DCS: AJS-37 Viggen Discussion

The AJS-37 only carries Sidewinders. No Skyflashes or AMRAAMs.

Sorry, I did not know what variant exactly they are working on. Is AJS variant confirmed from LN? Everything *could* be subject to change :smilewink:

Regarding the "IR-RB FRAMSTEGN" switch... Normally it is the missile on the left side that is the first to be fired. With this switch you can select another missile.

Sorry, I did not know what variant exactly they are working on. Is AJS variant confirmed from LN? Everything *could* be subject to change :smilewink:

Yes. The leak that revealed the Viggen specified that it was the AJS-37.

Another interesting detail is that the autopilot was engaged when RB05 missiles was fired - which makes sence since the pilot must use the right hand to control the missile.

The pilot training program included 1000 attacks in a simulator during a short period and then the skill was maintained with few simulated attacks per month.

Before shooting with a live missile there had to be a training in the SK61 trainer with a couple of RB 53 Bantam missiles - which might be considered odd since that plane is a lot slower. But the firing distance and speed was divided by a factor of five, so it was quite realistic in the end (beeing scaled down).

Saab developed a TV-guided version, RB 05b, but that was rejected by the Swedish air force in favor for the Maverick.

120kg bomb m/71 Virgo could be configured with different fuzes and also a drag chute.

AJS37 with 2 RB74 (AIM-9L) and 4 RB24J (AIM-9J).

The outer pylons (that became operational with the AJS upgrade) was intended for the RB28 Falcon missiles. The RB28 was also a IR missile but with longer range (than the Sidewinder) and better suited for high altitude. It was originally procured for the J35 Draken and license built by Saab.

The seeker had a much longer preparation time (cooling) and was later regarded as not to be used on the AJ37, rendering the outer pylons unused.

Weapons options for the AJS37 (missing in the picture is the BK90).

On the far left and right is the counter measure pods.

Then you have the RB15F anti ship missiles, rocket pods (6*13.5cm hard or soft target warheads), 30mm gunpods (150 rounds), RB75 (Maverick), bombs and illumination bombs, RB74 and RB24J.

By the way - Swedish missile designations are odd numbers for A-G and even numbers for A-A.

Reading through the manual I am a bit amazed of how complex and advanced this aircraft is (for its time of development and active duty). Assuming that LNS really is building this module they will have a lot of systems to simulate.

Both weapons and navigation systems are probably giving them a hard time right now...

Some more little examples of nice features.

The fuel gauge has two needles, one for remaining fuel quantity and one that is showing (calculated) needed fuel amount for the remaining waypoints and landing.

You can use the after burner in reverse thrust mode, however not recomended since that might cause damages :music_whistling:

The navigation system can be continously updated with the current postion from manual radar or optical fixes in order to make it more accurate.

The ejection seat is equiped with a ultrasonic ping device that starts to transmit when in contact with water (for rescue party homing).

The landing gear handle has electro mechanical locks that is controlled by throttle position and speed (prohibiting the gears from being lowered or raised during certain conditions).

The engine has an automatic restart function in case of flame out.

The reverse thruster can be initiated before touch down so it is automatically triggered. There is a sensor in the right landing gear that starts the process (the nozzle and reverse "flaps" starts to move to 2/3 position) and if the nose gear isn't depressed within a specific time (one second) the process is aborted and the nozzle moves back to original position. When the nose wheel is depressed there is a 30 second time relay holding the reverse thuster active even if the nose wheel isn't depressed fully all the time. If the main gear is not depressed anymore the reverse thrust is immediately aborted.

When the speed is below 130 km/h the indicator light "REV AVDR" is lit to remind the pilot of de-activate the reverse thrust before the jet wash is sucked in to the air inlet.

The reverse thrust is de-activated by pushing in the reverse thrust handle.

There are some electrical test and safety functions indicating errors like "EJ REV" (no reverse) in the annuncicator panel if the nozzle isn't working properly etc.

There is also a system checking if the gear switches are ok or not, and if there is a problem you get the "FÖRV FÖRBJ" indication which means that it is forbidden to pre-activate the reverse thruster - since that could activate it mid air.

Yeah, there's a lot of interesting quirks. In some ways (but not in others) the aircraft seems surprisingly ergonomic and user-friendly for its time. The fuel gauge is one example. On a lot of aircraft you get a display in kg/lbs in various tanks and everything else you get to figure out yourself, but here it's one single percentage meter that works both with and without the drop tank, and that also tells you if you're gonna have to turn back early or not. There are no manual flaps either, instead the canard flap setting is automatically adjusted depending on the landing gear position and the aircraft weight.

Data input and output for things like setting the targeting data for the BK90 or waypoint data for the Rb 15F on the other hand is amazingly primitive. You get a number keypad, a LED display with six digits, an in/out selector and a knob which selects what system you want to work with. Better remember all those six-digit codes you might need!

There's also a number of hilarious Sweden-specific "optimizations", especially in the navigation system - it really shows that the aircraft was only ever intended to be used in Sweden, or at least not outside Europe. For example, you can enter latitude and longitude into the nav system in any order, because longitude must be <40° while latitude must be >40° but <90°. Don't try going east of Yaroslavl or south of Madrid or the nav system will freak out! The nav system also comes pre-loaded with coordinates and "shortcuts" for all major Swedish bases so you don't need to punch in lat/long for those.

it really shows that the aircraft was only ever intended to be used in Sweden, or at least not outside Europe. For example, you can enter latitude and longitude into the nav system in any order, because longitude must be <40° while latitude must be >40° but <90°. Don't try going east of Yaroslavl or south of Madrid or the nav system will freak out! The nav system also comes pre-loaded with coordinates and "shortcuts" for all major Swedish bases so you don't need to punch in lat/long for those.

I wonder how that will work in DCS. :music_whistling:

Yeah, there's a lot of interesting quirks. In some ways (but not in others) the aircraft seems surprisingly ergonomic and user-friendly for its time. The fuel gauge is one example. On a lot of aircraft you get a display in kg/lbs in various tanks and everything else you get to figure out yourself, but here it's one single percentage meter that works both with and without the drop tank, and that also tells you if you're gonna have to turn back early or not. There are no manual flaps either, instead the canard flap setting is automatically adjusted depending on the landing gear position and the aircraft weight.

 

Data input and output for things like setting the targeting data for the BK90 or waypoint data for the Rb 15F on the other hand is amazingly primitive. You get a number keypad, a LED display with six digits, an in/out selector and a knob which selects what system you want to work with. Better remember all those six-digit codes you might need!

 

There's also a number of hilarious Sweden-specific "optimizations", especially in the navigation system - it really shows that the aircraft was only ever intended to be used in Sweden, or at least not outside Europe. For example, you can enter latitude and longitude into the nav system in any order, because longitude must be <40° while latitude must be >40° but <90°. Don't try going east of Yaroslavl or south of Madrid or the nav system will freak out! The nav system also comes pre-loaded with coordinates and "shortcuts" for all major Swedish bases so you don't need to punch in lat/long for those.

Flying in the NTTR may necessitate use of the backup Nav system. I understand it is based on the 'inked cellulose' data storage system and a glucose fueled organic processor, same as in the MiG-21 :D.

I wonder how that will work in DCS. :music_whistling:

As long as LNS provide a Swedish map I don't care about navigation in the rest of the world :pilotfly:

As long as LNS provide a Swedish map I don't care about navigation in the rest of the world :pilotfly:

Viggens over the desert? Nah... Give me a Swedish map and I will be happy.

You guys that are activly reading the manual/know more then me. The M/70 135 mm rockets, can they be fired in low numbers per trigger press?

Flying in the NTTR may necessitate use of the backup Nav system. I understand it is based on the 'inked cellulose' data storage system and a glucose fueled organic processor, same as in the MiG-21 :D.

+1 :lol::megalol:

You guys that are activly reading the manual/know more then me. The M/70 135 mm rockets, can they be fired in low numbers per trigger press?

As far as I understand it, no. It's all or nothing. You _may_ be able to fire one pod at a time but I don't think so.

Flying in the NTTR may necessitate use of the backup Nav system. I understand it is based on the 'inked cellulose' data storage system and a glucose fueled organic processor, same as in the MiG-21 :D.

:pilotfly::book::doh::joystick::helpsmilie:

You guys that are activly reading the manual/know more then me. The M/70 135 mm rockets, can they be fired in low numbers per trigger press?

In the operative mode (normal, set prior to startup in the apparatus bay) the entire pod fires in 0.6 seconds, and all pods (4 maximum) fire at once (with a 50ms difference between the fuselage and wing pylons).

Makes for one big angry salvo.

The good old saying, "one pass, haul ass", comes to mind. :-)

Well the hit'n run doctrine didn't want you to stick around in the enemy surroundings anyway. We did the same thing as rangers - i.e a surprise attack with everything we got, then quick as hell away from the scene (and then come back again at another place from another direction...).

Speaking of big salvos, imagine a four group of Viggens with 4 BK90's each doing a coordinated attack on a landing party at a beach head :D

Well the hit'n run doctrine didn't want you to stick around in the enemy surroundings anyway. We did the same thing as rangers - i.e a surprise attack with everything we got, then quick as hell away from the scene (and then come back again at another place from another direction...).

 

Speaking of big salvos, imagine a four group of Viggens with 4 BK90's each doing a coordinated attack on a landing party at a beach head :D

That's a lot of hate and discontent on the bad guys!

Does anyone know if LN is also going to provide new ai models? Because I m reading about the Viggen and reading stories involving planes like SU-15, Mig 21 (not bis), saab 35 draken etc

As far as I know they planning a new map along with the plane, but I have not read anything about new ai models.

Does anyone know if LN is also going to provide new ai models? Because I m reading about the Viggen and reading stories involving planes like SU-15, Mig 21 (not bis), saab 35 draken etc

 

As far as I know they planning a new map along with the plane, but I have not read anything about new ai models.

I think they have said they will add an AI only JA-37 (fighter viggen)

Su 15 would be nice not really needed.

And the mig-21Bis is the most capable mig-21 variant (of factory standard)

And it also one of the most produced ones (being in production from 1972 untill 1985)

The mig-21Bis is also pretty much visually identical to the earlier third generation variants (Mig-21M,SM,MF) aswell as very similar to the generation two aircraft (Mig-21 PF,PFM,R,S variants)

the only mig-21s to be destinctly different visually is the first generation mig-21s (F,P-13,F-13)

So there is not really any need for a different factory mig21 variant since the current mig can "accuratly" simulate most older variants simply by changing the armament to fit the proper variant / age of mig-21 wished to simulate.

and of all mig-21 the AJ-37 would be likley to meet the would be second or third generations (with the Mig-21Bis Mig-21MF and Mig-21 PFM being the most likley ones)

And when it comes to the AJS-37 modeld it would most likley only have seen Polish Mig-21 Bis/MF variants since those where the only Mig-21s operating around the baltic sea (after 1992) since the Soviet Mig-21s where retired after the soviet brakeup.

And the Bis/mf variants are pretty close in capabilities (can use same weapons are visually identical etc)

I forgot the AJS is a post cold war plane....

Just learned (from the book previously mentioned) that there was some serious plans for selling the Viggen to other countries. Because of this there was a co-ownership between the Kungliga Flygförvaltningen* and SAAB of the prototype planes in order to have them displayed at several international air shows. due to some legal technicalities SAAB had to pay a huge insurance fee for some shows, if something would go wrong ;)

Also keep in mind that the Draken was exported to countries like Austria, Finland and Denmark. Denmark also had a custom made attack version.

* KFF, a Swedish government agency active from 1936 to 1968.