" for server administrators - if you don't want an American Ka-50 pilot on your server, don't place one on your map. But since this goes into capabilities there has to be a lot of logic built into both the mission editor as well as the server software.

 

All this means is: it needs to translate into a lot of roubles to be worth doing, and enough people have to be happy about the development delays involved in adding features to the design documents at this point.

[Gaanalma]

Now we have CA, A-10C whit Laser code, Su-25T Whit laser set on 1013 but KA-50 have no possibility to lase or recive a lasing from other veicle!

 

ED Can provide simple 3 laser code for KA-50?

 

THX

[ShuRugal]

What's with all the gravedigs this week? Halloween was last month...

[BSS_Sniper]

I'm not seeing the problem with continuing this thread given the changes that have occurred since it started.

[zaelu]

Su-25T Whit laser set on 1013

 

:huh: What exactly is this meaning?

[Gaanalma]

What's with all the gravedigs this week? Halloween was last month...

 

Hahahaha... :megalol::holloween::clown_2::prop: you're not helping!

 

If you use laser code 1013 you can cooperate CA, A-10C and Su-25T together. Try it. You cant use Vihkr because beam-riding missile, but you can use S-25L or lasing whit Su-25T and hit whit A-10C Laser Weapons.

 

If we know the tre Laser code of the Ka-50, we can cooperate whit A-10C and CA operators. In the Ka-50 lua code I dont rescue laser code... I dont' Know where I can find it. I think Ka-50 have no Coded laser like A-10C, but if ED provide a NEW FEATURE for this old module (KA-50) I think AFAC tasks and coop mission become more engaging.

 

Perfect would be if within ME, you could even edit the three laser codes, for not having the same encodings on opposite sides.

Edited November 21, 2015 by Gaanalma

[zaelu]

Oh... laser code 1013 on CA or A-10C units is seen by Su-25T. Not vice-versa. Thx.