Bucic Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 (edited) It's really weird. I don't recall another game porking skybox this much. I used to think people are just bad at video encoding (while watching DCS vids on youtube) but it's all there during actual gameplay. There's even an elipse of a certain color shade clearly visibe when you point the camera vertically up. Are there any plans to fix this? After the amazing clouds update this stands out like a sore thumb. https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318540-ugly-color-banding-on-objects-at-low-sun-conditions-ob-28235759/?do=findComment&comment=5138896 Edited July 19, 2023 by Bucic https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiob Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 I don't know exactly, what the video is supposed to show, but regarding the colour banding of the sky - yes that is a thing. I don't like it either. I'm not completely sure though, how much of it is on the graphics engine of DCS and how much on my settings.... If it is solved at some point, regardless of the cause, consider me happy! "Muß ich denn jedes Mal, wenn ich sauge oder saugblase den Schlauchstecker in die Schlauchnut schieben?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted July 19, 2023 Author Share Posted July 19, 2023 (edited) With changing camera angles the issue is even worse than what static screenshots could convey. And when some people use video bitrate on a bit more conservative side... Man, it looks like proper 90's https://youtu.be/gZKtah6-5yU?t=197 Edited July 19, 2023 by Bucic https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draconus Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 20 hours ago, Bucic said: it looks like proper 90's It is still modern gfx problem that needs smart programming, like anything else. https://loopit.dk/banding_in_games.pdf 1 2 Win10 i7-10700KF 32GB RTX3060 Rift S T16000M TWCS TFRP FC3 F-14A/B F-15E CA SC NTTR PG Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted July 20, 2023 Author Share Posted July 20, 2023 @draconus Dude! That's some good read! Also, my instinct frightens me I actually suspected gamma has to do something with it. Namely I thought (I was wrong) that banding occurs when you view something "intended to be viewed at much lower gamma." I also crawled DCS config and lua files for "sRGB". Found nothing. Maybe I'll try again with shader files. 2 https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted February 3 Author Share Posted February 3 @admin Requesting this to be moved to 2D video bugs. 1 https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YSIAD_RIP Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 (edited) I have not noticed the color banding problem recently in my DCS setup. However; now that I read this post I am sure I will start seeing it. Does DCS Graphics Engine take advantage of 10 bit colour? (I currently have my display Colour Depth set at 10 bpc - default was 8 bpc. There are some other discussions that mention Reshade.me Deband.fx and other fx shaders have helping others. Gama, brightness and other monitor settings can certainly make banding look very noticeable and even worse at night. @draconus - great link you provided above! Thanks Edited February 3 by YSIAD_RIP Do not own: | F-15E | JF-17 | Fw 190 A-8 | Bf 109 | Hardware: [ - Ryzen7-5800X - 32GB - RX 6800 - X56 HOTAS Throttle - WINWING Orion 2 F16EX Grip - TrackIR 5 - Tobii 5C - JetPad FSE - ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted February 3 Author Share Posted February 3 35 minutes ago, YSIAD_RIP said: I have not noticed the color banding problem recently in my DCS setup. However; now that I read this post I am sure I will start seeing it. Does DCS Graphics Engine take advantage of 10 bit colour? (I currently have my display Colour Depth set at 10 bpc - default was 8 bpc. There are some other discussions that mention Reshade.me Deband.fx and other fx shaders have helping others. Gama, brightness and other monitor settings can certainly make banding look very noticeable and even worse at night. @draconus - great link you provided above! Thanks There are 10 year old games that have no banding issues. Reshade is duct tape hacking. 10 bpc is like multicore support in 2005. Yeti stuff. 1 https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Insonia Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 (edited) 1 hour ago, YSIAD_RIP said: Does DCS Graphics Engine take advantage of 10 bit colour? (I currently have my display Colour Depth set at 10 bpc - default was 8 bpc. No, just 8 bits of "depth" per color. The Desktop Window Manager (DWM) restricted windowed apps to output content at only 8 bits per color channel, even if the display supported a higher bit depth. To output 10 bpc/30bits , the software must use specific APIs (directX games also must work under exclusive fullscreen) and is very difficult to implement because the Windows color system is a total disaster. Aside from production software like PS, almost no sane person bothers to support such things. Only 1 game I know natively supports 10 bpc is alien isolation. Quote here are 10 year old games that have no banding issues. It can never fundamentally resolve the banding problem. Those are "working around" solutions through shaders and artistic "tricks," called "dithering," an optical illusion that breaks up the posterization and blends them together. IT just "hacks" that worked well enough. but both(provide 10bpc support or good dithering algorithm) required efforts that they probably do not really want to. Edited February 3 by Insonia 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted February 3 Author Share Posted February 3 48 minutes ago, Insonia said: No, just 8 bits of "depth" per color. The Desktop Window Manager (DWM) restricted windowed apps to output content at only 8 bits per color channel, even if the display supported a higher bit depth. To output 10 bpc/30bits , the software must use specific APIs (directX games also must work under exclusive fullscreen) and is very difficult to implement because the Windows color system is a total disaster. Aside from production software like PS, almost no sane person bothers to support such things. Only 1 game I know natively supports 10 bpc is alien isolation. It can never fundamentally resolve the banding problem. Those are "working around" solutions through shaders and artistic "tricks," called "dithering," an optical illusion that breaks up the posterization and blends them together. IT just "hacks" that worked well enough. but both(provide 10bpc support or good dithering algorithm) required efforts that they probably do not really want to. Obviously I didn't mean the devs of the old games solved the problem completely and forgot to pick up their Nobel prizes in mathematics. I meant banding was not visible. In DCS it looks attrocious. 2 https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiob Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 2 hours ago, Bucic said: There are 10 year old games that have no banding issues. Reshade is duct tape hacking. 10 bpc is like multicore support in 2005. Yeti stuff. True. Reshade is just a workaround fix. However, depending on how annoying banding is for you, the deband filter of reshade is a relief and does a rather decent job, given you tune it properly. 1 "Muß ich denn jedes Mal, wenn ich sauge oder saugblase den Schlauchstecker in die Schlauchnut schieben?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 15 hours ago, Hiob said: True. Reshade is just a workaround fix. However, depending on how annoying banding is for you, the deband filter of reshade is a relief and does a rather decent job, given you tune it properly. Is there a "do not @#%g touch a bit of image unless explicitly slidered to do so for a specific effect" preset in ReShade? To me ReShade is "the spinners of gaming" and I can't say I'm really open to change my mind 1 https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiob Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 59 minutes ago, Bucic said: Is there a "do not @#%g touch a bit of image unless explicitly slidered to do so for a specific effect" preset in ReShade? To me ReShade is "the spinners of gaming" and I can't say I'm really open to change my mind Ok, if being closed-minded worked out for you in the past - be my guest. I like reshade and it serves me well. 1 "Muß ich denn jedes Mal, wenn ich sauge oder saugblase den Schlauchstecker in die Schlauchnut schieben?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 I didn't say I won't try it https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted February 8 Author Share Posted February 8 (edited) https://blog.frost.kiwi/GLSL-noise-and-radial-gradient/ Debanding section. I might be one of those guilty confusing Reshade with SweetFX... I'm going to try it one day for sure but the problem is there for ED to deal with. In what essentially is a sky game Edited February 8 by Bucic https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucic Posted February 26 Author Share Posted February 26 (edited) The novideo_srgb tool required on wide color gamut monitors to clamp the color space to what games use has dithering settings built in. Just for information - there's a possible alternative to Reshade deband. Bad news - it doesn't seem to work on DCS's heavy banding. More info https://github.com/ledoge/novideo_srgb/issues/21 https://github.com/ledoge/novideo_srgb On to test the Reshade deband. For reference, some DCS-ers have posted their settings here https://forum.dcs.world/topic/310469-color-banding-night-sky-and-sea/page/2/ Edited February 26 by Bucic https://akaagar.github.io/briefing-room-for-dcs/ F-5E simpit project https://forum.dcs.world/topic/318106-f-5e-simpit-cockpit-dimensions-and-flight-controls/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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