Callsign JoNay

We did some milti crew flights in my virtual wing lately and noticed some unexpected behavior with the XMTR SEL switch in the RIO seat. Toggling it seems to affect which radio(s) the driver is xmiting on in SRS. My understanding was that the driver has two dedicated buttons for comms, one button for the 159 and one for the 182, and can xmit on either of them on the fly as he chooses. The RIO has the right foot/pedal switch to xmit on on either the 159 or 182 depending on how the XMTR SEL is toggled, but that switch shouldn't have any effect on the driver's radio choice. Currently if the RIO toggles to "both" for example, the driver will xmit on both the 159 and 182 even if he only keyed the HOTAS control for one radio. The XMTR SEL Switch also seems to be affecting the in game comms menus. The driver will have difficulty choosing comms options for tankers/AWACS/mother if the RIO has the XMTR SEL switch set in a conflicting way. Is the XMTR SEL switch functioning correctly?

Ground handling improvement? Yes please.

Yes, we all fly with flood lights off, but that doesn't mean they never come on to help find some switch or dial that isn't backlit, especially in the RIO seat. I'm using the flashlight a lot more than I want to ever since the Oct patch. Glad to hear that fixing it is a priority.

Thank goodness. The current AP is . An overhaul is music to my ears.

Yes, and some fixes to the internal lighting would've been nice.

Here's one of my fav videos of DLC in action. Some barely touch it, others are using it a lot.

Minimum activity requirement is to participate in at least one event per month. Exceptions can be made if a member has a temporary real life challenge that keeps them away longer, but at least once per month should be the target.

A fun match from our bi-weekly BFM/DACT/ACM event: Sunday Showdown Still accepting recruits for all airframes listed above.

That's assuming the Tacview is accurate. I've seen TV make mistakes before, and Mover and Gonky were also playing over multiplayer, no? Funny things can happen in MP to keep things synced up for both parties. I don't fly the Viper anymore, or have time to do it, but it would be worth testing to see if you guys can get 30 AOA in single player, record a track, and send it to BN or 9L.

I was honestly wondering the same exact thing because I haven't felt it recently. Maybe we just got used to it?

I hope by this point HB has realized there's some configuration/weight issues that need to be addressed, and maybe we can leave it in their hands to fix since they undoubtedly have tools at their disposal to squash bugs better than we can. My concern was that they were dumping time/effort into perfecting the FM before they had the foundational weights nailed down and bug free. If they weren't already aware of the inconsistent weight issues and missing phoenix pylon weight, hopefully they are by now and can rectify those things without having to take their FM progress back to square one.

Yeah, something hella-weird is happening with the weights. I'm not seeing the same thing you are, but I tested the following clean loadouts (no phoenix pylons or missiles). Aircraft #1: 54000 lbs in ME with empty XTs = ~130 kts Aircraft #2: 54000 lbs in ME with full XTs= ~130 kts Aircraft #3: 54000 lbs in ME no XTs= ~133-135 kts According to the chart the weights are actually more like: Aircraft #1: 48000 lbs Aircraft #2: 48000 lbs Aircraft #3: 49000 lbs I think HB needs to prioritize reviewing the weights of the stores, XTs, and pylons before doing too much more to the flight model. These results are all over the place. "Swerved into something" indeed.

@Victory205 Same missile loadouts without the XTs: Fuel quantity the same as before. I didn't adjust it since the tanks are only around 250 lb each, so the overall gross weight should still be between 53-54k. Speeds were all as expected, between 137-138 kts. Still not seeing any weird behavior with XTs on my end, maybe it's only an A-model thing.

Not yet, but I'll try when I get some time.

Weird, I didn't get any of those empty fuel tank weight discrepancies int my tests last night. I tried three missile configs, all with external tanks (empty), all tested with boost this time ), and I adjusted the fuel slider until I had a gross weight right around 54,000 as per the ME. All three tests produced an on speed of 138-139 kts, which is consistent with around 54K lbs in the natops chart. As I mentioned, the only problem I'm seeing is the lack of weight from the phoenix pylons. The 4x2x2 loadout should've weighed more like 56,000 lbs, but I got the same speed as if I was 54,000. Miz attached. AOA Weight Test.miz

I had empty fuel tanks, yes. I didn't notice anything out of the norm. I'll check again. @Victory205 @sLYFa Are you guys testing A or B? I've only been testing B.

I concur. I got some time tonight and tested 1x4x3, 2x3x2, and 4x2x2. Speeds match the chart except for the 4x2x2 loadout which was about 4 kts slower than it should've been if the phoenix rails had proper weight to them. If Victory is trying to hint at something else wrong with the missile weights, I'm not seeing what it is.

"You've swerved into something..." Interesting. Ok I will take a look when able.

@Victory205 -I do my best to fly within the G-limits and speed limits that I know of. -I used auto throttle because I thought it would produce a more scientific test result. I'd be happy to fly it again with boost if you want me to. -I don't have time to AOA test missile weights today, and maybe not tomorrow, I have work and RL commitments for the next little while. Is there a specific configuration you want me to test?

Well not with that attitude, it won't. (Kidding) I disagree that ~2000 lbs of phoenix rails don't matter. As of now we are able to recover with two AIM-54s worth of extra fuel than we should be able to if attempting to respect the 54,000 lb max trap weight, and we also get the benefits of the performance/handling of -2000 lbs around the boat too.

Empty weight displayed in the ME is 44,040. So it's 340-890 lbs heavier than the empty weights I'm calculating in the AOA tests. The irritating part about it to me is I don't know if we're flying a 43,150 lb fighter that flies like a 43,150 lb fighter even though it's listed as a 44,040 lb fighter in the ME, or if we're flying a 44,040 lb fighter that has lift/thrust/drag values that make it perform like a 43,150 lb fighter. Know what I mean? I guess at that point it might not matter in a performance sense, but for those who are trying to calculate proper max recovery weights in the sim there is a 340-890 lb question mark on how to go about it. Yes, it's a video game, but we are nerds and like to get it right. It would be nice if HB could just tell us what's going on so we know for sure, but I've made enough noise about this so I'll stop asking. The lack of weight of the phoenix pylons and fairings is the biggest mystery, and seems like a relatively easy correction to make. The drag may be marginal since they are between the nacelles and have streamlined fairings to smooth the air friction, but they add up to ~2200 lbs, which is not nothing. We're talking about the equivalent weight of a GBU-10. Edited: Fixed some math errors.

Thanks. Ok so some updates numbers based on your chart: Aircraft #1 and #2, (135 kts), from my test both weigh 51,250, minus 8100 lbs fuel, for empty weight of 43,150 lbs. Aircraft #3, (139 kts), from my test weighs 54,000, minus 10,300 lbs fuel, for an empty weight of 43,700 lbs. So, it's still carrying that 550 lbs of mystery weight if I go by the natops AOA chart. Any idea where that's coming from? Am I performing my test at the wrong pressure, temp, altitude, wind speed, etc? Is there something I'm not considering? Or is it just a case of a WIP flight model? And you're suggesting Phoenix pylons fall into the ordnance category controlled by ED? So I should be bugging them instead?

I thought the chart I posted was from the F-14B Natops. Maybe I referenced the wrong page. Would be nice if someone from HB just told us specifically how much our tomcats weigh instead of leaving it up to user tests like these that include margin for error. And also if/when the weight/drag of the Phoenix rails will be implemented soon, or at least touch on whatever challenge they're having that is preventing them from doing it.

Thanks for the idea. Tested with results below. Aircraft #1 - Phoenix Pylons + 8,100 lbs Fuel Aircraft #2 - No Phoenix Pylons + 8,100 lbs Fuel Aircraft #3 - No Phoenix Pylons + 10,300 lbs Fuel (10,300 lbs fuel weight chosen to approximate the weight of IRL phoenix pylons and fairings, 8,100 + 2,200). -No wind. -Gun ammo removed. -Unlimited fuel option checked. -All drag indexes + Neutral DLC. -Speed indication pulled from external view screen. Aircraft #1: 135 kts = 51,000 lbs - 8,100 fuel = 42,900 lbs empty w/ phoenix pylons Aircraft #2: 135 kts = 51,000 lbs - 8,100 fuel = 42,900 lbs empty weight w/o phoenix pylons Aircraft #3: 139 kts = 53,750 lbs - 10,300 fuel = 43,450 lbs empty weight w/o phoenix pylons You're right, the results are interesting. It appears the empty weight is between 42,900-43,450. Not sure where the extra 550 lbs is coming from on aircraft #3. I ran the test twice and got the same results both times. I wonder why the Mission Editor lists an empty weight of 44,040? Both my tests seem to indicate that the phoenix pylons and fairings add no weight to the empty weight of the aircraft, which is unfortunate. I've also attached my miz file in case anyone wants to inspect it for mistakes, or try the test for themselves. Here's a video of me testing: AOA Weight Test.miz

Bumping this now that the recent firestorm has died down. Can anyone from HB comment on what's going on with the Phoenix pylons, or tell us how much our Tomcat actually weighs?