engine failure

[ATAG_chair1]

In the Mission titled "Train Ranger" my engine always dies after about 10 minutes of flight. Here is the Track of thaNew Track.rart mission.

[Buzpilot]

You should keep radiator and oil control on Automatic.

It took not long when oil reached 90 degree, it didn't move much above either. In Spitfire the manuals say up to 95, but not for long, and it's the same engine?

[EinsteinEP]

That's a puzzler, Chair. I see that you're using more manifold pressure than RPM, which isn't good for a real engine, and your oil temp redlines for a bit, but when I take control of this track and just cruise moderately around the map, I also get the engine failure.

 

Seems like plenty of fuel, radiator settings correct, mission doesn't have any failure flags set, no system failure triggers...hmm....

[Yo-Yo]

The point is that in current open beta the engine can seize only if magneto is damaged or failure flag for engine jam is set. What is the kind of failure:

prop runs at the rpm you set (if the IAS is sufficient) but engine does not fire?

Prop stops immediately

Prop seems to be braked (rpm drop)?

 

By the way, is your fuel pumps OK?

[Yo-Yo]

I really hope, some of updates will fix engine because now its simulated at very basic level compared to the other P-51 sim. At the other side flight model is great.

 

The engine is simulated at the level that is common for the DCS projects since Ka-50. It means TRUE THERMODYNAMICS model. Just note how MP behaves at various conditions. For start-up and shut-down conditions the second detailed model is used that calculates each cylinder (try to start engine with throttle advanced more than 1 inch - 1 half or more).

The point is that its damages are WIP, the subsystems like oil system WAS WIP in the public beta, etc, etc.

[TurboHog]

The engine is simulated at the level that is common for the DCS projects since Ka-50. It means TRUE THERMODYNAMICS model. Just note how MP behaves at various conditions. For start-up and shut-down conditions the second detailed model is used that calculates each cylinder (try to start engine with throttle advanced more than 1 inch - 1 half or more).

The point is that its damages are WIP, the subsystems like oil system WAS WIP in the public beta, etc, etc.

 

Yo-Yo, is that damage model WIP also the answer to my problems with the engine and governor? Or is it realistic to have certain engine problems after you have been hit by one 14.5mm or 23mm bullet? It is almost (80%) certain that my engine will die after I hear that I've been hit one time... Futhermore, there is no feedback whatsoever in the single player event log.

 

Enjoying this sim nontheless and I love the engine model and how everything is calculated in DCS, instead of written down in a .cfg or .air file!

[TwoLate]

Same thing here after 3 tries. Fourth try did heat management and all was fine. Had to watch the temps real close.

[sobek]

Or is it realistic to have certain engine problems after you have been hit by one 14.5mm or 23mm bullet?

 

Watercooled inline engines are not particularly resiliant to weapon damage, so you should definately be ready for your engine to die of it receives a direct hit from heavy mg or even cannon calibers. That being said, the damage model is surely going to receive some more attention.

[Yo-Yo]

Yo-Yo, is that damage model WIP also the answer to my problems with the engine and governor? Or is it realistic to have certain engine problems after you have been hit by one 14.5mm or 23mm bullet? It is almost (80%) certain that my engine will die after I hear that I've been hit one time... Futhermore, there is no feedback whatsoever in the single player event log.

 

Enjoying this sim nontheless and I love the engine model and how everything is calculated in DCS, instead of written down in a .cfg or .air file!

 

Are you sure it was only one hit? And even if it was only one - imagine the engine MP regulator. It's a relatively large volume at the rear end of the engine. If it's API then any small touch and case perforation can kill the device: aneroid, servopiston, air channels, linkages, levers they all are very vulnerable.

HE 23 mm can make it inoperative even if fragments hit it.

 

By the way, 14.5 mm KPVT bullet was initailly designed as an ammo for Soviet anti-tank rifle.

 

If you begin a duel with ZU-23 be ready that your engine will be perforated from prop hub to the MP regulator with only one AP shell...

 

Anyway, as I am testing DM now I can say that the plane does not lose MP regulator or prop governor being hit with 12.7 mm.

 

The issue, I see now, is that visual damages do not fit real damage level.

 

But it's not a problem... imagine the large area engine water cooling channels around ciylinders placed at. Add the coolant tank, radiators and you will be scared knowing that only one bullet can quit your mission. This failures are under construction now.

Edited August 7, 2012 by Yo-Yo

[TurboHog]

Watercooled inline engines are not particularly resiliant to weapon damage, so you should definately be ready for your engine to die of it receives a direct hit from heavy mg or even cannon calibers. That being said, the damage model is surely going to receive some more attention.

 

Maybe I'm too spoilt by the KA-50 and A10C with their modern engines in relatively safe positions.

 

Still though, the amount of times that I had to emergency land or discontinue the fight after hearing one hit sound seems unrealisticly high.

[Yo-Yo]

Maybe I'm too spoilt by the KA-50 and A10C with their modern engines in relatively safe positions.

 

Still though, the amount of times that I had to emergency land or discontinue the fight after hearing one hit sound seems unrealisticly high.

 

Anyway, the balance must be achieved.

[sam777777]

I've got the opposite problem, even by closing the radiators and forcing the engine *way* off the charts (in temperature) nothing happens. Fast forward 10-20minutes.. no change.

[sobek]

I've got the opposite problem, even by closing the radiators and forcing the engine *way* off the charts (in temperature) nothing happens. Fast forward 10-20minutes.. no change.

 

WIP, please wait for the next version. I think you will discover ample ways in which to harm your engine, voluntarily or not. ;)

[TurboHog]

I've got the opposite problem, even by closing the radiators and forcing the engine *way* off the charts (in temperature) nothing happens. Fast forward 10-20minutes.. no change.

 

There are numerous factors involved...

 

When you are in a dogfight, 61MP is no exception while the speed and hence the airflow through the scoop is quite low. Within 15 minutes your engine will die...

 

If you fly forward and pick up a lot of speed, the radiators are more effectively cooled and you will notice that you can maintain 61MP for a longer period of time.

 

Outside air temperature is also a factor.

 

In 1.2.0 I tried killing my engine by flying with war power at slow speeds and it works. Closing the shutters in this case will kill your engines even faster.

[Ali Fish]

WIP, please wait for the next version. I think you will discover ample ways in which to harm your engine, voluntarily or not. ;)

 

yes, this is what iam awaiting \o/

[cichlidfan]

In 1.2.0 I tried killing my engine by flying with war power at slow speeds and it works.

 

WEP is not implimented yet. ;)

[sam777777]

Ah, good to know it's still WIP in that respect. I thought I'd set up the options wrong! Flew for 20-30 minutes in fast forward with all the shutters closed. Everything went off the charts but it flew fine!

 

 

Can't wait for all the little engine doohickeys to be figured out, so that we have to master not just the airframe but the beast that powers it.

[TurboHog]

Ah, good to know it's still WIP in that respect. I thought I'd set up the options wrong! Flew for 20-30 minutes in fast forward with all the shutters closed. Everything went off the charts but it flew fine!

 

 

Can't wait for all the little engine doohickeys to be figured out, so that we have to master not just the airframe but the beast that powers it.

 

As I said. Do some high power, low speed flying. Fast forward ensures optimal cooling. The consequences of engine overheat are already implemented.

[Yo-Yo]

Are you going to simulate oil thickness? How oil affects engine temperature in DCS P-51? How oil thickness affects piston movement? How fuel mixture affects cylinder head temperature?

 

1) It's done already

2) I do not understand the point of a question - "how oil affects engine temperature" - what does it mean?

3) As it must affect. The problem is that you have no mean to change mixture strength to check it... the only thing you can use is to switch to Emer. Full Rich when at the altitude. Not too high to have rough or stopped engine though.

[Echo38]

I do not understand the point of a question - "how oil affects engine temperature" - what does it mean?

It's a sentence fragment which is meant to be assumed as a continuation of the last one. So, the full sentence would be, "Are you going to simulate how oil affects engine temperature in DCS: P-51?"

[26-J39]

1) "how oil affects engine temperature" - what does it mean?

 

I propose the question is related to the effect of engine performance compared to oil temp... Fair question I think.

 

Oil is ALWAYS "part" of the cooling system in any combustion engine which should be considered, & well I doubt ED hasn't.. :)

 

Anyhoo beta here more to come :thumbup:

[Yo-Yo]

It's a sentence fragment which is meant to be assumed as a continuation of the last one. So, the full sentence would be, "Are you going to simulate how oil affects engine temperature in DCS: P-51?"

 

I can understand even truncated grammar but the physical sense of the question is still enigma for me.

 

The first part of the enigma is WHAT ENGINE TEMPERATURE DID HE MEAN? There are no gauge to measure "Engine temperature" in general. The gauges measure fluids temperature, air temperature, etc in different locations.

 

THe second part of the enigma is how oil itself can affect temperature. Oil quantity? Oil viscosity?

 

If the question was "How does oil temperature affect engine performance? I would say that in the current version it affects as it must.

[Echo38]

If the question was "How does oil temperature affect engine performance? I would say that in the current version it affects as it must.

 

Given the excellent level of fidelity that I've seen so far in A-10C, I believe you. : )

[tusler]

it is absolutely incredible that these discussions are taking place about a computer simulation being run on a store bought personal computer...WOW:thumbup:

Don't loose the awe :D

[cichlidfan]

it is absolutely incredible that these discussions are taking place about a computer simulation being run on a store bought personal computer...WOW:thumbup:

Don't loose the awe :D

 

That is one of the nice things about being 'older' my sense of awe at what we do here is really strong. Hell, some days my phone amazes me!! ;)