Now that SINAI is out... how long for F15E ?

[Omega417]

2 hours ago, QuiGon said:

People get upset if devs remain silent and don't show anything of their module in advance, so they start declaring a project as dead. People also get upset if devs show off their stuff without releasing the product ASAP, assuming it must be ready for release if there are videos of it. Whatever the devs do, for some people it's always wrong. Damned if you do, damned if you don't

 

I think people are more frustrated when there is no clarity or time frame. A quarterly dev blog or update would go a log way to show what progress is being made. Or even just a list of "To-Dos" before release with occasional updates so people can get a sense that things are wrapping up and its getting close. But every seems to be posting "soon" and "Finish touches" for months on end. With no frame of reference to what "soon" or "finishing touches" actually mean the community is going to develop different expectations. The ones on the forums are the ones who are getting tired of waiting and came to find an answer, the ones who dont comment are the ones who are ok with waiting a few months longer.

[MIghtymoo]

12 hours ago, Wags said:

Dear all,

It was jointly decided between RAZBAM and EDSA leadership that the F-15E required additional time to test and address bugs identified by EDSA internal testing/Closed Beta Testing (CBT). Whilst we had an internal milestone goal, it was just that, a goal and that was never a public/official release date to move. The Sinai map release has had nothing to do with this matter.

We understand that many of you are very anxious to get your hands on it, particularly those that pre-ordered it. We and RAZBAM simply want to ensure that we deliver an F-15E that lives up to your high expectations. This truly will be the year of the F-15E, F-4E, Sinai map, and more.

Kind regards,

Wags

Let us just reread Wags quote. It is clearly stated there.

Nothing to start a conflict over...

[QuiGon]

16 minutes ago, Omega417 said:

I think people are more frustrated when there is no clarity or time frame. A quarterly dev blog or update would go a log way to show what progress is being made. Or even just a list of "To-Dos" before release with occasional updates so people can get a sense that things are wrapping up and its getting close. But every seems to be posting "soon" and "Finish touches" for months on end. With no frame of reference to what "soon" or "finishing touches" actually mean the community is going to develop different expectations. The ones on the forums are the ones who are getting tired of waiting and came to find an answer, the ones who dont comment are the ones who are ok with waiting a few months longer.

Now this is something I can very well relate to and is perfectly reasonable

What's not reasonable is, to make up all kind of wild assumptions and then, based on these assumptions, wanting to punish a third party dev studio (OnReTech), that has nothing to do with all of this.

Edited June 12, 2023 by QuiGon

[Silver_Dragon]

24 minutes ago, Omega417 said:

I think people are more frustrated when there is no clarity or time frame. A quarterly dev blog or update would go a log way to show what progress is being made. Or even just a list of "To-Dos" before release with occasional updates so people can get a sense that things are wrapping up and its getting close. But every seems to be posting "soon" and "Finish touches" for months on end. With no frame of reference to what "soon" or "finishing touches" actually mean the community is going to develop different expectations. The ones on the forums are the ones who are getting tired of waiting and came to find an answer, the ones who dont comment are the ones who are ok with waiting a few months longer.

What you propose, already happened in the past with ED, and other 3rd parties with detail news, planning and more... and some people started complaining about missing dates or "where is my module"... just look at the old newsletters and how this ended up time and time again in battling campaigns and "locking" information. This is nothing new and is cyclically repeated, no matter how well you try to do it.

[evilnate]

12 hours ago, Wags said:

Dear all,

It was jointly decided between RAZBAM and EDSA leadership that the F-15E required additional time to test and address bugs identified by EDSA internal testing/Closed Beta Testing (CBT). Whilst we had an internal milestone goal, it was just that, a goal and that was never a public/official release date to move. The Sinai map release has had nothing to do with this matter.

We understand that many of you are very anxious to get your hands on it, particularly those that pre-ordered it. We and RAZBAM simply want to ensure that we deliver an F-15E that lives up to your high expectations. This truly will be the year of the F-15E, F-4E, Sinai map, and more.

Kind regards,

Wags

Thanks for the clarification Matt. Circulating discord screens taken as official statements had us wondering.

[AhSoul]

I think part of the problem was Razbam saying in their discord that the delay was nothing to do with their module....

Which doesn't seem to tally with "It was jointly decided between RAZBAM and EDSA leadership that the F-15E required additional time to test and address bugs identified by EDSA internal testing/Closed Beta Testing (CBT)."

Maybe it was a technical issue on the DCS side, so the two things together needed more time to bake.....

Edit: this

Edited June 12, 2023 by AhSoul

[Omega417]

1 hour ago, Silver_Dragon said:

What you propose, already happened in the past with ED, and other 3rd parties with detail news, planning and more... and some people started complaining about missing dates or "where is my module"... just look at the old newsletters and how this ended up time and time again in battling campaigns and "locking" information. This is nothing new and is cyclically repeated, no matter how well you try to do it.

Hard dates are always hard to keep when they're set months out. I wasn't arguing for hard dates, I was arguing for quarterly status updates. Right now the only guaranteed source of news is the Friday news bulletin and its always a toss up on what information will be covered in that.

[vctpil]

Maybe the team have to deal with this problem : 

It also happen with the F-16. So, just be patient, should not be long before the release.

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

29 minutes ago, vctpil said:

 

just be patient, should not be long before the release.

 

This is the biggest take away.

Does anyone want the F-15E to turn out like the F-16 did on launch? No, you do not. Especially after the amount of time and effort Razbam has supposedly put into it, it needs to be a knock out day one. I'll be honest, I'm waiting on the Strike Eagle to see how it is on launch after previous purchases from Razbam. I want to see improvements and I'm pulling for them. If they need delays, they need delays, it's that simple.

[Beirut]

37 minutes ago, MiG21bisFishbedL said:

This is the biggest take away.

Does anyone want the F-15E to turn out like the F-16 did on launch? No, you do not. Especially after the amount of time and effort Razbam has supposedly put into it, it needs to be a knock out day one. I'll be honest, I'm waiting on the Strike Eagle to see how it is on launch after previous purchases from Razbam. I want to see improvements and I'm pulling for them. If they need delays, they need delays, it's that simple.

 

Fine, it comes out when it comes out. No complaints.

 

But if they can refrain from any parades, festivals, or fireworks when it does release that would be nice. Because the hype is officially in the ground next to Jimmy Hoffa; once seen, kinda remembered, and never to be found again.

[Silver_Dragon]

2 hours ago, Omega417 said:

Hard dates are always hard to keep when they're set months out. I wasn't arguing for hard dates, I was arguing for quarterly status updates. Right now the only guaranteed source of news is the Friday news bulletin and its always a toss up on what information will be covered in that.

Check the news... some years ago ED members start to put semanal status updates, after turn to months updates, and finally the "year plans" posts with some info the friday newsletter.

ED has many fronts opens with many teams and many personal and branches worldwide without a fixed studio and working online, that has not a 3rd party with dont have problems to put a Trello roadmap and update some weeks, has some very more big and dont expected a "manager" to recall all info for a friday or early mounth newsletter about "ED status news".

[Omega417]

What?

 

[Temetre]

vor 7 Stunden schrieb QuiGon:

People get upset if

Studio starts pre-order, hype cycle, and then delays.

Dont got a horse in the race, but imo thats the reason why HB gets very little heat for delays, but RB does. You add money into the equation, the fun stops.

Edited June 12, 2023 by Temetre

[NFG2012]

6 hours ago, munckmb said:

I think It is up to the developer to decide if a module is ready for release. Not the general public who sees some in game footage on YouTube. I would say delay it by another month to polish it even further just to mess with the entitled "I paid for the pre pre pre order" and want it NOW!

Personally I think people are entitled to be entitled on this one, there upset because someone has took there money, then delayed providing a product, for reasons wich quite frankly are as clear as mud

[munckmb]

37 minutes ago, NFG2012 said:

Personally I think people are entitled to be entitled on this one, there upset because someone has took there money, then delayed providing a product, for reasons wich quite frankly are as clear as mud

"It was jointly decided between RAZBAM and EDSA leadership that the F-15E required additional time to test and address bugs identified by EDSA internal testing/Closed Beta Testing (CBT). Whilst we had an internal milestone goal, it was just that, a goal and that was never a public/official release date to move." 

This is a pretty clear statement from Wags. You are not implying he talks mud right?

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

4 hours ago, Beirut said:

 

Fine, it comes out when it comes out. No complaints.

 

But if they can refrain from any parades, festivals, or fireworks when it does release that would be nice. Because the hype is officially in the ground next to Jimmy Hoffa; once seen, kinda remembered, and never to be found again.

I see what you're saying, but you chose to get hyped about it. I wouldn't be blaming a company for that particular disappointment.

[Beirut]

17 minutes ago, MiG21bisFishbedL said:

I see what you're saying, but you chose to get hyped about it. I wouldn't be blaming a company for that particular disappointment.

 

I'm not blaming anyone. I'm just saying the hype game has been played and has now fizzled.

[Kev2go]

6 hours ago, MiG21bisFishbedL said:

This is the biggest take away.

Does anyone want the F-15E to turn out like the F-16 did on launch? No, you do not. Especially after the amount of time and effort Razbam has supposedly put into it, it needs to be a knock out day one. I'll be honest, I'm waiting on the Strike Eagle to see how it is on launch after previous purchases from Razbam. I want to see improvements and I'm pulling for them. If they need delays, they need delays, it's that simple.

its already pretty evident from CC videos of the SE... it is already leagues ahead of what the F16 was on day 1.

Edited June 12, 2023 by Kev2go

[Pipe]

4 hours ago, NFG2012 said:

Personally I think people are entitled to be entitled on this one, there upset because someone has took there money, then delayed providing a product, for reasons wich quite frankly are as clear as mud

There was never a date offered, so was it actually delayed? Or was it just pushed back for more work to be done…

Anyone who feels they were duped, hopefully learned to hang on to their $$ next time

[pii]

2 hours ago, Kev2go said:

its already pretty evident from CC videos of the SE... it is already leagues ahead of what the F16 was on day 1.

 

The f-16 had just over a year of development before its release, if you didn't know it was going to be a cluster F$%k, with that small development time, you weren't paying attention, the f-15e has had considerably more time, so IMO it's an unfair comparison. 

[MiG21bisFishbedL]

33 minutes ago, pii said:

The f-16 had just over a year of development before its release, if you didn't know it was going to be a cluster F$%k, with that small development time, you weren't paying attention, the f-15e has had considerably more time, so IMO it's an unfair comparison. 

Well, when the asking price for the software is what it is, no such thing as an unfair comparison.

[MIghtymoo]

The F-15E will be here in….

 

 

[Atari800XL]

vor 12 Stunden schrieb Beirut:

Fine, it comes out when it comes out. No complaints.

Yes, my cite for this week

[Rosebud47]

Already regret spending good money for this again. Now the modules are bugged even before they get released into early access. 

No complaint for the graphic designers btw.

[AhSoul]

5 minutes ago, Rosebud47 said:

Already regret spending good money for this again. Now the modules are bugged even before they get released into early access. 

No complaint for the graphic designers btw.

You're surprised that software has bugs BEFORE it gets released?