what happens with the anti ship missiles? C-802Ak

[fergrim]

On 11/1/2021 at 3:48 PM, spacemishka said:

As workaround you might shoot at a closer distance. I had setup a mission with an AI JF-17. It shot on a Tarawa at max distance and both missiles missed it by 20miles. Fired At a distance of 60miles both locked on. But the warhead is poor as well compared to the RBS-15.

The RBS is a Viggen anti surface missile, right? If you can't equip an RBS-15 on the JF-17 then what is the relevance?

Like, alert, everyone stop buying ammunition for your ar-15, it's weak compared to 7.62.

It's not even like the Viggen itself is a viable stand in for the JF-17, or vice versa.  One is basically dedicated anti-naval air to surface, and the other is a strike fighter with considerable air to surface capability besides.  If they had zero CAP and were making a beach landing, bring on the viggens, but if they have any air support whatsoever then the JF-17 would fit the multirole there quite comfortably.

 

though of course, both is always a great idea

[spacemishka]

vor 23 Stunden schrieb fergrim:

The RBS is a Viggen anti surface missile, right? If you can't equip an RBS-15 on the JF-17 then what is the relevance?

no.... i just mean for Anti-Ship the Viggen is my choice over the JF-17. The kill probabilty of the RBS is just higher and the warhead has also an performance advantage.

[Riojano]

802 sould be close to the RB15, almost the same amount of HE warhead (if i remember well 3 usable in game ASM are around 200kg +/-10kg), same piercing first stage warhead (Harpoon doesnt have this)  and both are seaskimming (again, Harpoon dont do that), but you found that 802 in game dont do SS and fly like harpoon even higher sometines, has a ridiculous high RCS, and now not working self radar.

[Foogle]

5 hours ago, Riojano said:

802 sould be close to the RB15, almost the same amount of HE warhead (if i remember well 3 usable in game ASM are around 200kg +/-10kg), same piercing first stage warhead (Harpoon doesnt have this)  and both are seaskimming (again, Harpoon dont do that), but you found that 802 in game dont do SS and fly like harpoon even higher sometines, has a ridiculous high RCS, and now not working self radar.

The RB-15 has a massively oversized warhead in-game, it's 4000lbs in the games files IIRC, this is to cause ships to immediately sink. Abstracting how ships go down is something that needs to be worked on in the game, because ships usually take days to burn and sink, unless hit by something that breaks the keel or they take significant damage below the waterline. 

 

All that to say, don't base anything off the RB-15, it's 'cheated' the system so ships sink in a timely fashion. 

Edited December 2, 2021 by Foogle
Dislexiya

[Cdodders]

On 12/1/2021 at 8:18 AM, uboats said:

Try to use MED size for Ivanov cargo and LAR for perry

What about a Burke?

[609_Relentov]

I was doing some limited testing, what I found so far w/regard to the TGT setting, from my kneeboards:

 

• Set TGT (R5): SML/MED/LAR; Target size now needs to be set properly or missile radar may not lock onto ship

• SML: Speed boat or similar size (will not lock onto larger ships)

• MED: Cargo Ivanov or larger size (most consistent in locking onto most ships)

• LAR: Tanker Elnya or larger size (won't consistently lock onto larger ships)

[uboats]

see attached one

ship rcs and 802ak target size setting.pdf

[Cdodders]

On 12/5/2021 at 1:50 AM, 609_Relentov said:

I was doing some limited testing, what I found so far w/regard to the TGT setting, from my kneeboards:

 

• Set TGT (R5): SML/MED/LAR; Target size now needs to be set properly or missile radar may not lock onto ship

• SML: Speed boat or similar size (will not lock onto larger ships)

• MED: Cargo Ivanov or larger size (most consistent in locking onto most ships)

• LAR: Tanker Elnya or larger size (won't consistently lock onto larger ships)

I did a little testing, and LAR is needed for it to pick up a Burke

[609_Relentov]

Sounds good - since Uboats posted that document, I will add it to my JF-17 kneeboards.

[diditopgun]

Hello,

Target size is described as INOP in the module's manual:

Quote

 

6. Target size selection

Target size preference (INOP)

 

I spent all my afternoon to understand why C-802AK work against some ships but not others, until I found the answer here...

Manual should be update when new features are released.

Thanks.

Edited April 2, 2022 by diditopgun

[uboats]

On 4/2/2022 at 11:46 AM, diditopgun said:

Hello,

Target size is described as INOP in the module's manual:

I spent all my afternoon to understand why C-802AK work against some ships but not others, until I found the answer here...

Manual should be update when new features are released.

Thanks.

 

Yup, the official one update is still WIP. The target size is added in Chuck’s guide. You can read that first.

[DropBear64]

On 11/29/2021 at 11:38 AM, SebastianR said:

The only way to hit a target is set TGT to "MED". "SML" and "LAR" don't work

Nope it's now 13/11/22 and they still don't work. They won't lock on to ships and they then fly over 200nm at over 30 thousand feet. Useless. When is this fix being done. It's all well and nice to release new airframes however if ED take on the responsibility for the Jeff then they should fix the code.

[BigBorner]

For me, they work as intended 8/10 times. Anti ship is my go to if I want a not so demanding sortie in MP 

[DropBear64]

On 11/13/2022 at 11:42 PM, BigBorner said:

For me, they work as intended 8/10 times. Anti ship is my go to if I want a not so demanding sortie in MP 

Well unfortunately for me and many others they dont work. Tried a custom mission today against a Rezky. Fired in Direct mode after selecting the ship in Sea1 mode on radar. Tried different setting low/medium/ high, skim and popup, CC and EFF and in all cases the missile flies over the target and then proceeds to climb. It travels a further 200nm and reaches altitude of 35K ft or more. Its still broken when will fix be out??

[uboats]

cannot reproduce, it's better to share trk

also try to use cruise alt low

[Hiten Bongz]

My main complaint with these anti-ship missiles is they often target ships that are already sinking, or even completely sunk ...even when I have a different ship locked up. There should be some sort of target deconfliction.

 

Also a lot of times if I launch two at two different ships, they go for the same one.

[DropBear64]

OK I've done a lot of testing and here is what I've found (Thanks to Uboats for the table linked above). So C802AK works fine in single player, unfortunately in multiplayer its where it all goes wrong. In single player I can get consistent hits. However, in multiplayer it does not track, and the missile starts to climb and goes supersonic and climbs to altitudes that my Jeff would be jealous. It was a Molniya class vessel, so I selected Medium had the cruise set low, selected popup, locked the ship in Sea1 radar and fired when within 38nm. What else can I do? I think they are bugged in multiplayer and in single player they are not.

I've created a link to a video I have made of my attack showing the settings and the result. Sorry tried to Zip it but the file size remains the same (4.5GB). The track file was too big also so the video should be enough for you to see what I mean. Here is the link:

https://1drv.ms/v/s!At_nbKtqEqsVhNs_-5Wuml2CelLKVg

[uboats]

2 hours ago, DropBear64 said:

OK I've done a lot of testing and here is what I've found (Thanks to Uboats for the table linked above). So C802AK works fine in single player, unfortunately in multiplayer its where it all goes wrong. In single player I can get consistent hits. However, in multiplayer it does not track, and the missile starts to climb and goes supersonic and climbs to altitudes that my Jeff would be jealous. It was a Molniya class vessel, so I selected Medium had the cruise set low, selected popup, locked the ship in Sea1 radar and fired when within 38nm. What else can I do? I think they are bugged in multiplayer and in single player they are not.

I've created a link to a video I have made of my attack showing the settings and the result. Sorry tried to Zip it but the file size remains the same (4.5GB). The track file was too big also so the video should be enough for you to see what I mean. Here is the link:

https://1drv.ms/v/s!At_nbKtqEqsVhNs_-5Wuml2CelLKVg

for Monlya, i think the target size should be SML. the sheet might be out of date

RCS<30000 SML

RCS>=60000 LAR

[DropBear64]

If you watch the end of the video, you can see the missile traveling at supersonic speeds and climbing to ridiculous heights. Surely that should be fixed. I'll try small on the Molniya. However, in Multiplayer I've had these missiles miss a lot more than this ship. Can you try them in multiplayer and tell me what happens for you?

Thanks for your time and the update.

 

Cheers

[DropBear64]

Thanks Uboat. Using your table and the new cross esection figures i.e. RCS<30,000 and RCS >60,000 i'm now getting 100% hits......thanks for your help and knowledge CHAMPION