Map use and airports...

[flyinfriend]

Hi,

 

I was flying a Ka-50 mission last night and had my first look at the map (f10) that shows all of the unit locations and airports. Two questions, the first is do most of you use the map during the battle or do you rely on visual recognition of the enemy. The second question is I was looking for some place to rearm and only saw airports that were listed as neutral or American. I flew to the American airport to see if I would be attacked. I wasn't. If I go to a neutral airport will I be rearmed there?

 

Oh, one last question, on the map there was a target bullseye. What is the purpose of that? It was located over a body of land locked water.

 

Thanks for any tips.

[Fishbreath]

The bullseye marks a location called bullseye—militaries frequently give radio calls with a bearing and range from bullseye rather than from a specific platform.

 

The mission maker has to set an airfield to your coalition for you to be able to rearm there.

[Rongor]

Personally I never use the F10 Map for "cheating" awareness of enemy units. But of course military has equipment out there to present exaxtly this feature, like the SADL in the A-10C. Of course I am using the A-10Cs SADL. But I dont use anything that it isnt implemented into the modules.

 

You can get all the service at friendly airfields (and FARPs) only. I think you can at least refuel and maybe even repair at neutral fields. Hostile facilities wont service you. Of course, as long as no hostile unit is located there at the time you appear, no one will attack you as the place is vacated.

[flyinfriend]

Thanks for the replies!

 

I was thinking the f10 map would be kind of cheating but wasn't sure if something similar would be available to the pilot in real life.

 

Thanks for the info on the target/bullseye, that explains all the radio calls coming in from other pilots. I'll try the neutral airports to see if they will rearm and refuel me next time.

[Yurgon]

I was thinking the f10 map would be kind of cheating but wasn't sure if something similar would be available to the pilot in real life.

 

In-flight: Nope. On the other hand, people talk to each other in Real Life, something that DCS hardly simulates. I think in many missions the pilot's preparation for the battlefield is too "shallow". We're often thrown into some kind of rapidly developing situation with hardly any clues on what to do. If we miss a simulated radio call or text message, we can't call the other guy to repeat or clarify.

 

That's why I don't consider it cheating to take a look at the F10 map and get a little bit of situational awareness. It depends on the mission, though. In good, well designed missions with good briefings and clear, precise instructions, I don't use the F10 map because I don't need it.

 

With the "fog of war" option enabled, only enemies that have been spotted by friendly units are shown on the map. I think this option is a very good choice to compensate for a lack of situational awareness. Another reason would be if there's a tanker but I can't find it because the mission designer didn't have the tanker transmit over TACAN or didn't supply the channel. Without AWACS, how could I find the tanker unless I used the map?

 

Besides, A-10A pilots used to carry actual maps in their aircraft, they read them while flying. If you set the map so that it doesn't show any units, it would be almost the same as it was like for Hog drivers not so long ago.

 

(Do they still have actual maps in the cockpit? Not sure about that.)

 

TL;DR: I think it's a matter of personal opinion whether the F10 map is considered "cheating" or just a compensation for a lack of situational awareness.

 

Edit: Huh, I thought this was posted in the A-10C forum. Anyways, it's basically the same for Black Shark. :)

Edited January 13, 2014 by Yurgon

[BitMaster]

Hey,

 

I think it really depends on how the mission is designed and how well the briefing instructs the pilot.

 

Not using F10 when all others do it is a clear disadvantage, especially in a slow moving target like a Ka-50. Any other chopper can close on you and take you out like a sitting duck. So you better use F10 too and check if another KA sneaks up on you ( happened to me last night, 2nd time I was aware and took him out...haha. ). Since it was Eno's Testserver it was all ok and meant to be like this. More to True MP further down.

 

Using F10 to "cheat" a SP mission spoils your own fun.

 

Using F10 to somehow have some fun in the game cause you are still learning DCS is OK.

 

HC-MP

Enabling "everybody sees everything" in a true Hard Core MP is a crime and spoils the fun for all imho.

Especially slow moving units suffer from giving away their position a lot.

 

 

Bit

[flyinfriend]

Thanks again for the replies guys. All very helpful. I'm learning Balck Shark, well at least the battling aspect of it so I won't feel so bad about peaking occasionally. :)

[DieHard]

Hi,

 

I was flying a Ka-50 mission last night and had my first look at the map (f10) that shows all of the unit locations and airports. Two questions, the first is do most of you use the map during the battle or do you rely on visual recognition of the enemy. The second question is I was looking for some place to rearm and only saw airports that were listed as neutral or American. I flew to the American airport to see if I would be attacked. I wasn't. If I go to a neutral airport will I be rearmed there?

 

Oh, one last question, on the map there was a target bullseye. What is the purpose of that? It was located over a body of land locked water.

 

Thanks for any tips.

 

In Multiplayer, some of the better squads' servers, their maps don't allow use of the F10 map except to use it as a "knee-board" type map and you plot your own moves by supplied AWAC or fellow team-mate and use longitude/latitude coordinates or similar directions. Your helicopter or aircraft's position on the map is not even shown. And of course all you have for views is F1.

 

The Ka-50 has the advantage of using the Data Link Control Panel with the ABRIS specific to your 4-man flight (page 11-7 in DCS Ka-50 flight manual book). There are other methods to locate the enemy and plot their location using the ABRIS. What to do when the ABRIS screen goes blank from damage? LOL! Pay attention to your surroundings and your flight to the AO and hope the fog is light on RTB. I have learned over time to rely as much on my analog flight instruments as my digital displays.

 

The Multiplayer squads' servers I like to use where the F10 map is not used are the 104th Phoenix, the 159th, and sometimes the S77th. I think there are a few other servers out there, too.

 

I use whatever means to play the war sim, if it is available. I have not played much in Single Player. I do not mod the game except what the 104th requires as an anti-cheat mod.

 

Rearming, refueling and repair with the Shark is usually my home base where I took off from and one or two friendly FARPs or the FARP I took off from and my alternates. One guy the other night vulched my FARP with an enemy manned ground unit and he did not open up on me until I was almost landed, low and slow; I did not expect that, that far back, so buyer beware.

 

Fun game.

Edited January 21, 2014 by DieHard

[ShuRugal]

In-flight: Nope. On the other hand, people talk to each other in Real Life, something that DCS hardly simulates. I think in many missions the pilot's preparation for the battlefield is too "shallow". We're often thrown into some kind of rapidly developing situation with hardly any clues on what to do. If we miss a simulated radio call or text message, we can't call the other guy to repeat or clarify.

 

This. I was just chatting about this the other night with one of the guys on the SimHQ servers. IRL, a pilot would NEVER go into a CAS or Ground Attack mission with the level of information we have (or rather, don't have) in 99% of DCS missions.

 

For ground attack, the briefing should tell the pilot in fairly specific terms where the target is expected to be and what other units are in the area. If the target is a fixed facility, then its exact location will be known, best route of ingress plotted out, and every unit in the area which is known about listed in the brief.

 

For CAS, the exact location of friendlies should be known, and the relative position of the hostiles (or at the very least, potential positions) should be included as well. Once the pilot gets on station, there will be a FAC to talk him on target, alert him to potential anti-air threats, etc etc. Basically, in a CAS mission, the pilot should be in continuous contact with someone who is eyes-on with the ground situation.

 

In BOTH types of missions, if enemy AD is suspected, a SEAD package will accompany the strike/CAS package to clear a safe route in/out.

 

 

In DCS, all of these things are possible, but they are seldom implemented and almost never coordinated. In DCS, we go into the fight with an almost complete vacuum of information. We frequently have to be our own recon, SEAD, AFAC, and CAP all at once. Couple this with the truly terrible navigation aides in some of the aircraft, and it becomes almost imperative to at least use the F-10 map on the ground to get oriented to the situation at hand. Otherwise all you can do is do recon-by-fire and hope you find them before they kill you.

[HiJack]

So basicly "fog of war" is not that unrealistic at all. That's what i'm been using in my latest MP server missions. The missions also support a small amount of CA playable units that can act as JTAC. I think this adds a good possibility on public servers to be "more realistic".