Nobody Special Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 (edited) Simple BVR engagement: F-14B (there is an F-15C slot, but it was not occupied) against 2 Su-30s armed with R-27ER, -27ET, -77 and -73. The enemy group fired a single R-27ER (not ET) at me. I turned ECM off as soon as they burned through (when the RWR started to make noise again). As I climbed and launched my Phoenix, the launching aircraft turns away by at least 90 degrees, and my RWR went silent and did not sound again. I remained hot on the bandit, climbed through ~45k AGL at M1.2 when the missile hit me. I'm curious, what exactly was guiding it? SARH hit with no illuminator.trk Tacview-20210512-225539-DCS.zip.acmi Cacausus F14 vs 2 Sukhoi.miz Edited May 13, 2021 by Nobody Special Removed redundant image Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BreaKKer Posted May 13, 2021 Share Posted May 13, 2021 HOJ BreaKKer CAG and Commanding Officer of: Carrier Air Wing Five // VF-154 Black Knights Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Special Posted May 13, 2021 Author Share Posted May 13, 2021 Jammer was off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
near_blind Posted May 14, 2021 Share Posted May 14, 2021 Looks like the Flanker detects your launch via AI Space Magic, goes defensive, and then decides to turn back hot. I imagine at this point it has locked on to you again and is supporting the missile. I have noticed that if an airborne emitter disappears from your RWR, either because they turned away or because you maneuvered in such a way to occlude one of the receivers, it takes some time for the RWR to generate the shot warning, if it does it at all. I don't know if this is a feature of the RWR, or a bug. I hope it's a bug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Special Posted May 15, 2021 Author Share Posted May 15, 2021 23 hours ago, near_blind said: Looks like the Flanker detects your launch via AI Space Magic, goes defensive, and then decides to turn back hot. I imagine at this point it has locked on to you again and is supporting the missile. I have noticed that if an airborne emitter disappears from your RWR, either because they turned away or because you maneuvered in such a way to occlude one of the receivers, it takes some time for the RWR to generate the shot warning, if it does it at all. I don't know if this is a feature of the RWR, or a bug. I hope it's a bug. Can R-27ER re-acquire like that? Regardless I'd think the RWR should be providing warning if I were locked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
near_blind Posted May 17, 2021 Share Posted May 17, 2021 On 5/14/2021 at 11:27 PM, Nobody Special said: Can R-27ER re-acquire like that? Regardless I'd think the RWR should be providing warning if I were locked. SARH missiles in general have pretty generous conditions for reacquiring a lock right now (assuming they haven't been chaffed). The R-27ER might have some IRL features that also make it more capable in this regard. I was fooling around happened to witness an example the RWR behavior I was trying to describe Tacview-20210516-154051-DCS.zip.acmi In this I lose the lock warning when I over-rotate after my second shot, and I'm assuming occlude multiple antennae. The RWR seems to pick up the Fulcrum once I roll back out (I get a new contact tone and when I briefly glance at the RWR it shows a 29 emitter ahead), but I never get the lock tone again. The MiG-29 was never nose cold, and was locking me the entire way (as evidenced by the Alamo I end up eating). Like I said, I'm not sure if this is intended behavior or a bug. Maybe @IronMikecould chime in when he gets a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SspectrumM Posted July 2, 2021 Share Posted July 2, 2021 It's magic? it's science? what is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain_dalan Posted July 2, 2021 Share Posted July 2, 2021 9 hours ago, SspectrumM said: It's magic? it's science? what is it? Home-on-jam? Did you have your self protection jammers on? Modules: FC3, Mirage 2000C, Harrier AV-8B NA, F-5, AJS-37 Viggen, F-14B, F-14A, Combined Arms, F/A-18C, F-16C, MiG-19P, F-86, MiG-15, FW-190A, Spitfire Mk IX, UH-1 Huey, Su-25, P-51PD, Caucasus map, Nevada map, Persian Gulf map, Marianas map, Syria Map, Super Carrier, Sinai map, Mosquito, P-51, AH-64 Apache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SspectrumM Posted July 3, 2021 Share Posted July 3, 2021 Jammer was active, that makes any difference? R27-ER is suppoused to be a semi-active missile, it can't guide itself... right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain_dalan Posted July 4, 2021 Share Posted July 4, 2021 If it has home on jam capability then it will home in on your jammer emissions, like a passively guided missile. Hence, once in a burn-through range of an enemy radar, it's usually a good practice to turn-off your jammers. Modules: FC3, Mirage 2000C, Harrier AV-8B NA, F-5, AJS-37 Viggen, F-14B, F-14A, Combined Arms, F/A-18C, F-16C, MiG-19P, F-86, MiG-15, FW-190A, Spitfire Mk IX, UH-1 Huey, Su-25, P-51PD, Caucasus map, Nevada map, Persian Gulf map, Marianas map, Syria Map, Super Carrier, Sinai map, Mosquito, P-51, AH-64 Apache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealius Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 HOJ is the missile capability on SARH? I thought it was a capability of the host aircraft's radar, meaning if if the host radar drops lock for whater reason a HOJ SARH will still go stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draconus Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 It's missile's mode and that makes it fire-and-forget. Win10 i7-10700KF 32GB RTX3060 Rift S T16000M TWCS TFRP FC3 F-14A/B F-15E CA SC NTTR PG Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northstar98 Posted July 11, 2021 Share Posted July 11, 2021 (edited) 14 hours ago, Nealius said: HOJ is the missile capability on SARH? I thought it was a capability of the host aircraft's radar, meaning if if the host radar drops lock for whater reason a HOJ SARH will still go stupid. If there's a jammer (more specifically an OECM jammer - think noise/barrage jamming), the missile basically just acts as an ARM - it's not reliant on the host aircraft's RADAR at all. Though most fighter aircraft probably only have DECM systems, which due to the techniques they use, would render HOJ missiles less effective (especially if the threat RADAR has been destroyed). Edited July 11, 2021 by Northstar98 1 Modules I own: F-14A/B, Mi-24P, AV-8B N/A, AJS 37, F-5E-3, MiG-21bis, F-16CM, F/A-18C, Supercarrier, Mi-8MTV2, UH-1H, Mirage 2000C, FC3, MiG-15bis, Ka-50, A-10C (+ A-10C II), P-47D, P-51D, C-101, Yak-52, WWII Assets, CA, NS430, Hawk. Terrains I own: South Atlantic, Syria, The Channel, SoH/PG, Marianas. System: GIGABYTE B650 AORUS ELITE AX, AMD Ryzen 5 7600, Corsair Vengeance DDR5-5200 32 GB, Western Digital Black SN850X 1 TB (DCS dedicated) & 2 TB NVMe SSDs, Corsair RM850X 850 W, NZXT H7 Flow, MSI G274CV. Peripherals: VKB Gunfighter Mk.II w. MCG Pro, MFG Crosswind V3 Graphite, Logitech Extreme 3D Pro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshZeCorgi Posted July 17, 2021 Share Posted July 17, 2021 (edited) That being said, if you had maneuvered hard or/and put the missile on your 3-9 line while your jammer was still on, the missile would have had a decent chance of missing, either by running out of energy or being rate-defeated, this is because when in HOJ mode, the missile does not lead the target, but goes into pure pursuit, if the angle is high enough and missile energy is low enough, it simply will not be able to hit you. That being said, it is still a good idea to turn off jamming, but just know your death is not an absolute certainty with jamming on. I've dodged HOJ missiles with barrel rolls and putting the missile on my 3-9 line. Give it a try with mission editor. Edited July 17, 2021 by WelshZeCorgi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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