Low maneuverability at high altitudes

[zoranin73]

My question is how to evade missiles at high altitude because above 7000 m my plane is like sitting duck,I can t manouver like on lower altitudes and enemy is firing missiles from 9000 m or more on me?

[Bobik2002]

Air is more dense than in lower altitudes.

Edited August 20, 2020 by Bobik2002

[razo+r]

You could (depends on range) for example make a dive while throwing out chaff

 

Or make a half loop downwards (vertical 180)

 

Or probably other maneuvers as well.

[Yoshua]

Because the air at high altitudes is less dense. Your best bet is to turn away dive and throw some chaff out.

 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[draconus]

Air is more dense than in lower altitudes.

No - the other way around.

 

OP - first you should rather avoid not evade the missiles, especially when no terrain masking or notching is possible - minimum abort range. Otherwise it's risky game.

[zoranin73]

I fly on russian planes and in bvr on high altitudes with western planes armed with aim 120c active radar missile and I with semi active missiles meaning that if I hard dive I lose lock on enemy and if I manage to evade missile and somehow acquire lock again I m on lower altitude than my enemy and my missile has lower chance to hit him then his aim 120 from higher altitude,this so unfair because we don t have newer russian jets in game.I know for r 77 but I currently playing su 33 campaign.

[razo+r]

You can do following to make it "fair"

 

Shoot at maximum range to create panic / stress

 

Shoot an ET

 

Dive while keeping lock

 

Turn while keeping lock

 

Use terrain if possible

 

Let him waste missiles

 

Let allied assets help you

 

And do not forget that you can always abort, extend and re-engage when you want.

[zoranin73]

Dcs have genius missions in campains,for example mission which I play now,intercept four f 16 with aim120 c with my su 33 and two wingmans on 9000 m altitude in pitch dark(one of my wingman refusing to obey on my orders and charging on his own on enemy planes?).I don t know what genius is making these missions?

[ACME_WIdgets]

Use Airspeed Gauge , not TAS for performance estimation

 

My question is how to evade missiles at high altitude because above 7000 m my plane is like sitting duck,I can t manouver like on lower altitudes and enemy is firing missiles from 9000 m or more on me?

 

I fly teh Su27 and at high altitude I keep an eye on my Indicated Air Speed analog gauge (below HUD to left). At 9000m+ I try not to get below 400 km/h so that the plane "responds" to inputs from the stick.

IAS is a combo of air density and speed. It shows what the plane "thinks" its flying, relative to the air around it. The TAS shown on the HUD is similar to ground speed (without wind). The plane's control surfaces react to IAS, not TAS.

I also use IAS when doing steep climbs. Get below 300 km/h and you may loose control. Or hit the S key, yank the controls and hope for the best.

 

As many have stated elsewhere:

#1 high altitude hot-hot in BVR you will loose to the 120C most of the time (unless notching).

#2 Over flat ocean = BAD:doh:. In mountains/valleys = GOOD:thumbup:.

#3 ILL radar off, EO on, use AWACS for guidance, turn radar on ~60km to enemy to search.

#3 Turn on your ECM and they won't know you're diving for the deck (assuming 40+km).

[dundun92]

You need to learn to exchange speed and altitude fluidly. You need to know when the altitude is helping you, and when its not. You can absolutely enter the fight high over flat terrain you just need to learn how to employ and support ERs while defending AMRAAMs. Find out how close you can get to an AIM-120C carrier and evade his missiles with a crank + gimbal limit dive and start your gameplan there. Also, while against experienced pilots this wont work, vs the AI sneak LA override ET shots from long range and high alt are really effective.

[Raven (Elysian Angel)]

Dcs have genius missions in campains,for example mission which I play now,intercept four f 16 with aim120 c with my su 33 and two wingmans on 9000 m altitude in pitch dark(one of my wingman refusing to obey on my orders and charging on his own on enemy planes?).I don t know what genius is making these missions?

- A lot of the older campaigns might or might not work as originally intended, since DCS changed quite a bit since the time FC3 was introduced;

- The behaviour of the AI wingmen is not always a result of what the mission designer did or did not do (there are advanced waypoint actions that can offer some respite but they also don't always work as intended). The Artificial Intelligence (or lack thereof) is a serious problem in DCS. It's known and being worked on.

Meanwhile, there are a few ways to "abuse" the way it works now, with some experience. For example, AI enemy tends to favour the player aircraft, so keeping your wingmen back initially can be a good idea, so you can draw fire while they finish off the enemy aircraft.

Sometimes, you can do the other way around: send them in from afar while you stay back, circle around and finish them off.

AI wingmen are an asset to be used - and sometimes abused - yes it's immersion breaking but the AI wingmen are indeed quite stupid and at the moment there is no lack of them (you don't have a limited amount of wingmen available per campaign) so don't feel bad if you send them to their deaths...

[ZHeN]

My question is how to evade missiles at high altitude because above 7000 m my plane is like sitting duck,I can t manouver like on lower altitudes and enemy is firing missiles from 9000 m or more on me?

 

fly mach2

[Ironhand]

My question is how to evade missiles at high altitude because above 7000 m my plane is like sitting duck,I can t manouver like on lower altitudes and enemy is firing missiles from 9000 m or more on me?

Begin maneuvering as soon as you suspect that there is an AIM-120 coming in your direction. I normally begin a high speed snaking pattern, while trading altitude for airspeed. Keep your speed high and keep your target within your gimbal limits. Launch as soon as you are able to put him on the defensive and follow up as necessary. You should be successful about 9 out of 10 times in a 1v1.

 

EDIT: Latest Beta track attached. The maneuvering was not as smooth as it should have been but it got the job done, anyway. Just don't have the flight time I used to.

1v1.trk

Edited September 6, 2020 by Ironhand