Did the 144Hz monitor make some better feeling of smoothness?

[SilentSierra]

Did the 144Hz monitor make some better feeling of smoothness?

Or 60Hz is the best you can get on DCS?

Edited December 24, 2022 by SilentSierra

[razo+r]

It will feel smoother compared to a 60 Hz one IF your PC manages to put out the "required" 144 FPS

Edited December 24, 2022 by razo+r

[SilentSierra]

I am considering purchasing a 3070 ti with Ryzen 7 5800X3D, mabe archive this FPS average, running full HD.

Edited December 24, 2022 by SilentSierra

[okopanja]

With 60Hz, you need to limit FPS to 60 in order to avoid tearing.

With 144Hz + freesync/g-sync, you will not have such problem, so in theory you will be able to achieve maximal FPS without artifacts.

[Pilotasso]

Being 144Hz monitors is a necessary condition for smoothness but by itself in not enough. You need:

-That the monitor has reduced motion blur.

- When you got that checkbox checked, you need a graphics card that can at least maintain 144 Frames second to match the monitors refresh rate. You can do that with a 1440p with current day high end GPU's but for 4K you there is only one GPU up for the task. Guess which one.

Also take in consideration the panel technology and their strengths:

-VA typically have great contrast but bad viewing angles and for motion blur but there are exceptions (for blur). One of them is the Samsung Neo G7, and that's even faster at 165Hz.

-TN panels are super fast and affordable but their colors and contrast suffer.

-IPS typically has the best viewing angles but contrast suffers. Fast ones are very expensive though.

OLED/QLED, best image quality overall, but I am not a fan of the burn in anxiety. They are also expensive.

 

here's a few videos to get you started:

 

Edited December 25, 2022 by Pilotasso

[Tiger-II]

6 hours ago, okopanja said:

With 60Hz, you need to limit FPS to 60 in order to avoid tearing.

Not true.

It depends entirely upon how your display updates pixels. Mine only changes the pixels that changed; not the entire display. Screen tearing is a symptom of raster displays (old CRT) and lower quality LCD displays.

"Gaming" monitors are pretty poor for the money they charge. I use a 4K TV and have a much better display than friends who paid twice as much for a "gaming monitor".

Edited December 25, 2022 by Tiger-II

[okopanja]

4 hours ago, Tiger-II said:

Not true.

It depends entirely upon how your display updates pixels. Mine only changes the pixels that changed; not the entire display. Screen tearing is a symptom of raster displays (old CRT) and lower quality LCD displays.

"Gaming" monitors are pretty poor for the money they charge. I use a 4K TV and have a much better display than friends who paid twice as much for a "gaming monitor".

 

I gather that you are playing the games with not many pixel changes(mineweeper?). Which model do you use and which panel technology does it use?

Edited December 25, 2022 by okopanja

[SilentSierra]

My budget is limited. The CPU and VGA that I can afford it is not the high end to run in high resolutions.

I found a monitor 27" Full HD 144Hz 1ms G-Sync IPS for a good price and it is very recommended by the customers.

My question about 144Hz is more if it will make any difference in DCS World that is my main "game".

I play some FPS, I know that probably I will be more responsive playing with this monitor.

[okopanja]

52 minutes ago, SilentSierra said:

My budget is limited. The CPU and VGA that I can afford it is not the high end to run in high resolutions.

I found a monitor 27" Full HD 144Hz 1ms G-Sync IPS for a good price and it is very recommended by the customers.

My question about 144Hz is more if it will make any difference in DCS World that is my main "game".

I play some FPS, I know that probably I will be more responsive playing with this monitor.

Hi Sierra, I bought relatively cheap 34'' monitor (3440x1440) which supports Freesync and can go up to 144Hz. The limit in your case is actually imposed by DCS and depends on lots of factors.

In SP you can expect higher frame rates as long as your hardware is capable enough. E.g. my PC can achieve 90 FPS

In MP, the frame rate will drop due:

1. shear number of objects
2. server latency
3. network latency

This drop will in most cases be sever enough you will not never reach the FPS your hardware is really capable of.

Generally wide and Ultrawide monitors give you better field of view which improves your situational awareness. Some people even go with 4K TV sets, but I personally prefer to keep something of normal size.

Another thing to consider is the pixel size. Physically larger monitor will give you l larger pixel for the same resolution. This is normally undesirable property, since smaller pixels give you an nice picture. However, in DCS you can expect issues with visual spotting, especially at edge of VWR. DCS renders aircrafts as infamous black pixels at this range. With 4K monitor you might not be able to spot this as easily as with HD monitor. So in this case, one could say that having a larger pixel size is actually a benefit. E.g. GS for instance to great lengths to maximize his spotting ability. I personally did choose the middle way.

I did some analysis in this respect and considered what is good or bad for me, see the picture below (sorry I live in Europe and think in metric units).

Furthermore some of the monitors offer the ability to boost sharpness of your picture, this will degraded the picture, since it will produce secondary artifacts, but the spotting will be way easier. I would suggest against using modes that create small zoom window, since this is something to be considered as cheating. I personally prefer fateful picture.

You should also consider if you are using this monitor for your own work, since ultra wide provides additional benefit of allowing you to place 2 or more windows next to each other (4K is similar experience, but with 2 rows).

I would suggest to select a monitor that is really certified by NVIDIA G-sync. I opted for Freesync, non-certified panel, which in turn caused that in some games this works well and in some not.

Laptop is something that you buy for many years and you should have that in mind, but you should also be price aware.

If you play with the laptop, I would suggest to test monitor before buying. Prices ranges are huge, and generally the more expensive monitor gives more features and better picture.

 

Edited December 25, 2022 by okopanja

[agrasyuk]

On 12/24/2022 at 4:34 PM, AirMeister said:

60 hz is quite terrible even for browsing the internet. 

You can actually see some sort of strobing effect, very exhausting for the eyes. Like a bad fluorescent light 

My work monitor is business grade Dell that runs IPS panel at 60hz (5120x1440). I spend long hours staring at it and I love the sharpness and color. no special eye fatigue. DCS looks great on it as well, although it only used for testing purposes. My main sim uses pair of projectors  that are, again, 60Hz and I love the visuals

I suspect the quality of panel/monitor is your issue, not 60Hz. 

It might be how they were set up in store , but EVERY fast "gaming" monitor that I've seen on display has sh...t colors. for  me Color > Refresh rate.

Edited December 28, 2022 by agrasyuk

[BuzzU]

I have an Asus VG27A, 2560x1440, 144-165Hz monitor. I lock it at 70fps. It looks really good and runs smooth. I just play in SP. Would I gain anything by running in 144fps?

[silverdevil]

8 minutes ago, BuzzU said:

I have an Asus VG27A, 2560x1440, 144-165Hz monitor. I lock it at 70fps. It looks really good and runs smooth. I just play in SP. Would I gain anything by running in 144fps?

hello. i can only share what i do /did. i have a widescreen dell for a couple years and i run it at native resolution and native refresh at 120Hz. i went from a 60Hz 1920x1080 and it was a huge difference. especially spotting targets. i do not believe refresh rate really affects that.

null

[BuzzU]

I also came from a 1080 21" 60HZ monitor. The 1440 made a huge difference. I sit real close, so 27" is as big as I can go. I'll try 144fps and see if I can see a difference.

[LucShep]

On 12/24/2022 at 10:31 PM, okopanja said:

With 60Hz, you need to limit FPS to 60 in order to avoid tearing.

On 12/25/2022 at 5:07 AM, Tiger-II said:

Not true.

It depends entirely upon how your display updates pixels. Mine only changes the pixels that changed; not the entire display. Screen tearing is a symptom of raster displays (old CRT) and lower quality LCD displays.

"Gaming" monitors are pretty poor for the money they charge. I use a 4K TV and have a much better display than friends who paid twice as much for a "gaming monitor".

 

Yep!  
I also prefer 4K/60Hz TVs (QLED or OLED, preferentially) for Flight/ Racing/ Mil simulations.

Anything that is fluid, or less frantic pace than the "chicken-with-no-head-crazy-pace" esport games, you don't really need ubber-refresh gaming monitors (expensive!) at all.

Image quality and size (bigger resolution and size = more real estate) is far more important, IMO.

You can use Scanline-Sync, and you won't even miss FreeSync/G-Sync VRR features (lacking on most TVs).
Here, one uses V-Sync OFF in game options, and Vertical Sync at "OFF" or at "Fast-Sync" (depends on game, DCS prefers the latter for Scanline-Sync) in NVIDIA Control Panel.
No tearing and just as smooth (like butter).  

Edited December 28, 2022 by LucShep

[BuzzU]

That solves that decision. I run max video settings and I can't maintain 144fps. It hovers around 120fps but jumps around. I like the looks of it locked at 70fps because it never moves and looks just as good. Oh well.

I play a hunting game and had it locked at 100fps. I changed it to 144fps and it easily holds it but I see no difference. I'll leave it at 144fps because I know it's loafing. It gets 220fps unlocked.

[Pilotasso]

Another video, best monitors per category:

 

 

[SilentSierra]

21 minutes ago, Pilotasso said:

Another video, best monitors per category:

 

 

I stopped on 200USD. The best I can get is a AOC 27" 144Hz 1ms G Sync 27G2/BK

[Tiger-II]

On 12/25/2022 at 8:14 AM, okopanja said:

I gather that you are playing the games with not many pixel changes(mineweeper?). Which model do you use and which panel technology does it use?

 

I'm using a Samsung 40" 4K UHD LED TV. I see no screen tearing, and I didn't see any with my previous display, either, for the same reason.

[Lurker]

There seems to be a lot of conflicting (read PLAIN WRONG) information floating around in this thread. As long as you have a variable freesync enabled (or gsync capable) monitor and a graphics card that supports either of those two technologies then the higher the refresh rate the better. Even if you are not hitting the MAXIMUM AVAILABLE refresh rates of the monitor in question it won't matter as you will not experience screen tearing and you will achieve a fluid picture if you can maintain at least 60 FPS.  

What does affect your FPS rate is NOT THE REFRESH RATE OF THE MONITOR it is the number of pixels required to be drawn by the graphics card. Or in other words, the higher the RESOLUTION the more POWERFUL GRAPHICS CARD required. 

It really is that simple. 

Edited January 4, 2023 by Lurker

[BitMaster]

There are games and sims where imho you clearly see a difference, racing sims come to my mind at the #1 spot for that.

In DCS it really depends, if you like the Viggen at Mach 1 tree top level, fps counts more than anything, if you are flying a heli 60 is ok but you "feel" the better, smoother response at higher fps, with a Warthog at 20k feet scanning for targets you likely won't miss fps. 

Track-IR users tend to lock at 60 or 120 fps if they can get that high. 

When I fly DCS I lock it to 60 and my 1080ti can still hold the candle at my settings( she goes mostly 90% +load tho ), when my kids play minecraft, SpinTyres, FarmingSim et al = 60 ! ( saves a lot of Watts ! ), when I race the Nürburgring in ProjectCars2 it's full 144Hz/fps, full heat and wattage too.