Hook to Eye distance

[IceFire]

Good evening fellas.

 

I noticed that in the Super Carrier trailer that the Hook-Eye distance for the F/A-18C was modeled on the PLAT cam view. Will this distance be set for the F-14 as well? Either manually or automatically?

 

The main reason I ask is that you have to hold about half a ball higher in the Tomcat to trap a 3, simply because the H.E. is shorter for the Hornet than the Tomcat.

 

Thanks!

Edited January 18, 2020 by IceFire

[IceFire]

 

 

:joystick::joystick::music_whistling::megalol::helpsmilie::helpsmilie::helpsmilie:

[Destroyer37]

ED?

[Mr. Big.Biggs]

My guess is it’s such a utterly ridiculous question they are still laughing! Its a friggen cartoon boat fellas!!!!

[Shimmergloom667]

My guess is it’s such a utterly ridiculous question they are still laughing! Its a friggen cartoon boat fellas!!!!

 

Yeah, no, it's not - it is supposed to be an accurate simulation of an RL boat. And I suppose that at some point during the EA of this module we will be able to set up the IFLOLS correctly for various birds.

[Weta43]

if You think about why the hook eye distance is bigger for the F-14, and what you already know the physical factors that are modelled, you probably have your answer ...

[Dakota]

Good evening fellas.

 

I noticed that in the Super Carrier trailer that the Hook-Eye distance for the F/A-18C was modeled on the PLAT cam view. Will this distance be set for the F-14 as well? Either manually or automatically?

 

The main reason I ask is that you have to hold about half a ball higher in the Tomcat to trap a 3, simply because the H.E. is shorter for the Hornet than the Tomcat.

 

Thanks!

 

Maybe a thread in the bug report or wish list will get some attention? Would be nice to have this modeled correctly.

[Mr. Big.Biggs]

My apologies. I was out of line. But c’mon. Although not perfect, its a great program. I just hate to see criticism after criticism. Too fast, too slow, to expensive, too cheap, no lug nuts blah

BUT, I had a bad morning and was out of line.

My apologies!

[remus77]

My apologies. I was out of line. But c’mon. Although not perfect, its a great program. I just hate to see criticism after criticism. Too fast, too slow, to expensive, too cheap, no lug nuts blah

BUT, I had a bad morning and was out of line.

My apologies!

 

Knowing Icefire personally, I guarantee he would agree 100% that "it's a great program". He runs one of the most respected wings in DCS, and wouldn't put a vast amount of his own free time if he didn't think so. Read the original post. He asked a good question because reporting issues is what we're encouraged to do when issues like this come up. There was no complaining. No "whining". You have some serious psychological issues to berate someone so badly for something so innocent.. bad morning or not. Good on you to apologize, but man....

[Mars Exulte]

Knowing Icefire personally, I guarantee he would agree 100% that "it's a great program". He runs one of the most respected wings in DCS, and wouldn't put a vast amount of his own free time if he didn't think so. Read the original post. He asked a good question because reporting issues is what we're encouraged to do when issues like this come up. There was no complaining. No "whining". You have some serious psychological issues to berate someone so badly for something so innocent.. bad morning or not. Good on you to apologize, but man....

 

 

[Mr. Big.Biggs]

Knowing Icefire personally, I guarantee he would agree 100% that "it's a great program". He runs one of the most respected wings in DCS, and wouldn't put a vast amount of his own free time if he didn't think so. Read the original post. He asked a good question because reporting issues is what we're encouraged to do when issues like this come up. There was no complaining. No "whining". You have some serious psychological issues to berate someone so badly for something so innocent.. bad morning or not. Good on you to apologize, but man....

 

Wow kind of extemis but I guess I earned it. To clarify my post and point however, it was not a personal attack on any one person. It was an ILLUSTRATION that people in this hobby accept plastic tools, cardboard cutouts and domestic surroundings, yet berate somebody that asks for a button or function that they view as helpful in their situation. Judgment goes both ways on this board yet the purists always hide behind the “its not a real function or button ‘argument to shut others down. Bottom line is its not real.

Again my apologies.

Edited January 18, 2020 by Mr. Big.”Biggs”

[Destroyer37]

I just want to know if we will be able to adjust the angle on the lense. Everything else in this thread is just nonsense.

[IceFire]

This has nothing to do with #realism... For this its #gameplay.

 

Hook to Eye distance is important because my meatball to get a 3 wire in an F14 needs to be different than an F18's meatball because my hook is lower and farther behind than an F18's. Which as I said was the reason you have to hold the meatball about 1/2 a ball high to avoid a 2 wire and hit the 3.

Edited January 19, 2020 by IceFire

[MRSHADO]

I haven't experienced the same problem with the current IFLOLS and the Tomcat, but I am curious about the Hook-to-Eye (H/E) ratio after seeing the trailer.

 

The Basic Angle and H/E ratio are depicted, and being able to adjust the roll angle of the source would be greatly welcomed for those of us planning to take advance of waving on the platform provided - would be a cool feature.

 

[Edit] Also :shifty: are those the correct numbers for a H/E of a Hornet?

Edited January 19, 2020 by MRSHADO

[Strikeeagle345]

I haven't experienced the same problem with the current IFLOLS and the Tomcat, but I am curious about the Hook-to-Eye (H/E) ratio after seeing the trailer.

 

The Basic Angle and H/E ratio are depicted, and being able to adjust the roll angle of the source would be greatly welcomed for those of us planning to take advance of waving on the platform provided - would be a cool feature.

 

[Edit] Also :shifty: are those the correct numbers for a H/E of a Hornet?

 

Well in my 450+ traps in the tomcat since it's release, my experience level with traps, I can tell you you absolutely have to hold a half a ball high for a 3 wire. Holding the ball centered you run the risk of grabbing the two wire. The hook is landing about where the two wire is when holding it center instead of landing center between the 2 and 3 wire like it should be.

 

There is a reason they changed this on the real boat when a tomcat or hornet was rolling in.

[MRSHADO]

Well in my 450+ traps in the tomcat since it's release, my experience level with traps, I can tell you you absolutely have to hold a half a ball high for a 3 wire. Holding the ball centered you run the risk of grabbing the two wire. The hook is landing about where the two wire is when holding it center instead of landing center between the 2 and 3 wire like it should be.

 

There is a reason they changed this on the real boat when a tomcat or hornet was rolling in.

 

I believe you.

[CoBlue]

I just want to know if we will be able to adjust the angle on the lense. Everything else in this thread is just nonsense.

Exactly! ED please give us an answer?

 

(I swear I herd Wags saying that it was going to be included in one of his videos). But I want confirmation.

[MRSHADO]

Edited January 19, 2020 by MRSHADO

[BarTzi]

 

I noticed that in the Super Carrier trailer that the Hook-Eye distance for the F/A-18C was modeled on the PLAT cam view. !

 

Based on the placeholder LSO camera (it's based on a picture you can find online), I wouldn't call this feature (or hook touchdown) complete or even working.

[IceFire]

Look, really the bottom line is this If I center the meatball, the hook is supposed to hit a certain spot on the deck give or take random things. The default Stennis does not do this except for the F18, I've done literally hundreds of traps in the F18 and upwards of a thousand in the F-14, was doing it long before the F14 released..

 

Centered ball on the F-18 means you hit the right spot on the deck.

 

Centered ball on the Tomcat means you're grabbing right on the two-wire, you have to hold it roughly half a ball high to get in the strike zone of the 3, that is fact and I can back it up.

Edited January 19, 2020 by IceFire
-

[IceFire]

 

Holding half a ball high until touch down, obviously the ball gets way more sensitive as you get closer but holding half a ball high from the start to at the ramp, this is what you see at the wires. you're thinking holy crap, 4 wire or bolter....

Think again..

 

 

 

These images are paused at the exact moment the hook hits the deck, same flight, same moment, no funny business.. So you guys tell me, does this look like a centered meatball? Looks about 2 balls high to me, that's an easy bolter and a trip around the boat in the Hornet. Tomcat that's the strike zone, so let me ask again. Hook to eye, ED?

 

For comparison, lets look at a Hornet flown the exact same way.

 

 

Bout 2 balls high.

 

 

This is flown the way I need to fly a Tomcat to get a 3 wire. The Hornet 2 balls high at the wires will give you a bolter. Sails right over the 4 wire, the Tomcat will give you a 3 wire trap...

 

 

Let me clear something up, I am a huge fan of ED and I understand completely if the limitations of the sim are what they are and this is not possible. If it is such then just tell us and I'll be happy to go back into my corner and fly the ball high, it really makes no difference to me. I'd just like to know if its gonna change, yes, or no?

Edited January 19, 2020 by IceFire

[Strikeeagle345]

 

So the H/E is wrong in the Super Carrier trailer?

Edited January 20, 2020 by Strikeeagle345

[Curly]

These images are paused at the exact moment the hook hits the deck, same flight, same moment, no funny business.. So you guys tell me, does this look like a centered meatball? Looks about 2 balls high to me, that's an easy bolter and a trip around the boat in the Hornet. Tomcat that's the strike zone, so let me ask again. Hook to eye, ED?

 

For comparison, lets look at a Hornet flown the exact same way.

 

Bout 2 balls high.

 

This is flown the way I need to fly a Tomcat to get a 3 wire. The Hornet 2 balls high at the wires will give you a bolter. Sails right over the 4 wire, the Tomcat will give you a 3 wire trap...

 

Let me clear something up, I am a huge fan of ED and I understand completely if the limitations of the sim are what they are and this is not possible. If it is such then just tell us and I'll be happy to go back into my corner and fly the ball high, it really makes no difference to me. I'd just like to know if its gonna change, yes, or no?

 

There are currently few things that are modeled incorrectly on the Stennis that lead to this issue. I'd really like to see more of them addressed too.

 

First, the meatball guides the Hornet to land with the hook touching down right on top of the three 3 wire. The spot where the hook touches down is know as the hook touchdown point. It's wrong on the current Stennis. The hook touch down point should be about half way between the two and three wire, on 4 wire boats. This allows some margin of error on the approach and room for the hook to rebound on impact.

 

Since the hook to eye distance is set for the Hornet; Any aircraft larger or smaller than the hornet will land with it's hook either aft or forward of the 3 wire. For every 1 foot difference in the hook to eye value, the hook touch down point moves forward and aft the runway 16.34 feet. The proof of which is some simple trigonometry; Tan of the glideslope (3.5) = 1/16.34. This is why you need to ride a hall ball down to catch a 3 wire in the Tomcat.

 

The Hornet's hook to eye is 16.35 and the Tomcat's is 19.70. The 3.35 foot difference in hook to eye means, the Tomcat's hook will land 54.73 feet behind where the Hornet's does. Since the wires are supposed to be 40 feet apart you would be looking at a two wire for a perfectly flown ball on the current Stennis in the Tomcat. However results may vary because the wires on the current Stennis are not the correct distance from each other. There is also a bit of a problem with the current implementation of the IFLOLS on the Stennis which adds to this problem.

 

The implementation of the IFLOLS is rudimentary. Each light has view angle of .13 degrees and if you're in that view angle, the whole light is lit. So at 1/2 mile you can move up and down 20 feet before the light jumps up to the next bulb.

 

That's not how it works in real life. In reality, when your looking at centered ball you're looking at light from two sources at the same time. Since this isn't possible in DCS, you can never really fly a truly centered ball. Which wouldn't matter as much if, the hook touchdown point was where it's supposed to be. All of it could be fixed though. Moving the hooktouch down point is just a matter of moving the optical glideslope forward or aft. Making the IFLOLS work more correctly could be achieved by, allowing two light to be on at once and splitting each light into 3 segments. I too would like to see more of this talked about by ED now that pre sales have begun.

 

 

Edited January 20, 2020 by Curly
Speeling and add image

[Curly]

That's CVN-76 which has 3 wires. The lens and H/E will have a different setup from the TDR Class.

Hook to eye is a characteristic of the aircraft, independent of the vessel landing on it. Hook to eye is always 16.35 no matter what boat it's landing on.

When hook to eye is changed, the roll angle of IFLOLS changes. This raises or lowera glideslope, though it stays at the same angle. The effect is to move the optical touchdown point forward or aft on the runway. That way no matter what size the aircraft the hook always lands in the same spot. About 20 feet aft of the target wire.

[The LT]

Er yeah, but for the fact that you fly it in your living room with a plastic joystick and throttle. At some point people just need to stop the bitching and be happy with what they have.

Grown ass dudes strap into cardboard cockpits with plastic joysticks then throw around a bunch of obscure crap to look important and complain.

Join the team and fix it or be happy that its not pong or galiga....

Really trying not to be “that guy” but for freakin cryin out loud!

 

Anyone asked you for your oh so important opinion? That's right, no one.