Best plane to get started

Delerium · November 6, 2015

Hi folks,

I was wondering what is the best plane to get started? By that, I mean what is the the easiest one of all of them? I did try the A10C (bought it a while back) and it requires a huge learning.

Don't get me wrong, I do understand that it's a simulator and there's a learning curve. I was just wondering if there one of the plane out there that is easier to learn and requires a bit less time to learn?!

My hobby time is, sadly, a bit limited: :(

Thanks, appreciated.

Dingo_Bob · November 6, 2015

MiG15, F-86 & L-39, are fairly easy start up, Hawk, C-101 are also quick & easyish

plus both MiG & Sabre just went on 30% off sale so there's some insentive to get 'em if you don't already :D

outlawal2 · November 6, 2015

HAWK and C-101 are excellent choices.. (And if you buy the HAWK it is very easy to fly as it has an easier flight model so you can get up to speed very quickly.) Then once the advanced flight model is finished you will receive the newer update for free so it is kind of like two planes for one.. This would allow you an easier plane to get the feel and then the more advanced flight model down the road once you are better used to things..

Viersbovsky · November 6, 2015

Depends on which plane interests you, honestly.

In my opinion, it is not really of any use to learn, lets say, a ground pounder when you actually love dogfighting and vis-versa.

On the other hand:

TF51

Is free and included in DCS world. Is the easiest to take-off, cruise and land in of the warbirds. If you are interested in warbirds, this module is a good start. Have I mentioned it's free? There may seem to be a lot of switches at first, but you only need like 5 to get the engine running.

SU-25T

Is free with DCS World. A ground pounder that is FC3 level fidelity. That means no clickable cockpits and simplified system management. Is still loads of fun to fly, especially with its pretty nice flight model.

FC3

All FC3 craft are reduced system complexity with no clickable cockpits. So you can start each plane with only some button presses. System modeling is not as in-depth as in the A-10 and KA50, but still demands study and training to use properly.

I have not yet flown the trainers or the Mg15/Sabre, so I can't give you an opinion on them.

Also, easy really depends. Some planes are easy to fly but have devilishly complex weapons systems (A-10C), others are hard to fly but very simple when it comes to systems (Huey, warbirds).

I would also like to direct you to Chuck's tutorials. They are excellent to get started.

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=135765

Edited November 6, 2015 by Viersbovsky

some1 · November 6, 2015

Hawk and C-101 are buggy, half-finished products. C-101 doesn't even have manual other than short checklist. My suggestion is to avoid them until they are somewhat finished and out of beta. Could take a while.

Other jets mentioned (Mig, F86, L39) are better choice, although none of them is finished either. Only MiG-15 has a complete manual and training missions. L39 has been released only recently and you need to install DCS 1.5 open beta to fly it.

Or you can buy FC3 and you will get several planes that are easier to learn, though you will have to remember a lot of keyboard shortcuts.

vigilante87 · November 6, 2015

I 2nd the TF-51. Free, easy to fly, and just enough "system management" to get by. Once you get good with that, find something a bit faster like the F-86. It would be an easy transition since a lot of the gauges and such are pretty much the same thing.

Bottom line, move up in era's! Older birds rely more on actual piloting and not "auto pilot this, systems that make X easier, that" which would benefit you I believe.

Ironhand · November 6, 2015

Hi folks,

I was wondering what is the best plane to get started? By that, I mean what is the the easiest one of all of them? I did try the A10C (bought it a while back) and it requires a huge learning.

Don't get me wrong, I do understand that it's a simulator and there's a learning curve. I was just wondering if there one of the plane out there that is easier to learn and requires a bit less time to learn?!

My hobby time is, sadly, a bit limited: :(

Thanks, appreciated.

As already noted by everyone, it depends on whether you want to 1) mostly make things on the ground go boom, 2) mostly make things in the air go boom, or 3) just fly around and take in the scenery. That being said, either the FC3 F-15, Su-27, or A-10A are good choices. All have an advanced flight model but their systems modeling is well within the learning curve of someone with less time to devote to the sim. For A2A, the F-15 would probably a bit less frustrating for someone with limited time. For ground pounding, the A-10A. My preferred ride is the Su-27 simply because she's the most beautiful aircraft in the sky and I'm a sucker for that sort of thing.

Edited November 6, 2015 by Ironhand

Home Fries · November 6, 2015

As you can see by the variety of answers, "easy" depends on your outlook. My questions to you are:

Where are you on the flight sim/aviation learning curve, and what do you need/want to learn?
What kind of controller do you use, and what are you willing to invest (long term)?
Are you interested at all in helicopters?

These are all important questions gauging your interests and what you hope to get out of DCS.

If you want to get up in the air and start shooting things, then FC3 is the way to go. If you are not experienced in flying and you want a more forgiving flight model, then FC3 (using the Su-25) is also a good call (it's a high fidelity flight model, but a stable platform, and the lack of a HUD builds good scan habits). If you need to learn basic air navigation without dealing with all of the manual labor that goes with it, FC3 is also a good call. However, if you don't have a good HOTAS or if you don't want to learn key combinations, stay away from FC3 for now. Note: you can fly FC3 just fine with a SWFFB2 or Logitech 3D Pro, but you still have to do some programming in the control UI to make it worth your while.

If you are looking for something that will be fun to fly and a challenge to fight, with simple systems but clickable cockpit, look at the MiG-21. There are a lot of switches to contend with, but it's not as bad as it looks, and you don't need much just to fly it and learn it. The MiG-21 module is a fun one regardless, but it's ironically good for learning the ropes (as long as you aren't trying to shoot something). The tutorials are excellent as well.

Finally, if you have any interest in helicopters, I recommend the Huey. There are 6 steps to engine start, and system management is very simple but still clickable. It's not easy to learn, but the same learning curve applies to everybody. It should take you about 4 hours of dedicated practice to learn how to hover, and then it just clicks and you'll be fine in any helicopter you try.

These are broad-brush suggestions; if you answer the questions, we might be able to narrow down your options.

EDIT: Sniped by Ironhand, but I'll agree with his assessments as well. A-10A is a great plane for learning how to fly around as well.

Edited November 6, 2015 by Home Fries

Delerium · November 6, 2015

Wow! I did not expect that number of quality answers answer. Thanks!

Indeed, I forgot some background:

Where are you on the flight sim/aviation learning curve, and what do you need/want to learn?
- I've been playing MS FSX for a while. I would say I'm "OK" with flight instruments. It's mostly the weapons system that seems complicated. As someone stated, I bought the A10-C a while back and was having a hard time to launch a single something!

What kind of controller do you use, and what are you willing to invest (long term)?
- I have the ThrustMaster Hotas Warthog

Are you interested at all in helicopters?
- Could be. But I heard it's actually harder than a plane? But I never tried, and I'm not close to the idea at all

I think I would prefer ground bombing to start it.

I follow the suggestion and try the TF-51 since it's free. But paying for another model is not a big issue either.

I also like the idea of "vigilante87" .. To move up the eras ;)

Ho..I just realized there's a A-10A and the A-10C Warthog. I do have the later, and I find it a bit hard.

Thanks folks, appreciated!

Sryan · November 6, 2015

that A10A is an FC3 model. Like you've heard before here, that means the flight model is still good but the avionics are extremely simplified. the buttons in the cockpit can't even be clicked.

If you're interested in hearing my tips, there's maybe 2 things you could do.

- You can keep playing that A10C. And accept to learn it slowly. Start with the ghetto, low technology weapons first. Learn to kill things with the gun, and then learn how to kill things with unguided rockets. when you got that under control, you can try to load up some slick unguided bombs. put the mastermode to CCIP ( calculated impact point ) and then perform a diving attack, CCIP bombing is just a matter of putting "the thing on the thing", a thing said around here meaning just putting the crosshairs on the target. You shouldn't need to know much of the systems to perform these attacks. from there on you can slowly move on to learn things like SOI,SPI,the DSMS and it's indepth pages, and the TGP. With those things under control you could drop your first guided weapons and perform CCRP ( calculated release point ) attacks. While you're learning you can occasionally revert back to the easier weapons and have a bit of fun. it's a hobby after all. It may take long but in the long run you'll get the most out of the game for money you've already spent.

Another thing is maybe grab one of the trainers, like the Hawk or L39. I own the Hawk but the L39 is being made inhouse by the primary dev so I can guarantee it's good. You'll learn the hawk in about one afternoon. there's not much complicated stuff to it. For your prefered playstyle of ground attack it can perform gun runs, unguided rocket attacks, bombing runs and clusterbomb runs. Nothing the A10 can't do but packaged much more simply. People around here say that the Hawk is not finished and they're right. It currently has a placeholder flight model. That doesn't mean it's not fun to fly though.

gospadin · November 6, 2015

Sounds to me like you just need a bit of help or a teacher. Since you already have the warthog stick, that goes a long way to making teaching easier, since all the buttons/keys you need are already mapped predictably.

The advice to start with a single weapon system is a good one, but I'd recommend starting with the AGM-65D Maverick. It requires a bit of systems understanding to enable and use, but once you get the hang of it, it's quite easy to work with and it's very effective. You can carry 6 of them, and even with just mavericks, you're an asset in most multi-player missions, especially on the pvp servers.

Beagle One · November 6, 2015

Su-25 not T, that's the best plane to get startet in my opinion. Is that way and was that way since LOMAC

millenix · November 6, 2015

I'm new also, and thus far my path has been.

TF-51 - Practice start up, take offs, landings. With that learning DCS radio controls and how the radio frequencies work. Also it's just a cool plane to take off and land, and it's modeled really well.

SU-25T - Because free, and the in-game tutorials really do help with learning the systems. FC3 systems and definitely helped me get started.

FC3, more specifically F-15 - This is where personal preference came into play. I really enjoy A2A. Take off, landing, etc were very similar concepts to the SU-25T. I then focused on learning the FCR and target acquisition. Downloaded the hoggit training map and used that to practice acquiring targets and shooting them down.

You could use the SU-25 from FC3 or another FC3 aircraft to get your feet wet and learn the weapon systems on that craft. I actually found/find flying the F-15 very rewarding despite the lack of clickable cockpit.

Home Fries · November 6, 2015

Where are you on the flight sim/aviation learning curve, and what do you need/want to learn?

I've been playing MS FSX for a while. I would say I'm "OK" with flight instruments. It's mostly the weapons system that seems complicated. As someone stated, I bought the A10-C a while back and was having a hard time to launch a single something!

What kind of controller do you use, and what are you willing to invest (long term)?

I have the ThrustMaster Hotas Warthog

Are you interested at all in helicopters?

Could be. But I heard it's actually harder than a plane? But I never tried, and I'm not close to the idea at all

So you fly FSX, which means that you have experience flying from point A to point B, takeoffs/landings, and air navigation using the HSI and CDI. You also have the Warthog, which means that you can use the A-10C exactly as it is intended, and you can program the Warthog for FC3 aircraft (you don't even need TARGET). This gives you maximum flexibility in your decision making.

First of all the A-10C is a tough aircraft to fight, even with the HOTAS Warthog. Even with a lot of experience, acquiring targets is difficult, and even engaging targets with Maverick after locking them with the TGP doesn't always go smoothly. If you want to learn the A-10C, you will need to go through the training missions until the buttonology is second nature so that all you need to do is think about what you want to do and not have to think about how you do it. I recommend doing the easy instant action over and over because you will employ the different weapons for different purposes, and in a comparatively slow and low threat environment.

That said, if you want to try an easier bird, I recommend FC3 (the package, not just the individual aircraft). The Su-25 is just all around fun to fly (more responsive than the 25T), and the analog cockpit is good for keeping your basic flying skills up to speed. The A-10A is an easy aircraft to fly, and has the same flight model as the A-10C but with simpler avionics. You could practice air to ground delivery with this as well, and then graduate to the C once you decide you want more. The Su-25T is also a great platform for practicing with the Shkval, so you can transfer these skills to the TGP on the A-10C. It's tricky at first to make an attack with Vikhr, but once you get good at it you can regularly get off 2 Vikhr attacks per run.

As far as helos go, they are harder than fixed wing in the sense that you need to be an active pilot at all times (as opposed to trimming for level flight and getting a sandwich in fixed wing :D ). Hover is the second hardest thing to do in a helo (hardest is transition to hover from level flight), but once you learn that you have the muscle memory to keep the cyclic and pedals in play to keep you in place with the nose pointed where you want it. If you have any desire for rotary wing, start with the Huey because it is the simplest, has no stability augmentation, and as such will make you a much better stick in other helos like the Mi-8 or Ka-50.

Viersbovsky · November 6, 2015

What kind of controller do you use, and what are you willing to invest (long term)?

I have the ThrustMaster Hotas Warthog

With rudder pedals, I assume? Just a little hint, set all non-symmetric axes (throttle, brakes, zoom) to "slider" in the axis modification menu. It should not make any difference, but it seems to work better for some mystical reason.

Are you interested at all in helicopters?

Could be. But I heard it's actually harder than a plane? But I never tried, and I'm not close to the idea at all

If you want to try a helo, try the Huey. It has one of the - maybe even the best flight model of any helicopter in any simulation. Helicopters in hover are a bit hard to get into, but in forward flight they act very similar to planes. Helos are great fun to fly and and a real challenge.

I think I would prefer ground bombing to start it.

In this case, I recommend the Su25T (since it's free), Chuck's guide and this thread:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=110779

Delerium · November 6, 2015

Hey,

I'm very grateful for all your answers.

Good thing, I just realized that I bought the FC3 package a while back (Getting old, apparently).

Seems like the TF-51 and the Su-25 got some vote. Also, stick with the A10-C and learn bit by bit, which could be another approach.

I'll give both the TF-51 and Su-25 quick try (training thing) and pick the one I prefer. Of course, I do not put the other model / planes / helos aside. But I'll try to get familiar with the weaponry of one model first, and then expand my knowledge as I go (A10-C, looking at you bad boy!). Good thing is that so far, I might have a few hours this week-end.

Thanks. ;)

Sryan · November 6, 2015

If you're trying the TF-51 I'm shooting you one more tip. I saw you had a warthog stick but you didn't mention any pedals? Propellor planes have a tendency to yaw during take-off due to torque from the engine and propellor, and also to roll during flying. The realistic way to counter the yawing would be to use the rudder ofcourse, but the warthog stick can't twist. You could go into options, then special options, find the TF51 and then allow for auto-rudders, and maybe allow yourself some take-off assistance while you're there.

Delerium · November 6, 2015

If you're trying the TF-51 I'm shooting you one more tip. I saw you had a warthog stick but you didn't mention any pedals? Propellor planes have a tendency to yaw during take-off due to torque from the engine and propellor, and also to roll during flying. The realistic way to counter the yawing would be to use the rudder ofcourse, but the warthog stick can't twist. You could go into options, then special options, find the TF51 and then allow for auto-rudders, and maybe allow yourself some take-off assistance while you're there.

Thanks for tips!

I do not have any rudder pedals so that will come handy!

Isn't there some rudder keys that can be map to the keyboard?

Sryan · November 6, 2015

Z and X by default. but those provide full deflection and the torque aint nearly that bad. so you would oscilate between the torque-induced yaw and the correcting rudder motion. Hence to Auto-rudder was added for propellor planes.

Home Fries · November 6, 2015

Thanks for tips!
I do not have any rudder pedals so that will come handy!
Isn't there some rudder keys that can be map to the keyboard?

You can also map the Throttle Friction Control knob to the rudder axis in a pinch, though I personally don't like that. For the P-51 especially (or any tail-dragger for that matter) I highly recommend rudders with toe brakes.

Also, you'll want pedals before you even think about helos.

Delerium · November 7, 2015

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind.

Might have some time this evening to do / watch some training.

Wish me luck!

Later.

Flogger23m · November 7, 2015

Flaming Cliffs 3. No question about it, the planes are easy to fly and easy to learn. This doesn't hold true for just about every other module. Plus you get a wide variety of missions to play.

cardboard_man · November 7, 2015

I would say after you are comfortable with Flaming Cliffs 3 the mig-21 is a good next step. It has just the right amount of stuff to challenge a new player but not overwhelm them and the tutorials/manual are good and easy to follow.

greco.bernardi · November 7, 2015

Thanks for tips!

I do not have any rudder pedals so that will come handy!

Isn't there some rudder keys that can be map to the keyboard?

You will need one. Trackir and rudder pedal will enlarge your world. You will never more want to fly without they! It is like to fly using a keyboard instead of a joystick!

Harnis · November 7, 2015

I would say after you are comfortable with Flaming Cliffs 3 the mig-21 is a good next step. It has just the right amount of stuff to challenge a new player but not overwhelm them and the tutorials/manual are good and easy to follow.

I'd second this. FC3 is a fantastic value for the money, especially if you get it on sale or with a coupon code. The aircraft have simpler controls modelling, simpler radio, etc. Some of them like the F-15, Su-27, and Su-25 have really nice flight models too, so they're a joy to fly. They're a great start to the game, and give you a large set of missions and different roles to fly.

I'd also second the MiG-21. It is simple to start up, and has relatively simple systems compared to the A-10C. It's a little tricky to take off and land, but it's fun. Weapons are simple, and it can do air to air AND air to ground effectively. It's nice and fast, looks cool, and the devs did an amazing job of modelling the aircraft (one of the devs is a MiG-21 pilot).

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