Valve Index Hands On

[Svsmokey]

(Sigh) if only the Rift S approached the build quality of the Index . I so do not want to leave the Oculus system , but feel I'm being forced into Steam VR by the Lenovo Rift . The additional pixels will make my 1070 unhappy as well , i'm afraid . I've even been contemplating just staying with my Rift , and upgrading cpu/motherboard etc .

[Nagilem]

@svsmokey - there are times when I wonder if I should just stick with the o+ for sure. The world isn't too bad :)

[Svsmokey]

@svsmokey - there are times when I wonder if I should just stick with the o+ for sure. The world isn't too bad :)

 

True that ! The CV1 has brought me many happy hours , and no headaches .

Edited June 12, 2019 by Svsmokey

[imacken]

None of these 1.5 VR headsets are that much better than the original Rift. When I played with my first VR headset back in 2015 (I had sampled demos before that), it was like 'wow'. The Index is just a refinement of the Vive Pro, just like the Rift S is a refinement of the Rift.

 

I would have to disagree with that. For me, going from the Rift to the Vive Pro last year was a huge step forward in terms of text readability, cockpit dial clarity and overall image quality.

[Supmua]

Vive Pro with optimal resolution setting (either Steam SS 150% or DCS PD 1.4) provides pretty good image fidelity. I can’t go back to the original Vive or Rift afterward.

[imacken]

Vive Pro with optimal resolution setting (either Steam SS 150% or DCS PD 1.4) provides pretty good image fidelity. I can’t go back to the original Vive or Rift afterward.

 

You should be able to ramp it up a bit more.

I use SS 200% and PD 1.5 with MSAA off and most settings high except flat shadows in cockpit and terrain.

Steady 45fps with motion smoothing on.

[RealDCSpilot]

Holy sh** there is a lot of false information spread here by AureliusAugustus. Looks like a Facebook shill.

[Waxer]

Holy sh** there is a lot of false information spread here by AureliusAugustus. Looks like a Facebook shill.

 

And you are?

 

As for AureliusAugustus, it is free advice. Take it or leave it. With a grain of salt, or a bucket of salt. Personally I think what he said makes a lot of sense and he has tested all of the VR headsets he is talking about on a top end rig... look at his PC system stats. I am glad for his well informed advice. (And he does not say the high spec VR sets are bad... just that they are so good, even a high end PC can't drive them past what the Rift S is achieving with its refinements on existing tech).

[9echo]

Holy sh** there is a lot of false information spread here by AureliusAugustus. Looks like a Facebook shill.

 

 

 

What Milou said. Generally I would recommend arguing against others with relevant arguments based on (preferably observable) facts, rather than "attacking" others claiming they spread false information without backing up your claims. At the very least argue why you think it is false information. What you wrote has no credibility in its current form, nor is it constructive.

[Supmua]

You should be able to ramp it up a bit more.

 

I use SS 200% and PD 1.5 with MSAA off and most settings high except flat shadows in cockpit and terrain.

 

Steady 45fps with motion smoothing on.

 

 

 

I’ll probably spend days messing around with all the setting parameters (Vive Pro) against the Index when I have it in my hand. It seems they’ll also patch in the 144 Hz mode soon after release.

 

My initial goal is to see whether I can get 60 FPS in 120 Hz mode with motion smoothing on. But even 40 FPS should still be judder free in that mode since it is a factor of 3.

[p1t1o]

Holy sh** there is a lot of false information spread here by AureliusAugustus. Looks like a Facebook shill.

 

If you look up the definition of "shill" and then look at the structure and content of this comment, its quite funny :D

[gabgio]

If you look up the definition of "shill" and then look at the structure and content of this comment, its quite funny :D

 

Indeed, I had to check the meaning of shill myself

 

Holy sh** there is a lot of false information spread here by AureliusAugustus. Looks like a Facebook shill.

Well, would the good sir care to elaborate?

[RealDCSpilot]

Okay, you asked for it:

 

We are talking about the Valve Index and DCS in VR in this thread.

 

Some hardware facts first, will be needed later:

 

- the Index is developed and made only by Valve (also developer of SteamVR software and hardware like the "Lighthouse" base stations (these are laser emitters, not tracking cameras))

 

- panel RGB stripe(!) LCD, resolution 1440x1600 per eye (same res like Vive Pro/Odyssey+ but much higher pixel density through RGB stripe matrix)

 

- max FOV up to 130° (Rift is 90-95°, Vive/Vive Pro is 100-110°)

 

- new audio concept: bms nearfield speakers instead of headphones

 

Some basics:

 

The VR compositor rendertarget setting for the VivePro's panels, 1440x1600 per eye = 100% supersampling is 2468 x 2740 per eye (internal upsampling to make proper use of the panel's subpixels) on a 2080ti. For old gen HMD's (Vive) panel res per eye is 1080 x 1200 and 100% supersampling leads to 1512x1680 per eye (on Rift 1344x1600).

 

A quick comparison: for a Vive Pro your GPU has to push 2x 6.762.320 (13.524.640) pixels in under 11 ms to achieve and hold 90 Hz, the old gen (Vive) only needs to push 2x 2.540.160 (5.080.320) pixels. Old Rift is even lower with 4.300.800. That's a huge difference, not only mathematically also visually!

 

---

 

Now about AureliusAugustus's statements which gave me a lot of questionmarks, showing that he isn't very well informed (even about the most obvious stuff) or hasn't detailed technical knowledge but claims to have "reviewed" the Index HMD.

 

Post#2

 

"It is very similar and a little bit nicer than the Vive Pro or the Samsung Odyssey Plus. It is made by HTC and feels very much like a Vive Pro 1.5 side grade."

 

extremely subjective: 2

false information: 1

 

How can better optics, higher FOV, higher pixel density panels, in some cases much higher refresh rates and the new audio system be just "a bit nicer" than the Vive Pro etc.???

How can someone miss that the Index has nothing to do with HTC? If you are interested and working with VR, there is no way that you missed information that is known for almost a year now.

 

"...no video card yet made can push the Index to very high settings at a Pixel Density above 2.0. (If you overclock a 2080 Ti, run high settings and hit a PD of 2.2 for example, your frame rates fall into the low to mid twenties on the Batumi map with the F-18 Hornet)."

technical nonsense: 1

 

Why would someone want to do such crazy thing and push PD over 2.0 ??? This means forcing your GPU to render 29.754.208 pixels with PD on 2.2 - this is totally nonsense! No wonder that frame rates drop to the ground.

I have my VivePro/2080ti combo running at 1.3 PD and SteamVR SS at 100% (that's 17.582.032= 2x 8.791.016 pixels per frame). DCS is on highest settings, except antialiasing completely disabled (MSAA is a stoneage method with a crowbar, it just costs too much performance compared against the gain of image quality). My frame times are around 16/17 ms which is something around 60fps, with motion smoothing i have a very playable experience and the image is very clear and i can read the gauges very well.

Now, here is the thing - when i will get my Index HMD i will be able to run the same settings/performance very easily and profit from the better pixel density of the new panels. On top i'll get higher FOV - the ability to look around with my eyes without moving my head, a much appreciated feature for a flightsim. Also i can try to tweak the performance of motion smoothing by running the HMD's 80 Hz mode.

 

Post#4

 

"...so I can read the print on my damn instruments without squinting and invoking magical spells." (running with PD over 2.0)

i don't know what to say: 1

 

I can read the damn instruments pretty well, for over a year now. Thanks to a panel resolution of 1440x1600.

 

Post#83

 

"I'm not trying to dampen anyone's enthusiasm for the Index but I have been fiddling with it..."

"...Visual wise, remembering that the ceiling for what any VR HMD can show us is a single 2080 Ti card (or Titan if you wipe your ass with dollar bills), you will be pulling high 20s or low 30 FPS with pixel density set at 1.3 to 1.5 and most settings on high. That is all the 2080 Ti can feed it. You will go no higher. You cannot achieve a pixel density of say, 2.2 with mostly high settings. If you do, you will get about 9 to 11 FPS."

 

technical nonsense: 1

 

He is still trying to push 2.2 PD, i have no idea why... This way no HMD with a 1440x1600 or higher panel will be able to run the game well at PD 2.2.

My rig reaches much higher fps than 30, he may need to optimize his system a little more before testing a highend VR HMD. Maybe his enthusiasm will rise a bit after that.

 

"Now, some of you might be saying, "Well, that is not too bad.", but you are forgetting that you must use the temperamental Steam VR to get it working. Having played with the Index now for about 14 hours of testing, I can say the overall experience is just not as nice as the Rift S, which has lower specs on paper. The Index is very much like the Samsung Odyssey Plus, in performance, in spec and in headaches. Also remember, the Odyssey Plus is about $300 but the Index full kit is $1000. That is a huge difference for almost no real discernable gain. The sound is a tiny, tiny bit better in the Index versus the O+ and I like the full manual IPD adjustments of the Index better, ... BUT is that worth $700 to you?"

 

extremely subjective: 4

 

I have SteamVR beta running since 2016, never had a problem. My system is very clean and i keep it this way. For example i start SteamVR and DCS after that, no headaches on a Vive and later on a VivePro.

When it comes to pricing... about 50% of the PCVR community runs a SteamVR system (Vive, Vive Pro, Pimax ... there are enough charts out there that show how the market is divided, Facebook vs. SteamVR vs. WMR) For DCS in VR those 50% have only to pay 499$ for the best VR hardware upgrade atm.

 

"I have mentioned this before, paper specs don't mean sh#!."

 

Oh yes, they mean a lot, but only if you know what you are doing with the tech. Having running WMR in the background and trying to test a native SteamVR HMD may not be the best proving ground...

 

Post#87

 

"But specifically for DCS World 2.5.5 and the Rift S is the better headset. The overall experience of flying with the Rift S, with a 110 deg FOV at say, a pixel density of 2.2 with upper 20s to low 30s FPS with everything set close to maximum beats the 130 deg FOV of the Index, at a pixel density of 1.4 with upper 20s to low 30s FPS for the Index."

 

technical nonsense: 1

 

Let's have a look:

Rift S - panel resolution per eye = 1280x1440, rendertarget on 100% (x1.0 supersampling) is 1648x1776 = only 5.853.696 pixels to push (the old Vive runs already at 1512x1680!) which is extremely low compared to a VivePro with 2468 x 2740 for instance. A PD of 2.2 on a Rift S leads to ~12.878.131 pixels (!) this is still under VivePro standard (13.524.640) PD at 1.0. No wonder the game runs higher frame rates on a 2080ti with a RiftS, the whole comparison/testing parameters are completely nonsense. With the Index he should have tried to set the PD in DCS to 0.9 to meet something around the same rendered pixel density like the Rift S.

 

Post#91

 

"That said, I do not see any near future situation where the Index delivers anything above the upper 20s to low 30s FPS with a Pixel Density of around ~ 1.4 with mostly high settings under a single 2080 Ti."

 

technical nonsense: 1

 

Yeah, because it doesn't need to. It has much more pixeldensity than a Rift S, put it in 80Hz mode for DCS, play with PD settings from 0.9 to 1.5 (2080ti recommended) and benefit from much clearer/sharper picture and much higher FOV, better calibrated colors and contrasts. That is what the Index was build for.

 

Post#92

 

Subjective stuff again, Rolex name dropping blabla... As i already said, 50% of the exisiting PCVR community have a modular designed VR system at home. It's called Steam VR and to upgrade to Rolex VR just costs them 499,- (just the HMD to play DCS for instance).

Further he wants to run the Index with a PD of 2.3 at 90 Hz now, it's getting more ridiculous...

 

Post#94

 

Same... Rolex blabla Index 600$ ...

 

Post#98

 

Mixing different HMD's with different panels and PD again...

 

Post#100

 

"No way to push ANY VR LCD screen above 1600 pixels to 1.5 or more pixel density in DCS World at high settings with 30 FPS or more in next two years I suspect."

Alright, maybe i'm already living in the future...

 

Post#101

 

Excellent idea, what could be the reason for SLI not working in VR? Are they mocking us? Do they block it on purpose? Or is it more complicated than you think?

 

Post#102

 

Rift S... poor on paper ... better than Index ... better on paper ...blablabla

 

Post#106

 

I had a 1080ti, my 2080ti performs around 30% better which is a lot for a GPU if you know how to judge it. It was quite expensive ofcourse :)

 

Post#108

 

Actually, i have no idea why his system performs this bad... (he should give ProcessLasso a try)

 

Post#112

 

"One thing, I have not mentioned previously in any of my posts is the tracking cameras that the Index requires. Once I installed my Rift S at home and got to remove the 3 tracking sensors and their finicky cables taking up USB 3.0 slots I was a very happy camper."

 

technical nonsense: 3

misinformation: 1

 

What is he talking about? The Index requires 2 laser emitters called base stations. They are not cameras at all. They don't need USB ports and no cable mess. He is talking about a Rift setup here, mixing stuff up again. Wtf?

 

Post#123

 

"None of these 1.5 VR headsets are that much better than the original Rift. ..."

bullshit: 10

 

This guy is unbelievable...

Edited June 12, 2019 by Alec Delorean

[Icebeat]

Okay, you asked for it:

 

We are talking about the Valve Index and DCS in VR in this thread.

 

Some hardware facts first, will be needed later:

 

- the Index is developed and made only by Valve (also developer of SteamVR software and hardware like the "Lighthouse" base stations (these are laser emitters, not tracking cameras))

 

- panel RGB stripe(!) LCD, resolution 1440x1600 per eye (same res like Vive Pro/Odyssey+ but much higher pixel density through RGB stripe matrix)

 

- max FOV up to 130° (Rift is 90-95°, Vive/Vive Pro is 100-110°)

 

- new audio concept: bms nearfield speakers instead of headphones

 

Some basics:

 

The VR compositor rendertarget setting for the VivePro's panels, 1440x1600 per eye = 100% supersampling is 2468 x 2740 per eye (internal upsampling to make proper use of the panel's subpixels) on a 2080ti. For old gen HMD's (Vive) panel res per eye is 1080 x 1200 and 100% supersampling leads to 1512x1680 per eye (on Rift 1344x1600).

 

A quick comparison: for a Vive Pro your GPU has to push 2x 6.762.320 (13.524.640) pixels in under 11 ms to achieve and hold 90 Hz, the old gen (Vive) only needs to push 2x 2.540.160 (5.080.320) pixels. Old Rift is even lower with 4.300.800. That's a huge difference, not only mathematically also visually!

 

---

 

Now about AureliusAugustus's statements which gave me a lot of questionmarks, showing that he isn't very well informed (even about the most obvious stuff) or hasn't detailed technical knowledge but claims to have "reviewed" the Index HMD.

 

Post#2

 

"It is very similar and a little bit nicer than the Vive Pro or the Samsung Odyssey Plus. It is made by HTC and feels very much like a Vive Pro 1.5 side grade."

 

extremely subjective: 2

false information: 1

 

How can better optics, higher FOV, higher pixel density panels, in some cases much higher refresh rates and the new audio system be just "a bit nicer" than the Vive Pro etc.???

How can someone miss that the Index has nothing to do with HTC? If you are interested and working with VR, there is no way that you missed information that is known for almost a year now.

 

"...no video card yet made can push the Index to very high settings at a Pixel Density above 2.0. (If you overclock a 2080 Ti, run high settings and hit a PD of 2.2 for example, your frame rates fall into the low to mid twenties on the Batumi map with the F-18 Hornet)."

technical nonsense: 1

 

Why would someone want to do such crazy thing and push PD over 2.0 ??? This means forcing your GPU to render 29.754.208 pixels with PD on 2.2 - this is totally nonsense! No wonder that frame rates drop to the ground.

I have my VivePro/2080ti combo running at 1.3 PD and SteamVR SS at 100% (that's 17.582.032= 2x 8.791.016 pixels per frame). DCS is on highest settings, except antialiasing completely disabled (MSAA is a stoneage method with a crowbar, it just costs too much performance compared against the gain of image quality). My frame times are around 16/17 ms which is something around 60fps, with motion smoothing i have a very playable experience and the image is very clear and i can read the gauges very well.

Now, here is the thing - when i will get my Index HMD i will be able to run the same settings/performance very easily and profit from the better pixel density of the new panels. On top i'll get higher FOV - the ability to look around with my eyes without moving my head, a much appreciated feature for a flightsim. Also i can try to tweak the performance of motion smoothing by running the HMD's 80 Hz mode.

 

Post#4

 

"...so I can read the print on my damn instruments without squinting and invoking magical spells." (running with PD over 2.0)

i don't know what to say: 1

 

I can read the damn instruments pretty well, for over a year now. Thanks to a panel resolution of 1440x1600.

 

Post#83

 

"I'm not trying to dampen anyone's enthusiasm for the Index but I have been fiddling with it..."

"...Visual wise, remembering that the ceiling for what any VR HMD can show us is a single 2080 Ti card (or Titan if you wipe your ass with dollar bills), you will be pulling high 20s or low 30 FPS with pixel density set at 1.3 to 1.5 and most settings on high. That is all the 2080 Ti can feed it. You will go no higher. You cannot achieve a pixel density of say, 2.2 with mostly high settings. If you do, you will get about 9 to 11 FPS."

 

technical nonsense: 1

 

He is still trying to push 2.2 PD, i have no idea why... This way no HMD with a 1440x1600 or higher panel will be able to run the game well at PD 2.2.

My rig reaches much higher fps than 30, he may need to optimize his system a little more before testing a highend VR HMD. Maybe his enthusiasm will rise a bit after that.

 

"Now, some of you might be saying, "Well, that is not too bad.", but you are forgetting that you must use the temperamental Steam VR to get it working. Having played with the Index now for about 14 hours of testing, I can say the overall experience is just not as nice as the Rift S, which has lower specs on paper. The Index is very much like the Samsung Odyssey Plus, in performance, in spec and in headaches. Also remember, the Odyssey Plus is about $300 but the Index full kit is $1000. That is a huge difference for almost no real discernable gain. The sound is a tiny, tiny bit better in the Index versus the O+ and I like the full manual IPD adjustments of the Index better, ... BUT is that worth $700 to you?"

 

extremely subjective: 4

 

I have SteamVR beta running since 2016, never had a problem. My system is very clean and i keep it this way. For example i start SteamVR and DCS after that, no headaches on a Vive and later on a VivePro.

When it comes to pricing... about 50% of the PCVR community runs a SteamVR system (Vive, Vive Pro, Pimax ... there are enough charts out there that show how the market is divided, Facebook vs. SteamVR vs. WMR) For DCS in VR those 50% have only to pay 499$ for the best VR hardware upgrade atm.

 

"I have mentioned this before, paper specs don't mean sh#!."

 

Oh yes, they mean a lot, but only if you know what you are doing with the tech. Having running WMR in the background and trying to test a native SteamVR HMD may not be the best proving ground...

 

Post#87

 

"But specifically for DCS World 2.5.5 and the Rift S is the better headset. The overall experience of flying with the Rift S, with a 110 deg FOV at say, a pixel density of 2.2 with upper 20s to low 30s FPS with everything set close to maximum beats the 130 deg FOV of the Index, at a pixel density of 1.4 with upper 20s to low 30s FPS for the Index."

 

technical nonsense: 1

 

Let's have a look:

Rift S - panel resolution per eye = 1280x1440, rendertarget on 100% (x1.0 supersampling) is 1648x1776 = only 5.853.696 pixels to push (the old Vive runs already at 1512x1680!) which is extremely low compared to a VivePro with 2468 x 2740 for instance. A PD of 2.2 on a Rift S leads to ~12.878.131 pixels (!) this is still under VivePro standard (13.524.640) PD at 1.0. No wonder the game runs higher frame rates on a 2080ti with a RiftS, the whole comparison/testing parameters are completely nonsense. With the Index he should have tried to set the PD in DCS to 0.9 to meet something around the same rendered pixel density like the Rift S.

 

Post#91

 

"That said, I do not see any near future situation where the Index delivers anything above the upper 20s to low 30s FPS with a Pixel Density of around ~ 1.4 with mostly high settings under a single 2080 Ti."

 

technical nonsense: 1

 

Yeah, because it doesn't need to. It has much more pixeldensity than a Rift S, put it in 80Hz mode for DCS, play with PD settings from 0.9 to 1.5 (2080ti recommended) and benefit from much clearer/sharper picture and much higher FOV, better calibrated colors and contrasts. That is what the Index was build for.

 

Post#92

 

Subjective stuff again, Rolex name dropping blabla... As i already said, 50% of the exisiting PCVR community have a modular designed VR system at home. It's called Steam VR and to upgrade to Rolex VR just costs them 499,- (just the HMD to play DCS for instance).

Further he wants to run the Index with a PD of 2.3 at 90 Hz now, it's getting more ridiculous...

 

Post#94

 

Same... Rolex blabla Index 600$ ...

 

Post#98

 

Mixing different HMD's with different panels and PD again...

 

Post#100

 

"No way to push ANY VR LCD screen above 1600 pixels to 1.5 or more pixel density in DCS World at high settings with 30 FPS or more in next two years I suspect."

Alright, maybe i'm already living in the future...

 

Post#101

 

Excellent idea, what could be the reason for SLI not working in VR? Are they mocking us? Do they block it on purpose? Or is it more complicated than you think?

 

Post#102

 

Rift S... poor on paper ... better than Index ... better on paper ...blablabla

 

Post#106

 

I had a 1080ti, my 2080ti performs around 30% better which is a lot for a GPU if you know how to judge it. It was quite expensive ofcourse :)

 

Post#108

 

Actually, i have no idea why his system performs this bad... (he should give ProcessLasso a try)

 

Post#112

 

"One thing, I have not mentioned previously in any of my posts is the tracking cameras that the Index requires. Once I installed my Rift S at home and got to remove the 3 tracking sensors and their finicky cables taking up USB 3.0 slots I was a very happy camper."

 

technical nonsense: 3

misinformation: 1

 

What is he talking about? The Index requires 2 laser emitters called base stations. They are not cameras at all. They don't need USB ports and no cable mess. He is talking about a Rift setup here, mixing stuff up again. Wtf?

 

Post#123

 

"None of these 1.5 VR headsets are that much better than the original Rift. ..."

bullshit: 10

 

This guy is unbelievable...

 

+100

[9echo]

There you go, exactly what I was hoping for personally! I have no clue about VR, but I have to say I too raised an eyebrow hearing him talk about playing with 20-30 fps, I mean; how is that an enjoyable experience?

 

Thanks for the elaboration!

[UncleZam]

Supersampling is nice technology, but cannot substitute real pixels. That's why I would always use high resolution display with lower PD over low res display with higher PD.

[Nagilem]

@Alec DeLorean - I think the one x factor here is not the Index but DCS. I see your settings and have used similar but have still had many issues getting a stutter free experience with my O+, which has the same resolution (albeit OLED not RGB Stripe). Using the SteamVR for WMR motion reprojection indicator, I am constantly seeing both the CPU and GPU bound lights on regardless of where I am flying, even though MSI shows the CPU and GPU not over 50%. Overall I average 45FPS with the beefy hardware I have, but suspect the rendering engine is the culprit. I fully admit it also could be WMR so my fingers are crossed that the Index (being native steam) gives a better experience that way.

Edited June 12, 2019 by Nagilem

[RealDCSpilot]

@Nagilem

 

did you try this? https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3411425&postcount=1

 

 

DCS has CPU affinity problems, i needed to sort them out with Process Lasso. It worked wonders for me. GPU usage around 50% is not normal, i'm at ~90% most of the time. Check your Nvidia driver settings, esp. energy management, disable vsync and set texture quality to "high performance".

I also use MSI afterburner: powerlimit 120, temperature limit 88°C, Core Clock with OC Curve (via OC scan)

Edited June 12, 2019 by Alec Delorean

[p1t1o]

Okay, you asked for it:

 

We are talking about the Valve Index and DCS in VR in this thread.

 

Some hardware facts first, will be needed later:

 

 

...<snikt>...

 

 

Post#123

 

"None of these 1.5 VR headsets are that much better than the original Rift. ..."

bullshit: 10

 

This guy is unbelievable...

 

 

 

1. Why was this not your first post, were we supposed to extrapolate all of that from a one liner?

 

2. You are not being as correct as you think you are and to top it off you are using theory against someone with practical experience (knowledge of statistics vs someone with an actual HMD) so your post has, maximum, ONLY as much merit as his.

 

3. Half your points exhibit the exact same flaws that you accuse others of, lots of subjective opinion and nitpickery.

 

4. So thanks for your input, it was an interesting read, I mean that, really, but you can dial back the snark, it is entirely un-earned.

[some1]

Yeah, because it doesn't need to. It has much more pixeldensity than a Rift S, put it in 80Hz mode for DCS, play with PD settings from 0.9 to 1.5 (2080ti recommended) and benefit from much clearer/sharper picture and much higher FOV, better calibrated colors and contrasts. That is what the Index was build for.

 

Idex claims to have 30-35% higher FOV than Rift S, while only having 25% higher resolution.

 

How did you come to a conclusion that Index has much more pixel density than Rift S and will offer much clearer picture?

[imacken]

Idex claims to have 30-35% higher FOV than Rift S, while only having 25% higher resolution.

 

How did you come to a conclusion that Index has much more pixel density than Rift S and will offer much clearer picture?

 

Index increased FOV is not at the expense of pixel density. It is achieved by angling the lenses and making them much closer to the eyes.

[p1t1o]

Index increased FOV is not at the expense of pixel density. It is achieved by angling the lenses and making them much closer to the eyes.

 

???

 

It is at the expense of pixel density...

 

I like the Index, it will probably be the one for me, but to be fair, you cannot move the screens closer without decreasing ppd, period.

 

If I had an HMD that was precisely identical to an index, except the screens slightly further from my eyes with a slightly lower FoV, I would certainly have better ppd.

 

Perhaps you simply are referring to the literal, physical pixel density of the displays?

That is far less relevant than a pixel-per-degree approach, which is what the Index sacrifices for greater FoV.

 

For example, it has te same resolution as the Vive Pro, but a much greater FoV, its ppd will actually be worse.

 

However, its stripe display with the better subpixel ararngement will offset this, so there will be some increasxe in visual fidelity, but not as clear cut as it could be - unless you also count FoV as part of "fidelity" which is perfectly arguable.

[Harlikwin]

Supersampling is nice technology, but cannot substitute real pixels. That's why I would always use high resolution display with lower PD over low res display with higher PD.

 

Yup. Thats why the Reverb will look the best out of the current contenders.

[imacken]

Yup. Thats why the Reverb will look the best out of the current contenders.

 

We’ll see about that. I’m looking forward to getting my Index. Then I’ll be able to make a direct comparison with the Reverb.

[RealDCSpilot]

 

This shows the screen utilization of one panel in the Index. No other HMD except StarVR One is able to show this much panel space through their optics. Look at the pre-distortion, it only starts far off the center. The optics will do the rest to show as much pixels as possible. This is how you show as much FOV as possible without the sacrifice of pixel density.

 

For comparison, look what happens in a Pimax HMD: https://forum.pimaxvr.com/uploads/default/original/2X/0/0d4762c319bffac052a0e05dbc6e6b3948d0420f.jpeg

 

 

The HP Reverb just shows a smaller panel with higher pixel density through 2016 style optics, resulting in a very small FOV. Testers said something around 85-90 degrees.