HUD inaccuracies

[NineLine]

Man, if the developers would respond/implement these small changes I'd buy their plane in a heartbeat. I'm just not sure if they are eager to make their module realistic and up to DCS standards.

 

This looks like a bug report thread, if you dont have anything constructive to add, then its probably not worth posting....

[Fox One]

jaguara5, good finds, thanks.

[Nealius]

The truth is, in all videos in nav mode there is no G meter on the HUD. It only appears when you select any A/A or A/G mode.

 

Would that require that the linked demo be flown with dummy ordinance? The lack of a HUD G meter is really bugging me because the accelerometer is totally obscured by the HUD console. Even if it weren't I still couldn't read it when zoomed out.

[jaguara5]

Also, with 530 selected, as long the target is locked, there is the target BOX,

missile circle and the range scale (see Picture on post 23).

When target lock is lost (or when radar is put in silence mode?),

all these indications dissapear, including the circle

Edited January 3, 2016 by jaguara5

[Azrayen]

Would that require that the linked demo be flown with dummy ordinance? The lack of a HUD G meter is really bugging me because the accelerometer is totally obscured by the HUD console. Even if it weren't I still couldn't read it when zoomed out.

Alpha demos (solo displays) of the 2000C were flown in MAG mode (in fact, simulated MAG mode) in order to have the G meter in the HUD.

 

Nevertheless, the G-meter and the AoA meter on the dashboard are in fact visible IRL, despite the "HUD console".

Why not in DCS? Well, one PoV/camera in sim versus 2 (horizontally separated) eyes IRL. As simple as that (to explain, not to fix).

[Fox One]

Very short but nice HUD sequence showing Magic missile range

 

Also clearly visible the steering dot.

[PiedDroit]

Very short but nice HUD sequence showing Magic missile range

 

Also clearly visible the steering dot.

We talked about symbology of Magic+radar lock before, shouldn't that be a triangle instead of the square+circle? I'm confused.

[GGTharos]

It's clearly showing you a DLZ, not missile range. Huge difference.

 

Very short but nice HUD sequence showing Magic missile range

 

Also clearly visible the steering dot.

[OnlyforDCS]

It's clearly showing you a DLZ, not missile range. Huge difference.

 

True. However you can clearly extrapolate the range from that DLZ, at least to an approximate level. From what I can see in that photo, and assuming the target is flying head on, the RMax of the missile in that shot should be about 8nm. (or 15km) Which is currently higher than any scenario involving the M2000C and the Magic2 Ive seen and tried in DCS so far. At the very least, you can show that the missile range in DCS is clearly sub-par to its RL counterpart.

[sedenion]

Yes, the DLZ seem to be 10nm scale. at 8nm the max range (the claimed max range for the Magic2), what appear as a NEZ is at 4.5 or 5 nm, dans what appear to be a min range si somewhere at 1 nm.

[GGTharos]

True. However you can clearly extrapolate the range from that DLZ, at least to an approximate level.

 

Not even.

 

What's the missile doing when it reaches that distance?

What's the speed?

AoA?

 

From what I can see in that photo, and assuming the target is flying head on, the RMax of the missile in that shot should be about 8nm. (or 15km) Which is currently higher than any scenario involving the M2000C and the Magic2 Ive seen and tried in DCS so far. At the very least, you can show that the missile range in DCS is clearly sub-par to its RL counterpart.

With that I agree, except I don't know how to read the range markings on that. I don't know if every mark is part of the DLZ or not (though this appears to be the case)

[OnlyforDCS]

Slight error in my earlier post. I mean Raero nor Rmax.

 

In any case the range markings are pretty easy to read. The marks to the "left" of the vertical range bar indicate the three DLZ ranges. First should be the Raero, or max range for a non maneuvering target. The second larger mark should indicate Rmax and the third near the bottom of the vertical range bar should be Rmin.

 

In any case thats the way it works in our M2000C too at this time, and assuming that this is accurately modeled in our version in DCS, you can easily get those ranges using nothing more than a ruler.

 

The scale of the bar is actually slaved to the radar, and it changes depending on what scale is used in the radar. In this case it is quite clearly 10nm. This is indicated by the marking to the "right" of the DLZ bar. THe very lowest and the very top most mark indicate the range from 0 to 10 nm.

 

This is actually quite easy to extrapolate from the picture, if you take that bar and divide it into 10 equidistant parts, the displayed target range of 6,0 nm in the last picture should be right on the money!

Edited January 5, 2016 by OnlyforDCS

[sedenion]

This is obviously a 10nm scale...

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/attachment.php?attachmentid=132216&stc=1&d=1452007620

[jaguara5]

Slight error in my earlier post. I mean Raero nor Rmax.

 

In any case the range markings are pretty easy to read. The marks to the "left" of the vertical range bar indicate the three DLZ ranges. First should be the Raero, or max range for a non maneuvering target. The second larger mark should indicate Rmax and the third near the bottom of the vertical range bar should be Rmin.

 

In any case thats the way it works in our M2000C too at this time, and assuming that this is accurately modeled in our version in DCS, you can easily get those ranges using nothing more than a ruler.

 

The scale of the bar is actually slaved to the radar, and it changes depending on what scale is used in the radar. In this case it is quite clearly 10nm. This is indicated by the marking to the "right" of the DLZ bar. THe very lowest and the very top most mark indicate the range from 0 to 10 nm.

 

This is actually quite easy to extrapolate from the picture, if you take that bar and divide it into 10 equidistant parts, the displayed target range of 6,0 nm in the last picture should be right on the money!

 

If the 3 bars to the left are, from up to bottom , the Raero, the Rmax and the Rmin, what means that the target is between Raero and Rmax, why are displayed two circles in the center of the HUD (= target is in no escape zone, according to razbam's manual)?

[Fox One]

We talked about symbology of Magic+radar lock before, shouldn't that be a triangle instead of the square+circle? I'm confused.

 

Got me confused too. Maybe the circle together with the square means Magic seeker is slaved to radar LOS, but it can't lock target yet. That would make sense, since target is front aspect and range is still relatively big. And as soon as there is seeker lock, square and circle will be replaced with triangle.

[Fox One]

That's true, my bad

 

It's clearly showing you a DLZ, not missile range. Huge difference.

[PiedDroit]

Got me confused too. Maybe the circle together with the square means Magic seeker is slaved to radar LOS, but it can't lock target yet. That would make sense, since target is front aspect and range is still relatively big. And as soon as there is seeker lock, square and circle will be replaced with triangle.

Thanks! :thumbup:

[IvanK]

Think this might be a new one. The Track error symbol in the HUD at present always remains upright. It moves Left or right but always points up. I think it should rotate to give a relative bearing to the steering waypoint. So in the image below the WYPT is about Left 8 O'clock or on a bearing of roughly 270degrees.

 

In addition in the current DCS MIR2K implementation the Track Error deflection Left or Right isnt right . It should be on the side of the HUD centreline showing the quickest (less angles) to turn. At present it doesn't, it seems to be random.

Edited January 8, 2016 by IvanK

[Azrayen]

Nope.

In 2000C the "little house" is always upright (to) or inversed (from).

 

Your picture is from a 2000-5 which has the tiltable "little house".

 

So Razbam only needs to implement the inversed/from mode and will be spot on :)

[IvanK]

Ok thanks Azrayen

[TomCatMucDe]

I thought once that the little house showed that we were below the programmed altitude. So my question is, do we have an indication on the HUD about the altitude that we have to take, like on the F16 ?

[IvanK]

HUD pendulosity

 

MIRAGE 2000 HUD pendulosity

 

In the Mir 2000 the HUD symbolgy especially the pitch ladder shows very large pendulous lateral movement with roll. This looks as if in the roll axis the Pitch ladder is rotating about a point near the very top of the HUD. So when you apply roll the whole pitch ladder appears to rotate .... the bottom values swinging outboard. This then becomes exacerbated as AOA increases. Compare this to the F15 where the HUD symbolgy pitch ladder appears to rotate smoothly around the velocity vector.

 

Shouldn't the pitch ladder roll about the velocity vector or perhaps the centre of the HUD ? .... looking at the HUD video in the very first post in this thread looks to me that the velocity vector is the rotation axis (and lateral displacement axis) for the HUD pitch ladder.

Edited January 11, 2016 by IvanK

[Fox One]

^^^ In the first post I also described how pitch bars should be centered on velocity vector, and more :)

[TurboHog]

Small inaccuracy

 

(I glanced at the previous posts, I hope it wasn't mentioned yet)

 

At the very beginning of the video in the original post, radar altitude shows 0. In DCS it shows 5, which I assume is the actual distance between the sensor and the ground. From the footage it appears that the offset due to landing gear height is taken into account...

 

Easy fix I suppose. Just add an offset to the displayed Ralt. However, from an engineering standpoint, this offset should disappear when the landing gear is raised. Can't argue that from the HUD footage though...

 

DCS 1.5.3 btw

Edited March 7, 2016 by TurboHog

[some1]

Not sure if these are bugs, but another two things I observed:

 

* When selecting bombs (snakeye's), speed and altitude don't move down to match the raised seat position. But they do for A2G rockets.

* In A2G rockets declutter switch does not work.