Wizard_03 Posted June 12, 2015 Posted June 12, 2015 Was wondering if anyone knew of either ED or any third party's plans to add more aircraft in the FC3 level of fidelity? Or is everyone moving in the direction of just adding full 'DCS' level models from now on. DCS F/A-18C :sorcerer:
pepin1234 Posted June 12, 2015 Posted June 12, 2015 I support this idea. I think FC3 level aircrafts is the best way to get modern aircraft with more capability. Also most of them are too hard to make in high fidelity level. It is the case of the Su-24M. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
whitehot Posted June 12, 2015 Posted June 12, 2015 If I had to express an ideal situation, I too would like to have FC3 level AC released, but it would be also very nice if the same modules would later be upgraded to full DCS, while keeping the option to buy only the FC3 level module. In that way, a customer would buy the FC3 level module, and decide, when it gets released, to upgrade to the DCS level one at reduced cost. This way DCS could make happy several kinds of customers, bsed both on their commitment to realism or their willingness to spend more money. Maybe this way there could be some erratic situation in multiplayer (folks having the same plane but with different difficulties), but I don't think that it would be anything beyond solving (mission designers can easily adapt their missions to said scheme, and game masters would pick mp missions on servers accordingly) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Intel i7 6700K @ 4.2, MSI M5 Z170A Gaming, NZXT X61 Kraken liquid cooler, PNY Nvidia GTX 1080 Founders Edition, 16GB Corsair Vengeance 3000 Mhz C15, samsung 840 evo SSD, CoolerMaster 1000W Gold rated PSU, NZXT Noctis 450 cabinet, Samsung S240SW 24' 1920x1200 LED panel, X-52 Pro Flight stick. W10 Pro x64 1809, NO antivirus EVER
will- Posted June 12, 2015 Posted June 12, 2015 http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=143832 Intel i9-9900K 32GB DDR4, RTX 2080tiftw3, Windows 10, 1tb 970 M2, TM Warthog, 4k 144hz HDR g-sync.
Wizard_03 Posted June 12, 2015 Author Posted June 12, 2015 Well the reason I ask, is that one the biggest roadblocks for devs making models is Classified data. For example obviously we could never have a DCS level F-22 simply because the publicly available data on it is not enough. That being said if you were too create FC3 models for aircraft like that (given not perfect representations) They could be fairly close like the F-15 and SU-27, Most aircraft flight data is available publicly with exceptions of course. but I don't think producing AFMs is really to much trouble, its more systems modeling and that makes DCS level tricky and time consuming. But if someone was to cut the losses and go for FC3 level, Then you could produce the model as accurate as possible and periodically update it with more features and improvements like what we have seen with the 15 and 27 DCS F/A-18C :sorcerer:
Stuge Posted June 13, 2015 Posted June 13, 2015 Right now, I would be happy even if DCS titles were released in the modern FC3 fidelity. How long has the Hawk had standard flight model? (ok it's beta but still..yuck) http://www.104thphoenix.com
Wizard_03 Posted June 13, 2015 Author Posted June 13, 2015 I'm just greedy lol :hehe: I want more things to blow stuff up with! DCS F/A-18C :sorcerer:
DarkFire Posted June 13, 2015 Posted June 13, 2015 I support this idea. I think FC3 level aircrafts is the best way to get modern aircraft with more capability. Also most of them are too hard to make in high fidelity level. It is the case of the Su-24M. I'd agree but I'm curious as to what the issue is with the Su-24M? Personally I'd love to see a true tactical bomber as opposed to the Su-25T. Having a Russian counterpart to the A-10 is great and the Su-25T is one of my favourites, but having an actual bomber would be awesome. Perhaps when the 2-seat code is mature... System Spec: Cooler Master Cosmos C700P Black Edition case. | AMD 5950X CPU | MSI RTX-3090 GPU | 32GB HyperX Predator PC4000 RAM | | TM Warthog stick & throttle | TrackIR 5 | Samsung 980 Pro NVMe 4 SSD 1TB (boot) | Samsung 870 QVO SSD 4TB (games) | Windows 10 Pro 64-bit. Personal wish list: DCS: Su-27SM & DCS: Avro Vulcan.
pepin1234 Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) I'd agree but I'm curious as to what the issue is with the Su-24M? Personally I'd love to see a true tactical bomber as opposed to the Su-25T. Having a Russian counterpart to the A-10 is great and the Su-25T is one of my favourites, but having an actual bomber would be awesome. Perhaps when the 2-seat code is mature... I guess the western counterpart for Su-25T in DCS is the A-10C. Even when The A-10C is a full simulated aircraft, they can do almost the same task. Now... The Su-24M is a bomber with much more range and anti-ship and laser bombing capability, things have not present with the 25T. The F-111 is the counterpart for Su-24M, but the F-111 is not close enough to compare with the Su-24M. So what I am thinking... If the F-18 is the next western fighter with high bombing capability, then the Su-24M could be a good idea. PD: The Su-24MR versión will be awesome. Taking pictures of the battlefield, recon-pods could be pretty interesting for enjoy a good simulation level. We need more fun. Hopping DCS World 2 engine bring us all those features Edited June 14, 2015 by pepin1234 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
DarkFire Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 I guess the western counterpart for Su-25T in DCS is the A-10C. Even when The A-10C is a full simulated aircraft, they can do almost the same task. Now... The Su-24M is a bomber with much more range and anti-ship and laser bombing capability, things have not present with the 25T. The F-111 is the counterpart for Su-24M, but the F-111 is not close enough to compare with the Su-24M. So what I am thinking... If the F-18 is the next western fighter with high bombing capability, then the Su-24M could be a good idea. PD: The Su-24MR versión will be awesome. Taking pictures of the battlefield, recon-pods could be pretty interesting for enjoy a good simulation level. We need more fun. Hopping DCS World 2 engine bring us all those features I'd forgotten about the coding work that ED is doing for the F-18. Ground radar! That and the 2-person cockpit code would be ideal for the Su24. I also agree that having a reconnaissance version would be great fun... System Spec: Cooler Master Cosmos C700P Black Edition case. | AMD 5950X CPU | MSI RTX-3090 GPU | 32GB HyperX Predator PC4000 RAM | | TM Warthog stick & throttle | TrackIR 5 | Samsung 980 Pro NVMe 4 SSD 1TB (boot) | Samsung 870 QVO SSD 4TB (games) | Windows 10 Pro 64-bit. Personal wish list: DCS: Su-27SM & DCS: Avro Vulcan.
Grigs Posted June 15, 2015 Posted June 15, 2015 Was wondering if anyone knew of either ED or any third party's plans to add more aircraft in the FC3 level of fidelity? Or is everyone moving in the direction of just adding full 'DCS' level models from now on. In FC3, every single aircraft is not at FC3 level yet. I think that the Mig-29 and Su-33 should be redone first =]
Wizard_03 Posted June 15, 2015 Author Posted June 15, 2015 In FC3, every single aircraft is not at FC3 level yet. I think that the Mig-29 and Su-33 should be redone first =] well of course! :D I just meant in the long run, if anyone had any plans to add more or is every new model going straight to DCS level. DCS F/A-18C :sorcerer:
whitehot Posted June 18, 2015 Posted June 18, 2015 I'd forgotten about the coding work that ED is doing for the F-18. Ground radar! That and the 2-person cockpit code would be ideal for the Su24. I also agree that having a reconnaissance version would be great fun... I remember surfing a site that described the nav-attack complex for the su-24M - nice stuff. The system has a mode by which the radar contacts are placed on a synthetic map of the battlefield, something like abris (with an older display), but with the ability to generate a real-time tactical picture of the scanned area. I had seen something like that, but in larger scale, only on usaf JSTARS aircraft. Anyway, a Fencer would make a really nice module, which would introduce also the ability for us to employ many of the weapons that are still confined to AI use in dcs (The tv-guided cruise missiles like the Kingbolt, the KAB series lgbs and the AS-17 asm, just to name some). Yet it remains to be seen if ed or anybody else would consider such aircraft interesting from a commercial point of view.. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Intel i7 6700K @ 4.2, MSI M5 Z170A Gaming, NZXT X61 Kraken liquid cooler, PNY Nvidia GTX 1080 Founders Edition, 16GB Corsair Vengeance 3000 Mhz C15, samsung 840 evo SSD, CoolerMaster 1000W Gold rated PSU, NZXT Noctis 450 cabinet, Samsung S240SW 24' 1920x1200 LED panel, X-52 Pro Flight stick. W10 Pro x64 1809, NO antivirus EVER
WinterH Posted June 18, 2015 Posted June 18, 2015 Although I am not too much into more FC3 idea, I will admit it would be nice for some aircraft. I'd pay $20 for a nicely done Su-25T level Su-24M. Yet, from developer's point of view, I imagine while not nearly a full on DCS level development, it is still considerable effort, and in the end it will need to be sold cheap too, so I'm not sure how feasible are they from a commercial standpoint. Wishlist: F-4E Block 53 +, MiG-27K, Su-17M3 or M4, AH-1F or W circa 80s or early 90s, J35 Draken, Kfir C7, Mirage III/V DCS-Dismounts Script
DarkFire Posted June 18, 2015 Posted June 18, 2015 I can imagine the sticking point to having even an FC3-level Su-24M being that the thing is still in service and as such I suppose that most of the avionics are still highly classified. I'd more than happily pay for an FC3 level module for the Su-24, as Whitehot mentioned to get access to those longer-range A2G missiles. I vaguely remember being able to use the Kh-58 and Kh-31 on the Su-27 / -33 back in the days of Flanker 2.0 and even before then with Su-27 Squadron Commander Edition. Great fun! To keep things even for the NATO enthusiasts we could potentially have either the F-111 or Tornado GR1 to complement the Su-24. System Spec: Cooler Master Cosmos C700P Black Edition case. | AMD 5950X CPU | MSI RTX-3090 GPU | 32GB HyperX Predator PC4000 RAM | | TM Warthog stick & throttle | TrackIR 5 | Samsung 980 Pro NVMe 4 SSD 1TB (boot) | Samsung 870 QVO SSD 4TB (games) | Windows 10 Pro 64-bit. Personal wish list: DCS: Su-27SM & DCS: Avro Vulcan.
Conroy Posted June 20, 2015 Posted June 20, 2015 +1 F-16 is really needed, as for F-18 (FC 3.0) but we could also have Mig-29K and Su-39. However, F-16 first of all, really a must to have in FC 3.0. ...Su-24, Tornado and Tu-22....a dream.
pepin1234 Posted June 20, 2015 Posted June 20, 2015 +1 F-16 is really needed, as for F-18 (FC 3.0) but we could also have Mig-29K and Su-39. However, F-16 first of all, really a must to have in FC 3.0. ...Su-24, Tornado and Tu-22....a dream. Knowing how ED work probably a F-16 module is not what they want at the near future. I see ED is trying to balance the game. The F-18 is a fighter bomber and the Red side have only the Su-25 to do CAS Tasks and some SEAD. So what matter is how balance is the game with flyable aircrafts. After F-18, is the turn for the red side and the only module can balance is a tactical Russian bomber. This is the Su-24M [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]
DarkFire Posted June 20, 2015 Posted June 20, 2015 Knowing how ED work probably a F-16 module is not what they want at the near future. I see ED is trying to balance the game. The F-18 is a fighter bomber and the Red side have only the Su-25 to do CAS Tasks and some SEAD. So what matter is how balance is the game with flyable aircrafts. After F-18, is the turn for the red side and the only module can balance is a tactical Russian bomber. This is the Su-24M Agree. To be fair the Su-30 would be another interesting choice but also suffers the same problem in that it's a current inventory aircraft with even more up-to-date and therefore classified avionics than the Su-24M. I suppose the Su-30 would be closer to an F-15E than an F-18. Personally I'd prefer to see a pure attack bomber like the Su-24M. System Spec: Cooler Master Cosmos C700P Black Edition case. | AMD 5950X CPU | MSI RTX-3090 GPU | 32GB HyperX Predator PC4000 RAM | | TM Warthog stick & throttle | TrackIR 5 | Samsung 980 Pro NVMe 4 SSD 1TB (boot) | Samsung 870 QVO SSD 4TB (games) | Windows 10 Pro 64-bit. Personal wish list: DCS: Su-27SM & DCS: Avro Vulcan.
Worther_1 Posted June 20, 2015 Posted June 20, 2015 (edited) For my 2p's worth...,I personally really enjoy FC3 aircraft especially F-15 & SU-27. I have quite a few DCS modules, but when time pressures apply I nearly always go for a FC3 plane for a 'quick hit'. I also agree with a previous post that many more modern (70's on) planes could be made using this template, I wouldn't mind if the avionics were 'estimated' if the plane flew well and had exciting capabilities. Additional airframes for CAS or bombing would be good. Edited June 20, 2015 by Worther_1 Worther_1 DCS Black Shark 2, A10-C, Huey, MiG-21bis, Hawk, Flaming Cliffs 3, F/A-18, Nevada Terrain.
Tirak Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 It seems kind of odd. EricJ from the CombatAce forums showed up not too long ago saying he was going to start a FC3 level Super Hornet, but then the topic disappeared, and now it looks like he's been banned. As far as I could tell he was bending over backwards to not break any rules. Anyone have a clue what's going on?
theropod Posted June 21, 2015 Posted June 21, 2015 (edited) It seems kind of odd. EricJ from the CombatAce forums showed up not too long ago saying he was going to start a FC3 level Super Hornet, but then the topic disappeared, and now it looks like he's been banned. As far as I could tell he was bending over backwards to not break any rules. Anyone have a clue what's going on? they had banned from ed forums and they are asking the same like you. you can follow the thread from combatace forums http://combatace.com/topic/86169-super-hornet-for-dcs/page-3 Edited June 21, 2015 by theropod
Flogger23m Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 I would be far more interested in FC3 level aircraft from the modern era than any other type of product. Going to DCS levels of a modern fighter is too difficult for myself. I would probably learn most of the functions but forget them as I switch to other aircraft or take a break for playing. The FC3 level is complex yet is relatively accessible. I am also not too interested in WWII. I'd be very interested in an FC3 level Eurofighter, F-18, F-16, Su-35, Mirage 2000 ect.
Conroy Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 For FC 3.0 SU-27 --- F-15 SU-33 --- F-18 SU-25 --- A-10 MIG-29 --- F-16 + Mirage 2000 SU-25T cover the sead capabilities of F-18 and F-16. This for my opinion would be the minimum. After this we could talk about the two seaters, SU-24 first of all. About F-16...really, is not possibile do not have it. A lot of Airforces fly it, so it would be a nonsense.
DarkFire Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 Here's another possibility: with the on-going development of the red sea theatre it would be very interesting to have an FC3-level MiG-25RB to fly. I don't think they're in service any more with the Russian air force so perhaps the necessary information on their systems etc. would be available. I'd love to be able to fly at >2.8M at 25,000m :joystick: :pilotfly: System Spec: Cooler Master Cosmos C700P Black Edition case. | AMD 5950X CPU | MSI RTX-3090 GPU | 32GB HyperX Predator PC4000 RAM | | TM Warthog stick & throttle | TrackIR 5 | Samsung 980 Pro NVMe 4 SSD 1TB (boot) | Samsung 870 QVO SSD 4TB (games) | Windows 10 Pro 64-bit. Personal wish list: DCS: Su-27SM & DCS: Avro Vulcan.
Flogger23m Posted June 22, 2015 Posted June 22, 2015 Exactly. A gamer that work or study should have the DCS level in FC3 modules. We already know that ED is working on multicrew cockpits. That's something important and this gone take time, but ones is done... lets dream with: F-4 Phantom, Tornado, F-111, Mig-29UB, Su-25UB and of course my number one Su-24M. I just imagine how could be piloting a Su-24M and my copilot doing all the targeting stuffs. I hope they get finish the DCS World 2 as soon as possible and for sure they have more stuffs on the table to show. I am not so sure multi crew planes will work very well. I do not trust the AI. Once you get to FC3 levels there is just too much to manage or rely on an AI to do. Multiplayer can work, but again this has the same issues as the study sim level. Getting another player to play at the times you are online is a pain. Getting your friends (or random people who are competent) to join the same server for an hour or so is difficult enough. Having someone go afk briefly is bad. Even worse when they're my pilot. Constantly switching between cockpits when offline will be too difficult. And again, I don't trust the AI.
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