AMD 5800X3D, the new King for flight simulators?

[DeltaMike]

On 5/5/2022 at 12:49 PM, M1Combat said:

I think you can run Liberation on a dedicated server on another core if you have the mem for it.

I don't

My server has 8GB of RAM and it's gagging on bigger Liberation missions, gonna try upgrading to 16.  My main box only has 32GB of RAM

I imagine if you already have 64GB of RAM the 3D would be the shiznit

[Biggus]

One of the fun things about the AM4 stuff has been that along with ease of upgrading my gaming box from 3600XT to 5800X, the old parts were pretty easily turned into a dedi server box.  Looks like my dedi server box will be getting the current 5800X soon after that review, thanks @Voyager.

Liberation was still a bit rubber-bandy on a dedi server instance on my gaming rig, but it's been rock solid running on the server box.

[Gogojuice]

I can't seem to find the information I'm looking for on the web.. so I thought I would come here.

I have an amd 2700x and looking to upgrade.  I fly in VR (Rift S), and have a 2080ti.  Would the 5800X3d be a good choice, or is my gpu to old?

 

Thanks in advance  

[Biggus]

2080ti is still a good GPU.  Right now if you were going to upgrade from that, I'd say to wait until after the next generation is released.  A 5800X3D is a great upgrade from your 2700X though.

[TED]

6 hours ago, Gogojuice said:

I can't seem to find the information I'm looking for on the web.. so I thought I would come here.

I have an amd 2700x and looking to upgrade.  I fly in VR (Rift S), and have a 2080ti.  Would the 5800X3d be a good choice, or is my gpu to old?

 

Thanks in advance  

I agree with biggus. With a 5800x3d paired with your 2080ti you should be able to release some nice gains and get a good bit more out of your gpu in vr. Right now you are probably cpu limited in most cases with vr, so this should allow you to be gpu limited instead and push some settings further, especially for mp. 

[DeltaMike]

yeah 2080ti is a beast with the Rift S, there's not much more to squeeze out of that headset

I would think any situation that would benefit from the 3D would call for at least 32Gb of decent (3200MHz+) RAM

[j9murphy]

I have a 2080ti and a 9700k overclocked to 5Ghz on every core... and I'm still GPU bound.   Free flight in Caucus is around 10ms in cpu and 14-15ms in gpu, more complicated scenery ups the gpu to 20-25ms. Multiplayer is a different story though, cpu times are much higher, but generally trail gpu times.  I've often wondered if I were to upgrade only the CPU or only the GPU or only the VR headset which would make the bigger difference... I'm guessing GPU in my case, but would probably need to be a 3090 or ti in order for it to be noticeable?  in either case I think I'll wait for the next generation of Intel/Nvidia before touching anything... it's crazy expensive to do a complete new rebuild including an aero:) OpenXR has helped a lot though...

Edited May 12, 2022 by j9murphy

[edmuss]

Mine should hopefully arrive end of the month, it'll be interesting to see how the 3070 behaves with more CPU to drive it. Probably not make a spot of difference

[Gogojuice]

Thanks for all the help.

I really don't want to build a new computer, as I would need a new motherboard (possibly ddr5).  Perhaps a rebuild later?  I have the 32gb 3200 cl14 ram. 

 

My thought process based on the comments (pls chime in if you think this is a bad idea) is to go 5800x3d..  save money and get better gpu and then VR next gen.  Im hoping the cpu will have more longevity than the gpu/cpu...especially once they go to vulkan?

 

Does that make sense?

[edmuss]

@Gogojuice I'll report back in here as to what sort of increase I get.  I have a pretty similar powered system to you (just newer generation) with the overclocked 3600 and 3070.

I'm not expecting much increase in FPS but it should drop the CPU bottlenecks significantly to keep the GPU more engaged.  If you can wait a couple of weeks then I should hopefully have it installed and can give some feedback with the lower level GPU.

The way I see it, when the mining bubble pops and we start seeing 3090/6900xt available for 20 quid a piece () then I can slot one in and not have the CPU holding it back.  I think it'll give a good extension of life to the venerable AM4 sockets

[DeltaMike]

6 hours ago, j9murphy said:

I have a 2080ti and a 9700k overclocked to 5Ghz on every core... and I'm still GPU bound.   Free flight in Caucus is around 10ms in cpu and 14-15ms in gpu, more complicated scenery ups the gpu to 20-25ms. Multiplayer is a different story though, cpu times are much higher, but generally trail gpu times.  I've often wondered if I were to upgrade only the CPU or only the GPU or only the VR headset which would make the bigger difference... I'm guessing GPU in my case, but would probably need to be a 3090 or ti in order for it to be noticeable?  in either case I think I'll wait for the next generation of Intel/Nvidia before touching anything... it's crazy expensive to do a complete new rebuild including an aero:) OpenXR has helped a lot though...

GPU times go up with CPU times, suspect a lot of that is the GPU 

 

You should be well below 22ms on cauc single player to give yourself enough headroom to play Syria or MP.  You're close though, shouldn't take much.

GPU upgrade will help you push textures and resolution, and may make msaa possible but it won't do squat for mp

 

[Gogojuice]

1 hour ago, edmuss said:

@Gogojuice I'll report back in here as to what sort of increase I get.  I have a pretty similar powered system to you (just newer generation) with the overclocked 3600 and 3070.

I'm not expecting much increase in FPS but it should drop the CPU bottlenecks significantly to keep the GPU more engaged.  If you can wait a couple of weeks then I should hopefully have it installed and can give some feedback with the lower level GPU.

The way I see it, when the mining bubble pops and we start seeing 3090/6900xt available for 20 quid a piece () then I can slot one in and not have the CPU holding it back.  I think it'll give a good extension of life to the venerable AM4 sockets

Ya, No problem waiting.  I can't even find one up here in Canada close to me.  Looking forward to your findings.  

 

[attyla_pl]

Comaprison between Ryzen 5600X vs Ryzen 5800X3D

Graphics card Radeon 6900XT, 32 GB DDR4 15-15-15-36

All mission singleplayer, after mission start running autostart airplane and waiting.

F16 Island style

https://imgur.com/jcrtDZ8

 

F18 Supercarier Cold start

AH-64 Scud Buster

CPU frametime !!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 13, 2022 by attyla_pl

[Cab]

5 hours ago, attyla_pl said:

Comaprison between Ryzen 5600X vs Ryzen 5800X3D

Graphics card Radeon 6900XT, 32 GB DDR4 15-15-15-36

All mission singleplayer, after mission start running autostart airplane and waiting.

F16 Island style

https://imgur.com/jcrtDZ8

 

F18 Supercarier Cold start

AH-64 Scud Buster

CPU frametime !!!

Those numbers look pretty good.

So you think upgrading from a 5600X is worth it?

[some1]

I also swapped my 5900X to 5800X3D today, paired with RTX3080 10GB and 64GB of 3600MHz RAM. I didn't do any complex benchmarks, but I loaded two missions which I identified previously as CPU limited places, and checked them before and after the swap, in both 2D and VR. 

First test was the 8th mission from A-10C Iron Flag campaign, sitting on the tarmac at Nellis AFB with dozens of aircraft and static objects around. In 2D, the new CPU gave a large increase in FPS, from 80 to 104 (30% gain). In VR it lowered the CPU frametime from around 33ms to roughly 27ms, (18% gain), but that's still not enough for a smooth experience. DCS being DCS. 

Second test was a simple practice mission in AH-64D, sitting on the ground with full overcast and FLIR overlay on the IHADSS. In 2D the new CPU made no difference, actually I lost 1-2 FPS. GPU remained underutilized at 90%, so the bottleneck is elsewhere. In VR the CPU frametime went down noticeably from ~15ms to ~11ms, and I gained a few FPS. But that again was not enough to give enough headroom for reprojection to kick in. I think in this scenario I'm mostly limited by GPU VRAM. 

Before/after shots with FPS VR here: https://imgur.com/a/iEgchC5

[attyla_pl]

22 hours ago, Cab said:

Those numbers look pretty good.

So you think upgrading from a 5600X is worth it?

Yes, if your graphics card does

3080/3090/R6800/R6900

[Cab]

8 hours ago, attyla_pl said:

Yes, if your graphics card does

3080/3090/R6800/R6900

I do have a 6900.

Thanks for the report.

[TED]

I also have a 6900xt and the 5800x3d works wonderfully with it. Especially if you have tuned the 6900 a bit and are using openXR. 

[edmuss]

I'll let you know how crap it is with a 3070

[PD919]

When you play a busy mission with a lot of objects, the 5800x3d makes a huge difference from the 5800x.  I'm cpu bound less often.  I have motion smoothing always on because of DCS's frame pacing issues.  If the multithreaded optimization allows us to hit 90 FPS at low settings, will again become GPU bound.

[Spectre1986]

Does anyone have a reference to how the 5800X3D compares with any Intel in DCS VR (G2 and Index)?

I'm on a:
i7-8086K@5.1Ghz
32Gb@3.6Ghz
3090

The i7-8086K is the same as the i5-10600K, so it is still pretty good. I'm planning on waiting for 13th gen\new Ryzen before doing a new build so I'm just curious where my rig lines up.

[M1Combat]

Yes.

 

What I've seen tells me that if you are GPU limited then it's a bit faster (was very surprised by how much...).  If you are CPU limited then it's quite a bit faster.

[peachmonkey]

so ..

5900x + 3090+3600mhz16cal 
vs 
5800x3D + 3090+3600mhz16cal
 

who wins at VR in DCS?

[M1Combat]

The 3D I'm pretty sure...  By more than you probably think.

 

I don't have all those parts myself but what I have seen seems to support my claim.  Or I'm mis-remembering...  You should give this very thread a perusal...

[nikoel]

Currently 5800X3D is the best processor for flight simulators. So there is no point in comparisons other than ascertaining by how much it's better