The "all seeing" AI

[Kenan]

I have a simple question/wish: When will ED finally make the airborne AI a bit more realistic?

 

For example, a lone Su-25 with no radar and no AWACS always knows my exact location in the sky, flies straight towards me untill it gets within its (heatseakers) range. This makes intercepts and "surprise" attacks practically impossible (without tampering in Mission Editor with actions and triggers). Mind you, this also happenes when flying radar off (so, no radar emitions).

 

This is some basic stuff. I really wish this gets addressed one day. It's a bit absurd to be honest to have the issue neglected for so long.

[QuiGon]

Not just the airborne AI. The land forces AI has the same problem and is IMHO more gamebreaking, because they see you where you can't see them.

[Schmidtfire]

I would say that the biggest issue is the airborne AI seeing 360 degrees. It's impossible to come close and do a sneak attack, even from 6 o' clock low.

 

My suggestion is not only to limit field of view for fighter AI, but also detection probability/angle/range depending on type of aircraft.

 

For example F-16 and P-51D AI would have higher situational awareness than MiG21 and BF109 AI.

[Fri13]

It is game breaker/immersion breaker in everything as AA units does get super powers because that, air units against ground units gets super powers because that and CA module is broken because that as you can't surprise anyone.

 

It just happens so that the AI needs to be fixed so each unit has a simulated viewport and field of view and then a scan zone and reflexes.

 

Ie, sneak behind a transport aircraft and launch a IR missile without any radars or lasers and immediately flares are released and maneuvers started.

 

Or then the AI is just sitting duck when getting attacked and decide to stay still instead move closer to engage or to cover. But nothing can't be done with the current engine.

 

At ground it is silly how a buttoned down vehicle can spot aircrafts and fire at them from move without stabilization or even fire so accurately etc.

 

There is a code in DCS about spotting units by angle, speed, lights, visibility etc values but doesn't seem to work correctly always.

 

Sometimes at night it is possible use AWACS to sneak behind AI flights but once you turn radar on or launch IR missile all is ruined.

 

But some day, maybe in 2 weeks this gets fixed...

[Fri13]

I would say that the biggest issue is the airborne AI seeing 360 degrees. It's impossible to come close and do a sneak attack, even from 6 o' clock low.

 

My suggestion is not only to limit field of view for fighter AI, but also detection probability/angle/range depending on type of aircraft.

 

For example F-16 and P-51D AI would have higher situational awareness than MiG21 and BF109 AI.

 

The field of view changes are required, but so is many flight AI tactics, like putting a flight in combat mode to fly straight should automatically set wingman and lead randomly to perform a combat turns to check if someone is at six, or when radar is used at long ranges, wingman to separate to check the situation from a another angle.

 

It should be that correct tactics and maneuvers are defaults, and if someone wants to make flight to fly stupidly and dangerously, they need to disable the realism in mission editor between waypoints.

[Stratos]

Even a damn BMP-2 have enough super powers to shoot you down at ridiculous speeds and distances.

[Justificus]

...

 

But some day, maybe in 2 weeks this gets fixed...

 

LOL I saw what you did there. ;)

[ebabil]

yeah ai sees everthing. when i fly my huey , my co pilot sees every single infantry and opens fire like crazy. (can't hit most of the time )

also infanteries can see and open fire to us. only idiot is me , just fly here and there then get hit.

[Aginor]

+ 6.022*10²³

 

This was reported again and again, for years.

To be honest I lost any hope that it will ever change years ago.

[Oceandar]

+ 6.022*10²³

 

This was reported again and again, for years.

To be honest I lost any hope that it will ever change years ago.

I remember in Lomac day that I could do sneak attack on a pair of F-16 in Lomac stock mission (don't remember the mission ).

[Kenan]

+ 6.022*10²³

 

This was reported again and again, for years.

To be honest I lost any hope that it will ever change years ago.

 

I agree. Very little has changed in this department, which is kinda frustrating.

I wish one day I wouldn't have to create triggers and add actions and stuff, just to be able to have AI act naturally i.e. as the situation would dictate.

 

For example, do an intercept/sneaking up on a military jet which does not have radar or any airborne or ground control guidance, especially if I'm flying with my radar OFF.

 

That kind of stuff right now, is basically impossible without artifically "instructing" AI how to behave under certain conditions. If you don't do that, it'll know you're there, and it would immediatelly turn around and head straight for a kill.

[lmp]

The aircraft AI is not exactly all seeing, you can sneak up on it. For example the F-5E (not the playable F-5E-3, but the old one) has no RWR and I managed to pretty consistently intercept it with radar on in the MiG-21bis without alerting it. The AI is too good at spotting targets, but not perfect.

[blkspade]

I was pretty sure this AI behavior was changed a while ago. Unless they changed something in a recent patch, they had made changes to where the AI was relying on sensors and cockpit line of sight.

[Fri13]

I was pretty sure this AI behavior was changed a while ago. Unless they changed something in a recent patch, they had made changes to where the AI was relying on sensors and cockpit line of sight.

 

They did change how the ground fire was aimed. It isn't anymore directly straight at you but with "loosen reticle". Or like to say, they fire at larger area of you.

 

This was done so people could do a simple cannon run with A-10 or Su-25 against MBT that otherwise used their 12.7mm HMG at roof to directly shoot you down without aiming errors.

 

But still, LAV-25 is like deadly, aiming and firing you without any problems. And that vehicle has only one axis stabilized and is even worse than BMP-2 (that actually has fairly good stabilization, but can't see around well).

 

I would like to see a change in those, that would make every ground unit dangerous and realistic to fly near by, if they would actually fire bursts straight line instead try to track the target all the time. So choose a intercept point and fire a burst, choose a another and fire a burst, repeat. And then do that even for around the aircraft so the pilot might not be aimed at by everyone but lead flying all around forcing to maneuver and maneuver would be dangerous as you have lots of lead around you so you might fly to them.

That would force pilots to take a distance and deny the easy attack runs without feeling like you are shot down every time.

 

Not it is like idiots are firing because you do a low level fly or dive and suddenly ground units takes a lead and as it is under the ground, they as well shoot at the ground! Or some even shoot like 30 degree to totally wrong direction like blind ones!

 

 

Same is with the fighters, you don't much see them firing off-you, instead near perfect hits regardless of the skill levels. Of course it is fairly easy just to use modern jet and maneuver so crosshair is on target and squeeze but would be nice to see some G-effects stressing out and so that combat comes little more challenging.

[AG-51_Razor]

Can they still see through the clouds?

[grunf]

Can they still see through the clouds?

Not if it's a full overcast. I'm not sure if the small clouds obstruct the view in less than full cloud cover.

[Kev2go]

Even a damn BMP-2 have enough super powers to shoot you down at ridiculous speeds and distances.

 

yes i was unpleasantly surprised when i decided to go guns runs on a bmp 2 in the A10C. Just within gun range, as i press the triger, i then hear= a thud, Both engines on fire, MFCDS shut down, i got hits by its its AGTM missile ( unless dcs has unique secret modification of bmp2 armed a remote manned Manpad system) i expected to recive some cannon fire, but honestly being hit by its agtm never happened before. Last thing id expect.

 

 

abosulitely certain it was the bmp as there were no missile units of any sort, based on what i had placed via mission editor.

 

Although then did google to see if it was realisitc, found this

 

http://www.inetres.com/gp/military/cv/inf/BMP-2.html

 

it could use it in theory as self defence against a low flying aircraft, though it doesnt mention just how lethal it would be ( since its meant for entirely different purpose)

Edited November 5, 2016 by Kev2go

[Bogey Jammer]

More than one time recently I could fire an IR missile to the back of AI units without being detected…

 

Seriously more tests have to be performed to determinate the AI's situation awareness effectiveness.