missing info JTAC -> Waypoint ->WPDSG -> TGP ->Coordinates OK - CCD garbage = Laser Garbage

[Captain Orso]

I'm trying to drop a GBU-12 onto coordinates given by JTAC (lasing not possible) and using Litening II TGP for lasing.

 

I input the coordinates, including ground height, given by JTAC into HSI into waypoint #5 and add waypoint #5 to SEQ2.

 

Returning to the HSI page I select and box SEQ2, then dial in waypoint #5 and press OSB next to WYPT to box it. Then I press the OSB next to WPDSG to box it - boxed WYPT is replaced by boxed TGT. So far, so good.

 

Open FLIR page and the target in the upper left corner are the exact coordinates as waypoint #5 including height. However, the CCD Designated Target Diamond is not locked to the target point; it is wandering across the ground. The coordinates in the upper left corner remain exact as they were from the beginning and are exactly equal to the waypoint #5 coordinates.

 

Of course, since the CCD Designated Target Diamond is wandering across the ground, when I drop a GBU-12 when the laser turns on, it to is wandering across the ground and the bomb hits... wherever.

 

What am I doing wrong?

[MTrenda]

i had this same behavior when the waypoint was behind a mountain.  the diamond appeared to be moving but in actuality the ground in front of the way point was moving as i flew closer and closer to the target.  eventually the target area behind the hills appeared and i was able to see the targets clearly.  Not sure this is the same thing but could be if the targets are in a valley of some sort.

 

a video or track would be helpful 

 

Thanks

Falcon 

[Captain Orso]

Thanks for the reply.

 

I thought that too at first, but watching the CCD from several miles out until the bomb hits and I'm looking almost straight down; definitely no hills in the way.

 

I don't have a track, unfortunately. Forgot to save it.

[Hulkbust44]

Thanks for the reply.
 
I thought that too at first, but watching the CCD from several miles out until the bomb hits and I'm looking almost straight down; definitely no hills in the way.
 
I don't have a track, unfortunately. Forgot to save it.

Which FLIR, and what tracking mode?

Mobius708

[Captain Orso]

2 hours ago, Hulkbust44 said:

Which FLIR, and what tracking mode?

Mobius708
 

".. using Litening II TGP for lasing"

 

I'm not changing the tracking mode. It's still in SCENE mode. If you change the tracking mode to area track the LOS/crosshairs ground stabilizes to the where the crosshairs are pointing at that moment, but since the crosshairs have been wandering the entire time, they are not pointing at the TGT coordinates, and that is the issue. After designating the waypoint as a target, the TGP should automatically slave to that TGT point. On the FLIR page the displayed coordinates in the upper left corner are correct and to not change with the crosshairs wandering across the landscape, and apparently the crosshair designate where the laser will point to. so the entire process is mut because the laser is not pointing at the TGT point.

 

The more I think about this, the more I realize that this always used to work perfectly. The only difference now is that the waypoint was not entered in the Mission Editor, but rather I entered it manually after having receive the coordinates from the JTAC. But even that -- more or less -- I've done countless times, only having received the coordinates through some mechanism in the mission, or through "Satellite Recon" (using the F10 map to find a target, position your camera over the target and reading the position coordinates from Info Bar). Coordinates obtained in these methods are then entered into a waypoint and then the waypoint is designated as a target at the appropriate time.

 

Generally I almost always I have to use the TDC to sweeten the aim but I don't recall that it is ever wandering across the landscape when I open the FLIR page. Now I cannot sweeten the aim because in this case the target is mortar infantry in woods and I cannot see them.

 

The only thing that I've been able to get to work, was to pull up the waypoint coordinates in HSI -> DATA -> WYPT and then in the FLIR page use the TDC to move the crosshairs to as close as possible to the coordinates by reading the coordinates in the upper left corner of the FLIR page. It's a real time consuming PITA and certainly not they way it's supposed to work. But once the coordinates are synchronized like this, the laser is spot on target the the bomb hits exactly where it should.

[Recluse]

I had this happen recently. Was going crazy trying to figure it out. What I think was happening is that the axis I had mapped for TDC slew was wandering and taking the cursor along with it.  After some fiddling I got it re-center.

 

Not sure that is what is happening for you, but definitely check your axis drift.

 

 

[oldcrusty]

8 hours ago, Captain Orso said:

".. using Litening II TGP for lasing"

 

I'm not changing the tracking mode. It's still in SCENE mode. If you change the tracking mode to area track the LOS/crosshairs ground stabilizes to the where the crosshairs are pointing at that moment, but since the crosshairs have been wandering the entire time, they are not pointing at the TGT coordinates, and that is the issue. After designating the waypoint as a target, the TGP should automatically slave to that TGT point. On the FLIR page the displayed coordinates in the upper left corner are correct and to not change with the crosshairs wandering across the landscape, and apparently the crosshair designate where the laser will point to. so the entire process is mut because the laser is not pointing at the TGT point.

 

The more I think about this, the more I realize that this always used to work perfectly. The only difference now is that the waypoint was not entered in the Mission Editor, but rather I entered it manually after having receive the coordinates from the JTAC. But even that -- more or less -- I've done countless times, only having received the coordinates through some mechanism in the mission, or through "Satellite Recon" (using the F10 map to find a target, position your camera over the target and reading the position coordinates from Info Bar). Coordinates obtained in these methods are then entered into a waypoint and then the waypoint is designated as a target at the appropriate time.

 

Generally I almost always I have to use the TDC to sweeten the aim but I don't recall that it is ever wandering across the landscape when I open the FLIR page. Now I cannot sweeten the aim because in this case the target is mortar infantry in woods and I cannot see them.

 

The only thing that I've been able to get to work, was to pull up the waypoint coordinates in HSI -> DATA -> WYPT and then in the FLIR page use the TDC to move the crosshairs to as close as possible to the coordinates by reading the coordinates in the upper left corner of the FLIR page. It's a real time consuming PITA and certainly not they way it's supposed to work. But once the coordinates are synchronized like this, the laser is spot on target the the bomb hits exactly where it should.

 

I tested the Litening pod today on the latest OB, at night using both MavF and MavE, on static and moving targets. The FLIR was rock steady. The MavF was a different story but... there is a method to every madness.

I used JTACs for lasing static targets (2 tanks) and LTD/R for movers using MavE.

I also used JTACs with MavF on statics, punching in 6 digit grid given to me. I also had 10 digit grid on the same location pre-programmed as one of my waypoints, just to verify how much the JTAC's directions varied. The altitude given by JTAC was 120 feet higher and the grid within 50 feet. Close enough to get the FLIR on it and refine.

 

The only time I've seen the FLIR drifting (in the last few months) when I designated the target via HMD reticle, watching the FLIR on RDDI slowly drifting away from the designated target.

This was an acknowledged bug and I think still is.

Post a vid if you can. 

Here are my tests if you feel like watching... kinda boring but it shows Litening pod performing very well.

 

https://youtu.be/nJm4SFx7i34

https://youtu.be/jbUsw0-IvlQ

 

Edited July 27, 2021 by Gripes323

[Captain Orso]

Management Summary: Enter the waypoint height correctly and everything works.

 

Thank you to everyone who took their time to have a look at my issue. It really had me stymied. I went back and looked everything over an over and re-ran the mission many times, until I realized that the FAC is giving the height/altitude in feet and I was entering it in the waypoint in meters...  <- Me

 

Many thanks again.

[AstonMartinDBS]

On 7/27/2021 at 6:24 AM, Gripes323 said:

The only time I've seen the FLIR drifting (in the last few months) when I designated the target via HMD reticle, watching the FLIR on RDDI slowly drifting away from the designated target.

This was an acknowledged bug and I think still is.

AFAIK this annoying bug has been fixed already.

 

On 7/26/2021 at 9:33 PM, Captain Orso said:

Generally I almost always I have to use the TDC to sweeten the aim but I don't recall that it is ever wandering across the landscape when I open the FLIR page. Now I cannot sweeten the aim because in this case the target is mortar infantry in woods and I cannot see them.

Did you try it also in PRECISE Mode?

 

On 7/27/2021 at 11:54 AM, Captain Orso said:

...until I realized that the FAC is giving the height/altitude in feet and I was entering it in the waypoint in meters...  <- Me