New map

[SchniX]

Hi all,

 

I'm intending to make a new map for DCSW. but, before spending a lot of time and resources, i want to know first please, if it possible at all, with the current map creation tools?

 

I saw that there is a nice WIKI with the information and tutorials for new maps here:

http://en.wiki.eagle.ru/wiki/All_about_land and here: http://en.wiki.eagle.ru/wiki/Creating_land_2

 

The Plugin for 3ds Max there seems to be outdated, also the lsa2, rn2 files, because the current DCSW Version uses lsa3, rn3 etc..

 

So, i would like to know please if it is possible.

 

Thx

[Rangi]

You need to contact ED directly to get access to the new map tools. I believe Wags would be the person to start with. Good Luck.

[NineLine]

Those tools will not work with the new map format coming. You will need 3rd Party access to get your hands on the new tools, in order to do that, you will need to show you have the skills and means to create a map, from modeling, texturing and programming.

[IAF_Phantom]

Hi

Thanks for the response,

 

what if we just want to make an "old" map type?

does this mean that all old mods of maps will not work in DCS 1.5 or even 1.2.16?

 

Thanks

[NineLine]

I think once 2.0 is in full release, old map formats will cease to work.

[cichlidfan]

I think once 2.0 is in full release, old map formats will cease to work.

 

Then how will the current map function?

[NineLine]

Then how will the current map function?

 

Its being adapted to the new format/2.0, but obviously wont take advantage of all the benefits of the new format, but thats pretty much what we have been told already.

[gospadin]

Those tools will not work with the new map format coming. You will need 3rd Party access to get your hands on the new tools, in order to do that, you will need to show you have the skills and means to create a map, from modeling, texturing and programming.

 

Maybe besides the point, but why would my company have to demonstrate skills up front? Assuming maps can only be sold/made compatible with DCS with ED's approval anyway, why wouldn't they just license their tool chain to interested developers for whatever licensing fee they choose?

[NineLine]

Maybe besides the point, but why would my company have to demonstrate skills up front? Assuming maps can only be sold/made compatible with DCS with ED's approval anyway, why wouldn't they just license their tool chain to interested developers for whatever licensing fee they choose?

 

 

Its what ED wants, before entering into an agreement with anyone they want to make sure they have the skills and ability to produce quality products. Some stuff in the past as failed to live up to those standards, so they choose to be more careful now.

[IAF_Phantom]

while I understand the logic of this for a commercial project - doesn't this derail any community effort?

I totally understand that when ED supplies an official 3rd party agreement it comes with all sort of things, that are very valuable, and I suspect is wreath it (to keep standards high all they would need to do is sell the 3rd party plugin...)

I fear that this will close any options for map building community efforts to exist... out of such efforts a significant amount of official 3rd parties came to be.

[NRG-Vampire]

...you will need to show you have the skills and means to create a map, from modeling, texturing and programming.

 

How can I prove/show that ?

Some screenshots will be adequate ?

[NineLine]

while I understand the logic of this for a commercial project - doesn't this derail any community effort?

I totally understand that when ED supplies an official 3rd party agreement it comes with all sort of things, that are very valuable, and I suspect is wreath it (to keep standards high all they would need to do is sell the 3rd party plugin...)

I fear that this will close any options for map building community efforts to exist... out of such efforts a significant amount of official 3rd parties came to be.

 

Not sure what you mean, its not about a community effort, its about getting the tools in the hands of people that can create high quality terrain for DCS World. Look how log the old tools have been kicking around, how many maps do we have to show for it? This makes the most sense for terrain and the terrain tools.

[tintifaxl]

As soon as ED announced EDGE a few years back every map effort in the old format was stopped. To hold this against the community now is a little unfair in my opinion.

[gospadin]

As long as ED was the quality control gate for any published content, I don't see the downside of releasing the tools to everyone. At worst, nothing comes of it anyway which is where we are today. At best, you get tons of high quality maps that ED can sell for a nominal fee. They can make it like the iPhone app store, where they get 30% of all revenue from maps or similar.

[NineLine]

As long as ED was the quality control gate for any published content, I don't see the downside of releasing the tools to everyone. At worst, nothing comes of it anyway which is where we are today. At best, you get tons of high quality maps that ED can sell for a nominal fee. They can make it like the iPhone app store, where they get 30% of all revenue from maps or similar.

 

If you have the ability to create high quality maps, then you can get the tools, just send an email to Wags and tell him about your skills and/or team.

[VincentLaw]

As soon as ED announced EDGE a few years back every map effort in the old format was stopped. To hold this against the community now is a little unfair in my opinion.

I second this. I have casual interest in exploring the map creation tools, but I never tried out the old tools because I was aware they were being phased out. Without access to the tools, I'm simply not going to develop the prerequisite skills necessary to get access to the tools. ED can do whatever it wants though. I can't argue with that.

[NineLine]

As soon as ED announced EDGE a few years back every map effort in the old format was stopped. To hold this against the community now is a little unfair in my opinion.

 

Who is holding anything against anyone, its also unfair to blame ED for people stopping their work. More likely it was a bigger undertaking than they originally planned... regardless, its water under the bridge now, and we are where we are at now...

[sim_guy]

If modders got their hands on the tools and started to make maps for free, I believe that would negate the fact that ED wants to make money off of new maps. Thus why they will only have 3rd party devs with access top these tools, cant argue with that. It is their decision.

[VincentLaw]

If modders got their hands on the tools and started to make maps for free, I believe that would negate the fact that ED wants to make money off of new maps. Thus why they will only have 3rd party devs with access top these tools, cant argue with that. It is their decision.

I agree that is (I assume) the reason they are doing it this way. It's (most likely) the same reason the open EFM API is missing several essential features.

 

Back when RRG announced their plan to release the tools to kickstarter backers, they said the version of the tools released would exclude the ability to export maps to DCS. This is certainly still a good solution to the problem, and I would argue better than the current situation, but creating and maintaining a second version of the map development kit with special restrictions would cost ED money. They probably don't think there is enough benefit for the cost... and that's (probably) why we are stuck here.

[spaceraver]

Barring the creation of maps by anybody not being a partner, what is the maximum map size DCS can handle? Infinite to the point of chugging along at 2 FPS with 64 GB RAM or is there another limit that the engine itself is has? Just so we have a rough estimate..

[NineLine]

I dont think they know how far they can push it yet, they are starting off smaller, and wish to push larger as they tune the tools and such.

[tintifaxl]

Look how log the old tools have been kicking around, how many maps do we have to show for it? This makes the most sense for terrain and the terrain tools.

 

Who is holding anything against anyone, its also unfair to blame ED for people stopping their work. More likely it was a bigger undertaking than they originally planned... regardless, its water under the bridge now, and we are where we are at now...

 

You are using missing community content as an explanation for not releasing the new tools to the community. Thus you hold this against the community.

 

I am not blaming ED for anouncing EDGE and the subsequent stop to the map building. As English is not my first language did I give the impression of doing so?

 

But as you said -> its water under the bridge now. And I for one hope many teams qualify for the map making and we get many good maps in the future. :thumbup:

[NineLine]

You are using missing community content as an explanation for not releasing the new tools to the community. Thus you hold this against the community.

 

I am not blaming ED for anouncing EDGE and the subsequent stop to the map building. As English is not my first language did I give the impression of doing so?

 

But as you said -> its water under the bridge now. And I for one hope many teams qualify for the map making and we get many good maps in the future. :thumbup:

 

Dont be ridiculous... That is not the reason the tools are not being given to you, the reason they are not being given to you is you havent applied to earn them... submit your creds and I am sure you can get them, its quite simple. Not sure why ED should cough up all their development tools just because... nothing wrong with maintaining control over something that has cost both development time and money.

[NineLine]

I think we mostly all could agree that if things where more open like other developers in regards to this the community and possiblilities would be endless. Nothing wrong with modding id say the more terrains the better, we definately need something better than the lame two maps aka nevada and current old one. How about Afghanistan and Iraq as they are more legitimate to conflicts these days, or even better Eastern Europe

 

Other developers? Like? And how is Nevada lame, you dont even have it yet... not to mention there is the SoH map coming after it...

[NineLine]

Yes SOH will be the most Logical Map for a Combat SIm..... Nevada is pretty sure got it good training map. Ill bestow upon you the quote to answer your question in regards to other developers and overall frustration on not having the community the ability to make its own maps.

 

First day Q-Course, " Today is the first day you Learn to Think Outside the Box"

 

I more than understand why ED does the things the way they do more than most here could ever grasp. Those who have worked in the eastern Block know what i speak of.

 

Thanks, but that doesnt answer my question at all... I probably dont need you to answer anyways. :doh: